Is Kurdistan rising from the ashes of Iraq and Syria?

[browsing deer]

Kurdistan is de facto a small state up against Turkey, much to Turkey's dismay. The largest chunk of kurdish irredentism is in Turkey.

Putin doesn't care what happens with Kurdistan. It isn't what he wants in the area. Israel actively wants an independent Kurdistan. Iraq is sort of inured to the the idea. I would imagine they are tired of fractious minorities, and Kurdistan in on the opposite side of ISIS controlled areas.

When ISIS is finally smashed, when some semblance of peace returns to Syria and Iraq, will there be another new state in the region?

 

[waltky]

Kurds gettin' pressure from Iraq, Turkey...

Iraqi PM calls on Kurds to nullify referendum vote
Thu, Sep 28, 2017 - Iraqi Prime Minister Haider al-Abadi yesterday demanded that Kurdish authorities “cancel” the outcome of the independence referendum in northern Iraq, as a condition for dialogue to resolve an escalating crisis.

In a speech to parliament, Abadi renewed his ultimatum to Kurdistan Regional Government (KRG) President Masoud Barzani to hand over control of international airports by tomorrow or face a ban on direct international flights to the Kurdish region. People in northern Iraq voted overwhelmingly in favor of independence in Monday’s non-binding referendum. Any idea of secession is bitterly opposed by the governments in Baghdad, Turkey and Iran. The US pressed Kurdish leaders to call off the poll. “We won’t have a dialogue about the referendum outcome,” Abadi told parliament. “If they want to start talks, they must cancel the referendum and its outcome.”

His demand was rejected by KRG Transport Minister Mowlud Murad, who told a news conference in the Kurdish capital, Erbil, that keeping control of airports and maintaining direct international flights to Erbil was necessary for the fight against Islamic State militants. Kurdish leaders say the referendum was held to give them a mandate to negotiate the peaceful secession of their region with Baghdad and Iraq’s powerful neighbors Iran and Turkey. Murad expressed the hope that the crisis could be resolved by tomorrow, saying it would damage Kurdistan’s economy.

Kurds celebrate to show their support for the independence referendum in Duhok, Iraq, on Tuesday.​

The Iraqi Civil Aviation Authority yesterday sent a notice to foreign airlines telling them international flights to Erbil and Sulaimaniya in the Kurdish region would be suspended tomorrow at 3pm and only domestic flights allowed. The Iraqi parliament also asked al-Abadi to send troops to the Kurdish-held region of Kirkuk and take control of its oilfields. Kurdish Pehsmerga fighters took control of Kirkuk, a multiethnic region, in 2014 when the Iraqi army fled in the face of Islamic State militants who overran about a third of Iraq.

The Kurdish move prevented the oilfields from falling into the militants’ hands. The area, historically claimed by the Kurds, is also home to Turkmen and Arab communities. The KRG included it in the independence referendum held on Monday. “The government has to bring back the oilfields of Kirkuk under the control of the oil ministry,” said the resolution voted by parliament in Baghdad, seen by Reuters.

It called on al-Abadi to “issue orders for the security forces to deploy in the disputed areas, including Kirkuk.” KRG authorities put the turnout for the independence referendum at more than 70 percent, but many voters reported irregularities, including cases of individuals voting multiple times and without proper registration. Official results were expected to be released yesterday.

Iraqi PM calls on Kurds to nullify referendum vote - Taipei Times

See also:

Iraq, Turkey Move to Punish Kurdistan for Referendum Vote
September 28, 2017 - Even as Kurds celebrated the overwhelming approval of an independence referendum, Iraq took actions to punish the would-be breakaway state, vowing to shut down its airspace and join Turkey in holding military exercises.

Calling the vote “unconstitutional,” Iraq’s parliament Wednesday also asked Prime Minister Haider al-Abadi to send troops to the oil-producing, Kurdish-held region of Kirkuk and take control of its lucrative oil fields. It told the 34 countries that have diplomatic missions in Kurdistan to shut them down and urged Abadi to enforce a decision to fire Kirkuk Gov. Najmaldin Karim for holding the vote, and deploy forces to areas that were under Iraqi government control before the fall of Mosul to Islamic State over three years ago. “We will enforce federal authority in the Kurdistan region, and we already have starting doing that,” Abadi said.

The prime minister’s office said he spoke Thursday by phone with his Turkish counterpart Binali Yildirim, who said Turkey supports all measures taken by the Iraqi government to preserve the country’s unity, including dealing only with the Baghdad government on oil exports. The referendum isn't binding, but it is the first step in a process that clearly leads in that direction, despite strong criticism from Iraq, its neighbors — particularly Iran and Turkey — and the United States. These nations have described it as destabilizing at a time when all sides are still fighting against IS militants.

A boy rides a bicycle with the flag of Kurdistan in Tuz Khurmato, Iraq​

Turkish troops are conducting military exercises at the Iraqi border, and Iraqi soldiers joined in four kilometers from the Habur border gate between the two countries. National and international media observed the exercises from the main highway leading to the border gate. Turkey, which has its own restive Kurdish minority, is particularly concerned about the independence movement sweeping into its territory. President Recep Tayyip Erdogan has warned that all military and economic measures are on the table against the Kurdistan Regional Government (KRG), calling the decision to go ahead with the vote a “betrayal to Turkey.”

Foreign Minister Mevlut Cavusoglu said Omer Merani, the Ankara representative of Iraqi Kurdish leader Masoud Barzani's Kurdistan Democratic Party, has been asked to not return to Turkey. “If the KDP's representative were here, we would ask him to leave the country,” Cavusoglu said. “We have instead said, ‘Don't come back,' because he is currently in Irbil.” The Kurds, who have ruled over an autonomous region within Iraq since the 2003 U.S.-led invasion that toppled Saddam Hussein, consider Monday's referendum to be a historic step in a generations-old quest for a state of their own. It was approved by 92.7 percent of voters, and residents headed to Kirkuk's citadel to celebrate late Wednesday after the results were released.

MORE

 

[Eugene]

Iraq's Kurds wish to get their own state. And their territories in Iraq have 65% of all Iraq's oil.

Syrian Kurds never fought for independence, they had own autonomy and felt well.

Turkish Kurds fought for getting their own autonomy in Turkey and their fight was a real war.

There are also Iranian Kurds.

Looks like they have different aims. They have different ideology but they are ready to support each other if any aggression happens.
I greatly doubt Kurds have chance for getting independence in Syria Assad will not allow. But I am sure Putin would suggest him to have wide autonomy.
In Iraq Kurds will most likely to get their own state. Iraq doesn't like it but the USA will not help Iraq in this question. A kind of payment for what Kurds did in Syria. But I greatly doubt USA will be friends to Peshmerga... Russia will wisely wait and look how the situation turns.
Turkey is mad angry about US helping Kurds. They see a lot of American weapon pointed against Turkish in Turkey-Syria border regions.

So that Kurds question is highly complicated.

 

[irosie91]

Iraq's Kurds wish to get their own state. And their territories in Iraq have 65% of all Iraq's oil.

Syrian Kurds never fought for independence, they had own autonomy and felt well.

Turkish Kurds fought for getting their own autonomy in Turkey and their fight was a real war.

There are also Iranian Kurds.

Looks like they have different aims. They have different ideology but they are ready to support each other if any aggression happens.
I greatly doubt Kurds have chance for getting independence in Syria Assad will not allow. But I am sure Putin would suggest him to have wide autonomy.
In Iraq Kurds will most likely to get their own state. Iraq doesn't like it but the USA will not help Iraq in this question. A kind of payment for what Kurds did in Syria. But I greatly doubt USA will be friends to Peshmerga... Russia will wisely wait and look how the situation turns.
Turkey is mad angry about US helping Kurds. They see a lot of American weapon pointed against Turkish in Turkey-Syria border regions.

So that Kurds question is highly complicated.

yes----and the complicated problem includes RUSSIAN
input------Russia has been MOSTLY EQUIVOCAL about
kurds for decades------(probably centuries)

 

[Eugene]

Iraq's Kurds wish to get their own state. And their territories in Iraq have 65% of all Iraq's oil.

Syrian Kurds never fought for independence, they had own autonomy and felt well.

Turkish Kurds fought for getting their own autonomy in Turkey and their fight was a real war.

There are also Iranian Kurds.

Looks like they have different aims. They have different ideology but they are ready to support each other if any aggression happens.
I greatly doubt Kurds have chance for getting independence in Syria Assad will not allow. But I am sure Putin would suggest him to have wide autonomy.
In Iraq Kurds will most likely to get their own state. Iraq doesn't like it but the USA will not help Iraq in this question. A kind of payment for what Kurds did in Syria. But I greatly doubt USA will be friends to Peshmerga... Russia will wisely wait and look how the situation turns.
Turkey is mad angry about US helping Kurds. They see a lot of American weapon pointed against Turkish in Turkey-Syria border regions.

So that Kurds question is highly complicated.

yes----and the complicated problem includes RUSSIAN
input------Russia has been MOSTLY EQUIVOCAL about
kurds for decades------(probably centuries)

At least Russia never supported terrorists like the USA often do. And Russia never created terroristic organizations like Taliban, Alqaida, ISIS, etc.

 

[irosie91]

Iraq's Kurds wish to get their own state. And their territories in Iraq have 65% of all Iraq's oil.

Syrian Kurds never fought for independence, they had own autonomy and felt well.

Turkish Kurds fought for getting their own autonomy in Turkey and their fight was a real war.

There are also Iranian Kurds.

Looks like they have different aims. They have different ideology but they are ready to support each other if any aggression happens.
I greatly doubt Kurds have chance for getting independence in Syria Assad will not allow. But I am sure Putin would suggest him to have wide autonomy.
In Iraq Kurds will most likely to get their own state. Iraq doesn't like it but the USA will not help Iraq in this question. A kind of payment for what Kurds did in Syria. But I greatly doubt USA will be friends to Peshmerga... Russia will wisely wait and look how the situation turns.
Turkey is mad angry about US helping Kurds. They see a lot of American weapon pointed against Turkish in Turkey-Syria border regions.

So that Kurds question is highly complicated.

yes----and the complicated problem includes RUSSIAN
input------Russia has been MOSTLY EQUIVOCAL about
kurds for decades------(probably centuries)

At least Russia never supported terrorists like the USA often do. And Russia never created terroristic organizations like Taliban, Alqaida, ISIS, etc.

stalin told you in your dreams

 

[frigidweirdo]

Kurdistan is de facto a small state up against Turkey, much to Turkey's dismay. The largest chunk of kurdish irredentism is in Turkey.

Putin doesn't care what happens with Kurdistan. It isn't what he wants in the area. Israel actively wants an independent Kurdistan. Iraq is sort of inured to the the idea. I would imagine they are tired of fractious minorities, and Kurdistan in on the opposite side of ISIS controlled areas.

When ISIS is finally smashed, when some semblance of peace returns to Syria and Iraq, will there be another new state in the region?

The Kurds should never have been made a part of Iraq, this is what happens when you get superpowers coming in and not understanding the situation on the ground.

At the same time the Kurds were part of the Armenian genocide which Turkey and Israel say didn't happen.

 

[irosie91]

Kurdistan is de facto a small state up against Turkey, much to Turkey's dismay. The largest chunk of kurdish irredentism is in Turkey.

Putin doesn't care what happens with Kurdistan. It isn't what he wants in the area. Israel actively wants an independent Kurdistan. Iraq is sort of inured to the the idea. I would imagine they are tired of fractious minorities, and Kurdistan in on the opposite side of ISIS controlled areas.

When ISIS is finally smashed, when some semblance of peace returns to Syria and Iraq, will there be another new state in the region?

The Kurds should never have been made a part of Iraq, this is what happens when you get superpowers coming in and not understanding the situation on the ground.

At the same time the Kurds were part of the Armenian genocide which Turkey and Israel say didn't happen.

Israel did not deny the reality of the muslim genocide of Armenians of 1915------why do you lie?

 

[cnm]

Israel did not deny the reality of the muslim genocide of Armenians of 1915------why do you lie?

I'm curious. Were the Armenians not Muslim?

 

[irosie91]

Israel did not deny the reality of the muslim genocide of Armenians of 1915------why do you lie?

I'm curious. Were the Armenians not Muslim?

some are----the murder victims were the Christian Armenians. It is of interest to me that so few people
know about this genocide-----my mom told me about it
when I was about 8. Historically----ADOLF HITLER liked
it because the turks did it AND NO ONE CARED---the world yawned------he cited that fact when planning a genocide on jews-------confident that he could easily get
away with it. Christian Armenians----are, I believe---of the
eastern orthodox sect of Christianity. We got Armenian
Christians in the USA

 

[Eugene]

...and again it was Russian Empire who opened border to let armenians come and save their lives. And it was the USSR where they got their own state.

 

[irosie91]

...and again it was Russian Empire who opened border to let armenians come and save their lives. And it was the USSR where they got their own state.

Armenia was not "saved" by Russia from anything-----inclusion of Armenia in the GLORIOUS USSR was, simply a manifestation of Russian Imperialism-------as far
as I know----there is absolutely no "LETS JOIN RUSSIA"
sentiment amongst the Armenians

 

[Eugene]

irosie91 as usually a lot of bs, twisted info and lies.

Orthodox sect... Orthodox comes from Eastern Rome Christianity, not sect. It is more Christian than baptist for example.

Most of armenians escaped Turkey for Russian Empire. Governor Peshkov, general Yudenich played important role in their protection.

Only in the USSR armenians got their own state and possibility to live calm in peace since 10 century. They had own territory with national language, culture... it was the time when Armenia became modern developed country with highly educated population.
One may like it or not but noone can deny this fact.

 

[irosie91]

irosie91 as usually a lot of bs, twisted info and lies.

Orthodox sect... Orthodox comes from Eastern Rome Christianity, not sect. It is more Christian than baptist for example.

Most of armenians escaped Turkey for Russian Empire. Governor Peshkov, general Yudenich played important role in their protection.

Only in the USSR armenians got their own state and possibility to live calm in peace since 10 century. They had own territory with national language, culture... it was the time when Armenia became modern developed country with highly educated population.
One may like it or not but noone can deny this fact.

the Armenian genocide carried out by the turks in 1915 had
nothing to do with Armenians in RUSSIA-----the Armenians so treated were living in the OTTOMAN
EMPIRE. Armenian Christianity is, indeed, a sect of
Christianity (perhaps your English is off) . ARMENIA
as a country became incorporated into the USSR as a
manifestation of Russian imperialism. Today---Armenians in Armenia have no interest in JOINING PUTIN's EMPIRE

 

[Eugene]

Armenian genocide took place from 1890 till 1915.
While ww1 Russian army saved a lot if armenians.
Question of joining someone to Russian Federation doesn't exist. But Armenia today is member of Eurasian Union and it is also a member of military union.

Maybe my English is not good enough but the term 'sect' is not what I am ready to use for normal religion. Well if there are catholic sect, protestant sect and so on than I am ready to accept it.
Orthodox is absolutely usual, legal and very old branch of Christianity not sect.

 

[cnm]

the turks did it

That's better.