is it u.s. of america or u.s. of atheists?

[jillian]

1) The Constitution is in place to limit what the government does to the people. Therefore the First Amendment limits the government from establishing a mandated State or Federal Religion but has nothing to do with limiting government from imposing restrictions on itself. The founding fathers saw the example of a morally corrupt Rome and realized that a Christian government would have a greater chance of moral restraint from tyranny but also noted that a federal government with to much power would not be a good idea. Thus they left it up to the states to draft more specific constitutions with the limitations they saw fit. Again these constitutions though requiring government to recognize the Christian God were still in agreement with the First Amendment since they did not establish a mandated government on the people. If you knew your history of why the Founding Fathers came to America you would know why the Constitution says what it says, but since you do not know your history you are perfectly clueless.[/font][/color]

2) Planned Parenthood gets over $100 million dollars annually to kill babies so quit being ignorant mmmmkay? And yes it is a purly religious debate. That's what this whole friggin thread was about in case you weren't paying attention.

3) Yes it does. Religious Gays trying to destroy the sanctity of "marriage."

4) How bout this, if you can't stand hearing someone pray to themselves during their lunch break, mind your own business. And can you please provide me an instance where someone got thrown in jail for not attending church while in the army? How about if you are so offended by it you don't join?

1. The establishment clause seems to be clear in that no religion should dictate public policy. "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion." That extends far beyond the government merely establishing a official state religion. Yeah, many of the bill of rights protections, including the first amendments establishment clause, were not applied to the states until the 14th Amendment and then the idea of complete incorporation in the early to mid twentieth century. At this point those constitutions became unconstitutional and rightfully so. And alot of people came to america for religious freedom so long as you believed and practiced religion as they did... Puritans and many other such early american settlers were not in favor of diversity of religion.

2. We live in a secular democracy so religion shouldnt realy matter in public policy debate. Laws are made pursuant to the constitution not the bible. Our government isnt a christian government at all.

3. Heteroxeual christians have already done their part and helped to destroy the "sancity of marriage." And marriage isnt exclusive to or originally christian. So christians do not have a monopoly on the word or concept of marriage.

1) Where do you find the words Congress shall not restrict government from being Christian?

1) What does that have to do with point number 2 at all?

3) It is exclusively heterosexual. Um... What is that thingy (also known as a person) that conducts the ceremony? No ... no ... definitly not Christian.

1. congress isn't allowed to make laws with respect to religion. that includes Christianity... that means they aren't ALLOWED to create a national religion.

2. It has to do with things because we don't live in a theocracy...

3. No one "christian" performed MY wedding ceremony... and marriage is about property rights with the right to perform a marriage granted by the state. If someone chooses to have a religious ceremony (as I did, but not YOUR religion) that's their business. And whether a religious institution performs such a ceremony for a gay couple is up to them. But those "religious" determinations have no bearing on state action.

 

[THE LIGHT]

1. The establishment clause seems to be clear in that no religion should dictate public policy. "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion." That extends far beyond the government merely establishing a official state religion. Yeah, many of the bill of rights protections, including the first amendments establishment clause, were not applied to the states until the 14th Amendment and then the idea of complete incorporation in the early to mid twentieth century. At this point those constitutions became unconstitutional and rightfully so. And alot of people came to america for religious freedom so long as you believed and practiced religion as they did... Puritans and many other such early american settlers were not in favor of diversity of religion.

2. We live in a secular democracy so religion shouldnt realy matter in public policy debate. Laws are made pursuant to the constitution not the bible. Our government isnt a christian government at all.

3. Heteroxeual christians have already done their part and helped to destroy the "sancity of marriage." And marriage isnt exclusive to or originally christian. So christians do not have a monopoly on the word or concept of marriage.

1) Where do you find the words Congress shall not restrict government from being Christian?

1) What does that have to do with point number 2 at all?

3) It is exclusively heterosexual. Um... What is that thingy (also known as a person) that conducts the ceremony? No ... no ... definitly not Christian.

1. congress isn't allowed to make laws with respect to religion. that includes Christianity... that means they aren't ALLOWED to create a national religion.

2. It has to do with things because we don't live in a theocracy...

3. No one "christian" performed MY wedding ceremony... and marriage is about property rights with the right to perform a marriage granted by the state. If someone chooses to have a religious ceremony (as I did, but not YOUR religion) that's their business. And whether a religious institution performs such a ceremony for a gay couple is up to them. But those "religious" determinations have no bearing on state action.

2) what does a theocracy have to do with giving money for abortion? And no, we are not a theocracy. We are (or were) a Christian Nation.

 

[JBeukema]

when did it change to we the atheist? what happened to majority rules.

(emphasis added)

You're a fucking moron who needs to read up on civics and American history

 

[JBeukema]

when did it change to we the atheist? what happened to majority rules.

Wake me up when we elect an athiest President.

one that's open and honest about the fact...

 

[JakeStarkey]

I doubt very much the atheist soldier is being atheist when the rockets are coming in and charlie is at the wire. I don't say this too much, but, froggy, you are a moron.

 

[rdean]

It's the United States of America.

There is no "God" in America.

It's just, "The United States of America".

Keep your occult fantasies to yourself.

 

[John Lemmon]

It's the United States of America.

There is no "God" in America.

It's just, "The United States of America".

Keep your occult fantasies to yourself.

"I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

 

[JBeukema]

It's the United States of America.

There is no "God" in America.

It's just, "The United States of America".

Keep your occult fantasies to yourself.

"I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

The Pledge of Allegiance - A Short History

Those two words were added by reactionary social authoritarians. If congress voted on its adoption, then it is unconstitutional per the First Amendment

 

[Polk]

when did it change to we the atheist? what happened to majority rules.

Last time I checked, it was "We the people", not "We the Christians".

 

[John Lemmon]

It's the United States of America.

There is no "God" in America.

It's just, "The United States of America".

Keep your occult fantasies to yourself.

"I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

The Pledge of Allegiance - A Short History

Those two words were added by reactionary social authoritarians. If congress voted on its adoption, then it is unconstitutional per the First Amendment

It's still there regardless.

JB, what did you get banned for this time?

 

[THE LIGHT]

when did it change to we the atheist? what happened to majority rules.

Wake me up when we elect an athiest President.

one that's open and honest about the fact...

Good point. We haven't had an open and honest athiest. I don't think one exists.

 

[THE LIGHT]

It's the United States of America.

There is no "God" in America.

It's just, "The United States of America".

Keep your occult fantasies to yourself.

IN GOD WE TRUST

“Proclaim LIBERTY throughout all the Land unto all the Inhabitants thereof Lev. XXV X
By Order of the ASSEMBLY of the Province of PENSYLVANIA for the State House in Philada
Pass and Stow
Philada
MDCCLIII
”

Benjamin Franklin's proposed seal for the United States of America. And he was on of the least religeous ones.

Laus Deo
Latin for "Praise Be To God"
The Inscription on the Washington Monument in Washington DC

​

Yep, we swear to God in court to tell the truth​

 

[JakeStarkey]

You can pray whenever you want in government support places as long as (1) you don't disrupt business as usual, and (2) you are not coercing the folks around you with said prayer.

Froggy, if you have no legitimate complaint.

 

[JBeukema]

"I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

The Pledge of Allegiance - A Short History

Those two words were added by reactionary social authoritarians. If congress voted on its adoption, then it is unconstitutional per the First Amendment

It's still there regardless.

JB, what did you get banned for this time?

Asking another user to discuss moderator actions

 

[JBeukema]

when did it change to we the atheist? what happened to majority rules.

Last time I checked, it was "We the people", not "We the Christians".

Anyone ever notice the font size and caps changes in the original document when it says 'united States of America'

 

[JBeukema]

Yep, we swear to God in court to tell the truth​

Maybe you do. I don't. I told them it was their fairy tale and not mine.

My oath shall stand or fall and the merit of my word detemined by my character, not by some readers' digest rehash of the Sumerian mythologies.

 

[THE LIGHT]

Yep, we swear to God in court to tell the truth​

Maybe you do. I don't. I told them it was their fairy tale and not mine.

My oath shall stand or fall and the merit of my word detemined by my character, not by some readers' digest rehash of the Sumerian mythologies.

You may define your own morals and codes of conduct but that doesn't negate the historical facts of this countries heritage.

 

[JBeukema]

Yep, we swear to God in court to tell the truth​

Maybe you do. I don't. I told them it was their fairy tale and not mine.

My oath shall stand or fall and the merit of my word detemined by my character, not by some readers' digest rehash of the Sumerian mythologies.

You may define your own morals and codes of conduct but that doesn't negate the historical facts of this countries heritage.

You mean the heritage of deists specifically setting up a secular nation and keeping the State and the churches separate because the theists couldn't trust eachother?

What does the very first amendment to the Constitution say again?

 

[THE LIGHT]

Maybe you do. I don't. I told them it was their fairy tale and not mine.

My oath shall stand or fall and the merit of my word detemined by my character, not by some readers' digest rehash of the Sumerian mythologies.

You may define your own morals and codes of conduct but that doesn't negate the historical facts of this countries heritage.

You mean the heritage of deists specifically setting up a secular nation and keeping the State and the churches separate because the theists couldn't trust eachother?

What does the very first amendment to the Constitution say again?

mmm.... what what does the first sentance of each of the first three paragraphs of the Mayflower Compact say?

 

[JBeukema]

Which of the first three paragraphs of the Mayflower Compact say?

Doesn't matter; TMC is not a legally binding document and did not influence American civics in any major way. You might as well ask what Martin Luther had to say about the Jews