CDZ Is it possible to circumvent political hero worship?

Discussion in 'Clean Debate Zone' started by jwoodie, Aug 26, 2018.

  1. jwoodie
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    jwoodie Gold Member Supporting Member

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    Of course some of it is situationally convenient (e.g., eulogizing McCain because of his opposition to Trump), but the larger issue of worshiping one candidate while demonizing another candidate is an increasingly dangerous trend in American politics. I fear we are heading towards a coup by one side or the other.

    What say you?
     
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  2. DGS49
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    DGS49 Gold Member

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    I don't know of any politicians who are "worshipped" or even held in very high esteem.

    There are a few who are conspicuously ethical, but few take notice.

    Even Trump's most ardent supporters don't claim he is "good," or "brilliant," or personally exemplary. We just like what he is doing. Bernie Sanders seems to get a lot of personal admiration, but that is from idiots who have never had a job. And I don't think they are dangerous.
     
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  3. pismoe
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    pismoe Gold Member

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    DANGEROUS TREND in America . Is it off topic for me to say that i think that the most worrisome trend are Government men and official , authorities [same as kings men of old] that perform DAY to Day Government functions in the USA Society . ------------------- if off topic i apologize .
     
  4. Toronado3800
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    Toronado3800 VIP Member

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    This is one heck of a problem. I will include team worship in it also.
     
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  5. MarathonMike
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    MarathonMike Platinum Member

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    The two party system we have is the fundamental problem. We have essentially turned politics into team sports only it's worse because the consequences of losing are far more insidious (at least in your mind) than losing a game. I don't see a coup coming, overall we are too comfortable in America to do anything rash.

    I think Obama might be the only candidate in recent history that approached 'worship' status by at least some of his followers. But in terms of demonization, we need look no further than President Trump for the prime example. And yes that is very unhealthy for the country.
     
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  6. Toronado3800
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    Toronado3800 VIP Member

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    I don't disagree about Trump at all.

    Let me be the first to say I think Trump is childish and generally don't like him BUT he did great meeting with North Korea and I like tariffs.
     
  7. oldsoul
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    oldsoul Gold Member

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    While I agree that it is a serious flaw in current politics, I think it goes beyond that. It would seem to me that the "two party system worked for quite a while. Sure, there were bumps in the road, some pot holes too (ok some were mountains, while others were sinkholes, LOL), but we navigated it ok as a country. Where we seem to have gone off the rails here is with "Postmodernism".
    From Wiki: "While encompassing a wide variety of approaches, postmodernism is generally defined by an attitude of skepticism, irony, or rejection toward the meta-narratives and ideologies of modernism, often calling into question various assumptions of Enlightenment rationality.[5] Consequently, common targets of postmodern critique include universalist notions of objective reality, morality, truth, human nature, reason, language, and social progress.[5] Postmodern thinkers frequently call attention to the contingent or socially-conditioned nature of knowledge claims and value systems, situating them as products of particular political, historical, or cultural discourses and hierarchies.[5] Accordingly, postmodern thought is broadly characterized by tendencies to self-referentiality, epistemological and moral relativism, pluralism, subjectivism, and irreverence."
    A general summary that I believe is pretty accurate. Notice the part about calling into question objective reality? That is the at the core. There is no reality other than that which I experience. Your reality is irrelevant to me because it is not mine. Hence 2+2 can, indeed, equal something other than 4, if I can explain it. Further, my explanation need not be rational, as objective rationality is also called into question.
    See the problem here? I'll spell it out for those who do not.
    Nothing is real, nothing I say needs to make sense to anyone but me, morality is relative, human nature is a social construct, and I don't need to have a rationale for my position on a given topic. How can we base a society on THAT? Simple, we can't. That is the point. Chaos, anarchy, mob rule, and a complete departure from all aspects of "western" social norms.

    As a country, we can, as history has shown, survive (and even thrive) under a "two party system" of governance. We cannot, by definition (and design) survive, let alone thrive, under Postmodernism, as it relates to politics, and philosophy.

    That, in a nutshell, is where we are at right now. A fork in the road, if you will. We must, as a society, choose between the status quo (or something similar to it), and Postmodernism. Will we survive as a country, or devolve into chaos?

    The only question each of us have to answer for ourselves is:

    Will you go over the cliff with the rest of humanity, or will you be one of those trying to convince others to stop before it's too late?
     
  8. jwoodie
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    jwoodie Gold Member Supporting Member

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    :lastword:
     
  9. candycorn
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    candycorn Alis volat propriis

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    McCain isn’t being worshiped. He is being remembered because he didn’t toe the party line as often as many of his contemporaries are. You remember the exceptions; not the rule. I didn’t always or even often agree with McCain but I did respect him. I did agree with him about nuclear power; we’ve had ships at sea running on Nuke power for something like 40 years and the safety rate is to say the very least; exceptional. We could duplicate that on land and solve some large energy challenges but liberals who won’t even hear the argument (primarily liberals) are standing in the way.

    At any rate; he’s not being worshiped. His feud with the blob is causing him to get outsized headlines; that much is true.
     
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  10. Mac1958
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    Mac1958 Diamond Member

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    The divisions in this country are real, profound and increasing. They're so bad at this point that yeah, I have no doubt that if one "side" had the ability to complete a coup it would probably try. That's how far we've fallen.

    There is now even evidence that our divisions are so deep that they have an effect on the economy: Partisanship’s a Helluva Drug — And It’s Reshaping the Economy

    The worst part of this is that we're choosing to behave this way. Those who have a vested professional interest in keeping us angry and divided are winning, and that's because we're choosing to hand the victory to them. This is a self-inflicted wound.
    .
     
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    Last edited: Aug 28, 2018

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