Is in vitro fertilization murder?

[AllieBaba]

I think society gets to decide, poor misguided fool. Majority rules. We decide what is legal and illegal. That means we define murder.

I don't know what your blather about your religion is all about, but I do know that if the majority conceded, we could outlaw blonde hair, or tattoos, or anything else.

So, all this freaking about what I get to decide doesn't mean anything, except you have some sort of persecution complex going on. We decide. And if we decide that abortion is illegal, guess what? Then we are defining for you when life begins, according to our society.

If we decide as a society that life begins at conception, guess what? That means we've decided for you that life begins at conception.

Rant and rave all you want. Them's the facts. Your ilk got to decide that pre-birth babies aren't really babies, and weren't really alive. I didn't agree to that, and I don't believe that, but I've had to live with it. Eventually, you're going to have to live with the fact that the definition of "life" no longer meets your own lax definition.

Too bad. Get a tissue and quit sqawking.

 

[Shogun]

snookums.. cookie... hun.. that shit cracks me up.




just warn me so I can go get about 50 in ones.

 

[jillian]

I think society gets to decide, poor misguided fool. Majority rules. We decide what is legal and illegal. That means we define murder.

I don't know what your blather about your religion is all about, but I do know that if the majority conceded, we could outlaw blonde hair, or tattoos, or anything else.

So, all this freaking about what I get to decide doesn't mean anything, except you have some sort of persecution complex going on. We decide. And if we decide that abortion is illegal, guess what? Then we are defining for you when life begins, according to our society.

If we decide as a society that life begins at conception, guess what? That means we've decided for you that life begins at conception.

Rant and rave all you want. Them's the facts. Your ilk got to decide that pre-birth babies aren't really babies, and weren't really alive. I didn't agree to that, and I don't believe that, but I've had to live with it. Eventually, you're going to have to live with the fact that the definition of "life" no longer meets your own lax definition.

Too bad. Get a tissue and quit sqawking.

Again, you're the one ranting. Get a grip. Get it under control. Or maybe this messageboard stuff is a bit too stressful for you.

 

[bennylava]

"Your ilk got to decide that pre-birth babies aren't really babies, and weren't really alive. I didn't agree to that, and I don't believe that, but I've had to live with it."

And what effect exactly does that have on YOUR life? You poor persecuted person, being forced to live in a society where other people have freedom??!?

 

[AllieBaba]

Just responding to your spasms, dear. And quite honestly, they weren't all that coherent. I think I did a pretty good job of pulling them together for you.

Except for your misapprehension that I'm somehow trying to assign a religion to you. I have no idea where that bizarre diatribe came from.

But I've no doubt, from the way you take the cutting comments I've made against you and rehash them later, and pretend they are your own, that you're capable of learning. So, watch and learn and welcome to it. Anything else I can do to help you, just let me know.

 

[jillian]

Just responding to your spasms, dear. And quite honestly, they weren't all that coherent. I think I did a pretty good job of pulling them together for you.

Except for your misapprehension that I'm somehow trying to assign a religion to you. I have no idea where that bizarre diatribe came from.

But I've no doubt, from the way you take the cutting comments I've made against you and rehash them later, and pretend they are your own, that you're capable of learning. So, watch and learn and welcome to it. Anything else I can do to help you, just let me know.

Watch and learn from whom? You? RAFLMAO!

Best giggle I had all day.

 

[AllieBaba]

"Your ilk got to decide that pre-birth babies aren't really babies, and weren't really alive. I didn't agree to that, and I don't believe that, but I've had to live with it."

And what effect exactly does that have on YOUR life? You poor persecuted person, being forced to live in a society where other people have freedom??!?

The point I was making is that a majority in this country can and does decide when life begins.

 

[AllieBaba]

Watch and learn from whom? You? RAFLMAO!

Best giggle I had all day.

What's sad about the incorrigibly stupid is they never realize that that's what they are.

 

[jillian]

The point I was making is that a majority in this country can and does decide when life begins.

Actually, the majority is pro choice. It's the religious right who isn't.

Care to refigure that one?

 

[jillian]

What's sad about the incorrigibly stupid is they never realize that that's what they are.

I think that's what Shogun and I were trying to tell you.

 

[bennylava]

"The point I was making is that a majority in this country can and does decide when life begins."

No it doesn't. The majority decides that it is up to each individual woman to make that decision for herself.

 

[AllieBaba]

Actually, the majority is pro choice. It's the religious right who isn't.

Care to refigure that one?

I believe that's what I said. But the tide will change. Then what will you do? No longer able to shepherd the young girls into the abortion clinics, no longer allowed to tell them sex can be completely without consequences.....

 

[RetiredGySgt]

A majority do not have the right to decide life or death on a whim.

 

[AllieBaba]

"The point I was making is that a majority in this country can and does decide when life begins."

No it doesn't. The majority decides that it is up to each individual woman to make that decision for herself.

Isn't it odd that it is two murders if you kill a pregnant woman...but not murder if she chooses to kill the baby herself?

 

[bennylava]

Again, because it was the woman's choice to consider her child a life and keep it.

 

[AllieBaba]

As it stands now. But there eventually will be no question about it (really there isn't now, scientifically) and the state will take the decision out of her hands. The state has determined that an unborn child isn't alive unless the mother says so. The state will eventually determine that regardless of the mother's desire for the child, the child is still a child and deserving of life.

Despite the science which proves they are alive, and despite the fanatic desperation of people who insist that children remain disposable.

 

[Dr Grump]

I believe that's what I said. But the tide will change. Then what will you do? No longer able to shepherd the young girls into the abortion clinics, no longer allowed to tell them sex can be completely without consequences.....

The difference is you are trying to foist your morals onto others. If you get pregnant, don't have an abortion if that is what you believe in. If you do believe and want one, get one.
The problem with you religious wackos is that you want your cake and eat it too. You don't want to teach safe sex and the use of condoms, but are anti-abortion too. Here's something for you to consider - how about some people like sex for the fun of it, not just to procreate. Once you religious nutjobs get your head around that, then maybe you might get a reduction in abortion rates. In saying that, there was a Brit doco out about two years ago called something like Texas Virgins and it was about abstinance-only programmes amongst the religious nutjobs in Texas. Guess which group of people had a higher pregnancy rate - those who signed up for the abstinance-only programmes or those that didn't? I'll tell you because the chances of you figuring it out are pretty remote - the abstinance-only kids.

 

[bennylava]

"The difference is you are trying to foist your morals onto others. If you get pregnant, don't have an abortion if that is what you believe in. If you do believe and want one, get one."

Exactly.

"how about some people like sex for the fun of it, not just to procreate."
I sometimes think that their concerns aren't really about birth control or abortion, but that other people are having better or more sex than they are? Or they feel that there is just something inherently wrong with sex itself.

 

[jillian]

"The difference is you are trying to foist your morals onto others. If you get pregnant, don't have an abortion if that is what you believe in. If you do believe and want one, get one."

Exactly.

"how about some people like sex for the fun of it, not just to procreate."
I sometimes think that their concerns aren't really about birth control or abortion, but that other people are having better or more sex than they are? Or they feel that there is just something inherently wrong with sex itself.

They think sex is a sin. All of their policies about it have to do with the harlot should be punished for her sins. Nothing whatsoever to do with life. Try asking Allie Baby, yet again, what she thinks about the death penalty or blowing up A-rabs. ;o)

 

[AllieBaba]

I'm not trying to foist my morals upon anyone. You can have all the guilt-free sex you like. Just don't expect me to pay the bill when you get pregnant or come down with an STD, or need years of counseling for PTSD from your trip to the abortion clinic.

I don't believe the babies being aborted are non-human. I don't believe they aren't alive. I believe abortion is the murder of children. People who support abortion are supporting the murder of children. How is my belief in that an attempt to foist my morals down anybody's throat, any more than you are forcing your morals down my throat when you state that aborted babies have no souls and it is okay to butcher them? And we should all foot the bill?

The difference is, at the end of the day, you have a murdered baby on your hands, and I don't.

That said, I'm not foisting my morals down your throat. This is an issue which will come up for the vote, again and again. And eventually, everybody will see how barbaric state-sponsored abortion is and decry it. That's not foisting beliefs on anyone. That's democracy in action.