Is Free Trade A Thing of the Past??

[Bonnie]

By Tony Blankley

The Central American Free Trade Agreement (CAFTA), President Bush's modest little trade bill that would benefit the U.S. economy at least as much as Central America's, is edging toward defeat in Congress. It is a sign of the precarious political position of the entire post-World War II free-trade regime that such a bill might be unpassable in the capital of the world's pre-eminent free-trading nation.
If the American political system is driving even free-trade believing congressmen to vote "nyet" on CAFTA, it is "adios" to globalized trade and "welkommen" to protectionist principles of international economics. (I thought I would start using up my foreign vocabulary as there may soon be a glut in the market for foreign words of salutation.) The bill itself is a model of practical utility. It eliminates almost all the trade barriers between the United States and Central America (Costa Rica, El Salvador, Honduras, Dominican Republic, Guatemala and Nicaragua), America's second-largest Latin trading block after Mexico.

http://www.washtimes.com/op-ed/20050517-091438-6097r.htm

 

[archangel]

By Tony Blankley





http://www.washtimes.com/op-ed/20050517-091438-6097r.htm

Cafta is a joke....as was Nafta...The GNP of Central America combined is about the size of Austin,Texas...pray tell how would this help theUS economy..
Big business is just shopping for really cheap labor...as it stands they can hire 3 Central Americans for the price of 1 Mexican laborer...Also in Mexico those who are employed by US companies in Mexico have to steal cardboard boxes and pallets from the storage area just to be able to build ( Homes) if ya can call them homes... close to work...they cannot by any stretch of the imagination afford to purchase products made in the US much less Mexico or Central America...
So who does this benefit...well not "Rocket Science"....just the US CEO's and maybe el presidente for life ZORRO(Fox)

 

[freeandfun1]

Cafta is a joke....as was Nafta...The GNP of Central America combined is about the size of Austin,Texas...pray tell how would this help theUS economy..
Big business is just shopping for really cheap labor...as it stands they can hire 3 Central Americans for the price of 1 Mexican laborer...Also in Mexico those who are employed by US companies in Mexico have to steal cardboard boxes and pallets from the storage area just to be able to build ( Homes) if ya can call them homes... close to work...they cannot by any stretch of the imagination afford to purchase products made in the US much less Mexico or Central America...
So who does this benefit...well not "Rocket Science"....just the US CEO's and maybe el presidente for life ZORRO(Fox)

Well, I would rather the cheap labour stay there instead of coming here....

 

[archangel]

Well, I would rather the cheap labour stay there instead of coming here....

However, we also need to bring back the US jobs that were outsourced to Mexico I want them to go to US citizen workers...let's get back on track...
Let el presidente Fox et al deal with their own mess...

 

[5stringJeff]

Free Trade benefits everyone. American consumers get a greater variety of goods at a cheaper price, and American companies get new markets, which means more jobs for those companies. Likewise, Central American companies now have access to a huge market for their goods, and Central American consumers now have access to American goods. Everyone wins!

 

[freeandfun1]

However, we also need to bring back the US jobs that were outsourced to Mexico I want them to go to US citizen workers...let's get back on track...
Let el presidente Fox et al deal with their own mess...

You seem to keep overlooking the FACT that most of those jobs cannot pay enough to support workers here. Just within my industry, I will use an example.

Years ago, US RF and MW connector MFR's had a corner on the world market. We were able to charge what we wanted, because you couldn't get em any place else. Over the years, first the Japanese, then the Koreans and now the Chinese all entered the market and drove prices down. US companies had a choice... close down entirely and give up that market and lay off 100% of their employees or move MFR to Mexico, lay off 90% of their employees and stay competitive in the marketplace. Things are NOT as simple as you like to make it out to be. I know you are intelligent, so the concept should not be that hard to grasp. Why do you continually ignore the fact that we cannot compete 1 on 1 with the Asians?

 

[archangel]

You seem to keep overlooking the FACT that most of those jobs cannot pay enough to support workers here. Just within my industry, I will use an example.

Years ago, US RF and MW connector MFR's had a corner on the world market. We were able to charge what we wanted, because you couldn't get em any place else. Over the years, first the Japanese, then the Koreans and now the Chinese all entered the market and drove prices down. US companies had a choice... close down entirely and give up that market and lay off 100% of their employees or move MFR to Mexico, lay off 90% of their employees and stay competitive in the marketplace. Things are NOT as simple as you like to make it out to be. I know you are intelligent, so the concept should not be that hard to grasp. Why do you continually ignore the fact that we cannot compete 1 on 1 with the Asians?

We cannot compete with China,Latin America et all because we being... Big business... created this problem by sharing high tech... then outsourcing the company and jobs...If the outsourcing were brought back to the US and companies tightened security on high tech bleed off...well China and Mexico et al would no longer be able to compete....they would have no need for fossil fuel to operate there business...walla we will pay less at the pump...and the unemployment rate for US citizens would fall drastically!

 

[5stringJeff]

Here's a great article explaining free trade, and why it's beneficial for America. It was written in 1995, when NAFTA was such a controversy.

----------------
What Free Trade Really Means
Published in The Freeman: Ideas on Liberty - September 1995
by Jeffrey Herbener

Dr. Herbener is Associate Professor of Economics at Washington and Jefferson College and a Senior Fellow of the Ludwig von Mises Institute.

Governments were threatening trade wars with retaliatory tariffs and quotas, belligerents suffered currency devaluations and balance of payments deficits, and everyone threatened legal action. The United States and Japan in 1995? No, this situation described the relationship between the states in 1780.

Prior to ratification of the Constitution, states had their own development policies. Some, like Virginia, tried to stimulate their existing agricultural cash crops; others, like Connecticut, tried to stimulate industrial development at the expense of agriculture. Each state had its own paper currency which appreciated or depreciated against those of other states, increasing uncertainty and therefore inhibiting interstate trade. Large and unequal government debt existed from state to state. Some, like Rhode Island, inflated it away and suffered a boom-bust cycle; others, like Massachusetts, raised taxes to pay it, squelching economic activity and spawning open rebellion.

Delegates from the states sent to Constitutional Convention in 1787 put high priority on solving these problems of interstate trade. That's why the U.S. Constitution authorizes Congress “to coin money” and forbids the states from printing or coining money; it forbids the states from erecting trade barriers and authorizes Congress “to regulate commerce with foreign nations and among the several states.”

By allowing the market to broaden, the integration of state economies had immense benefits. A uniform money removed the inefficiency of bartering different monies and the uncertainty of currency fluctuations. Elimination of trade barriers allowed the division of labor to develop unimpeded, thereby greatly increasing productivity by an efficient allocation of factors of production.

MORE: http://www.fee.org/vnews.php?nid=3279

 

[freeandfun1]

We cannot compete with China,Latin America et all because we being... Big business... created this problem by sharing high tech... then outsourcing the company and jobs...If the outsourcing were brought back to the US and companies tightened security on high tech bleed off...well China and Mexico et al would no longer be able to compete....they would have no need for fossil fuel to operate there business...walla we will pay less at the pump...and the unemployment rate for US citizens would fall drastically!

You obviously have no experience exporting or dealing in international business.

First off, exports are a large part of our economy. So when you export, it is ONLY natural those overseas are going to have access to your products and therefore, be able to learn technology. You act as if the Asians are too stupid to figure out how to machine an RF connector. My point being that as the world become more educated, the only thing that makes one competitive is cheap labour. That is why I mentioned how the connector business went from Japan, then when too expensive there, to Korea, then when too expensive there, to China. As long as there are poor nations or at least, nations like China with HUGE populations, there will always be somebody that can do it cheaper. I am surprised at how you don't look at the big picture and simplify things so much. I would have thought you are much wiser than that. We didn't outsource until we HAD to. You make it look like we did it from day one. Most high-tech companies RESISTED outsourcing because they understood it would just create new competitors. I have been working in the high-tech field for nearly 14 years now so I have seen it run the entire course.

 

[Said1]

You obviously have no experience exporting or dealing in international business.

First off, exports are a large part of our economy. So when you export, it is ONLY natural those overseas are going to have access to your products and therefore, be able to learn technology. You act as if the Asians are too stupid to figure out how to machine an RF connector. My point being that as the world become more educated, the only thing that makes one competitive is cheap labour. That is why I mentioned how the connector business went from Japan, then when too expensive there, to Korea, then when too expensive there, to China. As long as there are poor nations or at least, nations like China with HUGE populations, there will always be somebody that can do it cheaper. I am surprised at how you don't look at the big picture and simplify things so much. I would have thought you are much wiser than that. We didn't outsource until we HAD to. You make it look like we did it from day one. Most high-tech companies RESISTED outsourcing because they understood it would just create new competitors. I have been working in the high-tech field for nearly 14 years now so I have seen it run the entire course.

In other words, "product life cycle".

 

[freeandfun1]

In other words, "product life cycle".

Yes! Or "technology" life-cycle.

 

[Said1]

Yes! Or "technology" life-cycle.

Either or, same thing. I guess I was awake in that lecture.

 

[archangel]

You obviously have no experience exporting or dealing in international business.

First off, exports are a large part of our economy. So when you export, it is ONLY natural those overseas are going to have access to your products and therefore, be able to learn technology. You act as if the Asians are too stupid to figure out how to machine an RF connector. My point being that as the world become more educated, the only thing that makes one competitive is cheap labour. That is why I mentioned how the connector business went from Japan, then when too expensive there, to Korea, then when too expensive there, to China. As long as there are poor nations or at least, nations like China with HUGE populations, there will always be somebody that can do it cheaper. I am surprised at how you don't look at the big picture and simplify things so much. I would have thought you are much wiser than that. We didn't outsource until we HAD to. You make it look like we did it from day one. Most high-tech companies RESISTED outsourcing because they understood it would just create new competitors. I have been working in the high-tech field for nearly 14 years now so I have seen it run the entire course.

Nah...no experience....just 12 years as a import/export law enforcement officer...Dept of Treas...USCS...I am very familiar with the fraud that US companies did prior to this abomination of justice... :funnyface

 

[Said1]

Nah...no experience....just 12 years as a import/export law enforcement officer...Dept of Treas...USCS...I am very familiar with the fraud that US companies did prior to this abomination of justice... :funnyface

Like what??

 

[archangel]

Like what??

I cannot give names and exact locations...as i'm sure you would understand..
However I worked on High Tech export to countries that were not allowed to receive them...Middle East... Computer programs,munitions etc also to the Soviet block nations,China,N/Korea etc etc...Well alot of respectable American Companies would false invoice products that were restricted for export...ie:bleed off of high tech to countries on the no sell list....is that enough to satisfy your curiousity!

 

[Said1]

I cannot give names and exact locations...as i'm sure you would understand..
However I worked on High Tech export to countries that were not allowed to receive them...Middle East... Computer programs,munitions etc also to the Soviet block nations,China,N/Korea etc etc...Well alot of respectable American Companies would false invoice products that were restricted for export...ie:bleed off of high tech to countries on the no sell list....is that enough to satisfy your curiousity!

That doesn't account for legitimate outsourcing due to a products/technologies lifecycle. Some of the stuff you mentioned might have been at the bottom end, although it was on the "no" sell list too. So no, this doesn't really satisfy my curiosity.

 

[archangel]

That doesn't account for legitimate outsourcing due to a products/technologies lifecycle. Some of the stuff you mentioned might have been at the bottom end, although it was on the "no" sell list too. So no, this doesn't really satisfy my curiosity.

"Bottom end" excuse me high tech and munitions not to mention electronic and computer programs is not exactly what I would call bottom end...It still goes on as we speak...also your "lifecycle" theory does not compute...what has it to do with violations of export laws for profit? :bangheads

 

[Said1]

"Bottom end" excuse me high tech and munitions not to mention electronic and computer programs is not exactly what I would call bottom end...It still goes on as we speak...also your "lifecycle" theory does not compute...what has it to do with violations of export laws for profit? :bangheads

Bottom end meaning they are standardized product, and the designs are stable and perfected. It doesn't mean it's crap, it just means everyone else has one, like a microwave.

What does your "knowledge" of violations have to do with outsourcing?

 

[archangel]

Bottom end meaning they are standardized product, and the designs are stable and perfected. It doesn't mean it's crap, it just means everyone else has one, like a microwave.

What does your "knowledge" of violations have to do with outsourcing?

Bill Clinton and his weird little VP caused the illegal export of high tech munitions and computer programs to be exported to China... all for a little political contribution of campaign cash...Not microwave ovens...unless they were invoiced as microwave ovens...although they were rocket components...lol Geez did ya forget that microwave tech includes target aquisition components? :cof:
It's been fun but gotta run...bye!

 

[Said1]

Bill Clinton and his weird little VP caused the illegal export of high tech munitions and computer programs to be exported to China... all for a little political contribution of campaign cash...Not microwave ovens...unless they were invoiced as microwave ovens...although they were rocket components...lol Geez did ya forget that microwave tech includes target aquisition components? :cof:
It's been fun but gotta run...bye!

Geez, is that the cause of all outsourcing? And I thought it all about production scale and minimization of production costs etc. Boy, was I wrong teehee.