Is a racial insult a valid defense for homicide?

[manifold]

Racial comment sparked fatal punch in Las Vegas casino, say cops - Crimesider - CBS News

 

[manifold]

The altercation began when Hawkins took offense to the Massie's comment about "a black man in a yellow shirt," police said. Hawkins reportedly felled the Utah man with a single punch to the face.

"One punch to the side of the face and he was out," police homicide Lt. Lewis Roberts said of the dead man to the Associated Press. "Never got back up."

...

Hawkins told detectives he interpreted Massie's actions as aggressive.

"Hawkins said he feared if he turned his back on Massie he would be punched in the back of the head, so he punched Massie one time in the jaw with his right hand," the police report said.

Hard to buy the self defense angle. Too bad the security video isn't public.

 

[Moonglow]

I am more interested in knowing why dat black man has my family name, I can bet you he's not of an Irish/anglo decent

 

[Moonglow]

they gonna put dat man in prison.

 

[manifold]

The two biggest reasons why you should avoid fighting people you don't know.

1. They might kick your ass
2. They might have a glass jaw and you might kill them with just one punch.

 

[catzmeow]

The altercation began when Hawkins took offense to the Massie's comment about "a black man in a yellow shirt," police said. Hawkins reportedly felled the Utah man with a single punch to the face.

"One punch to the side of the face and he was out," police homicide Lt. Lewis Roberts said of the dead man to the Associated Press. "Never got back up."

...

Hawkins told detectives he interpreted Massie's actions as aggressive.

"Hawkins said he feared if he turned his back on Massie he would be punched in the back of the head, so he punched Massie one time in the jaw with his right hand," the police report said.

Hard to buy the self defense angle. Too bad the security video isn't public.

I wonder if the defense will go for an incitement defense (the idea being that there aer some words that are so inflammatory that they provoke an immediate emotional reaction that can lead to a breach of peace.

I doubt the guy knew when he punched Massie that Massie would die from a single punch.

 

[manifold]

The altercation began when Hawkins took offense to the Massie's comment about "a black man in a yellow shirt," police said. Hawkins reportedly felled the Utah man with a single punch to the face.

"One punch to the side of the face and he was out," police homicide Lt. Lewis Roberts said of the dead man to the Associated Press. "Never got back up."

...

Hawkins told detectives he interpreted Massie's actions as aggressive.

"Hawkins said he feared if he turned his back on Massie he would be punched in the back of the head, so he punched Massie one time in the jaw with his right hand," the police report said.

Hard to buy the self defense angle. Too bad the security video isn't public.

I wonder if the defense will go for an incitement defense (the idea being that there aer some words that are so inflammatory that they provoke an immediate emotional reaction that can lead to a breach of peace.

I doubt the guy knew when he punched Massie that Massie would die from a single punch.

IMO, the incitement defense is bullshit to begin with. But regardless, "black man in a yellow shirt?" Really?

 

[Moonglow]

I work as a bouncer on saturdays for a Mexican night club. I get insults, hit with bottles, spit at etc., I don't loose my cool.

 

[catzmeow]

IMO, the incitement defense is bullshit to begin with. But regardless, "black man in a yellow shirt?" Really?

I've been in situations where I've been hard put not to throat punch someone, so I'm not sure that incitement is, in fact, bullshit. But, in this case, it is a definite reach. I don't think he should be charged with homicide, though. I think it seems more like manslaughter.

 

[catzmeow]

I work as a bouncer on saturdays for a Mexican night club. I get insults, hit with bottles, spit at etc., I don't loose my cool.

Perhaps not everyone is as mellow and emotionally well-balanced as you.

 

[manifold]

IMO, the incitement defense is bullshit to begin with. But regardless, "black man in a yellow shirt?" Really?

I've been in situations where I've been hard put not to throat punch someone, so I'm not sure that incitement is, in fact, bullshit. But, in this case, it is a definite reach. I don't think he should be charged with homicide, though. I think it seems more like manslaughter.

I'm guessing it will be manslaughter. I always thought "homicide" was a generic term for one person killing another, but isn't actually a stand-alone charge.

 

[martybegan]

Racial comment sparked fatal punch in Las Vegas casino, say cops - Crimesider - CBS News

It isnt murder thats for sure. The racial slur is not a defense, but it is a mitigating circumstance. The defendant did not intend the blow to be fatal. This has Manslaughter two (if its in the juristiction) written all over it. The intent was not death but harm, and it was instigated. You are still responsible, however for the outcome, which was a homicde.

 

[Trajan]

yes manslaughter, the bar fight paradigm.

in today's society I would except that some sympathy would go to the man who thinks he suffered harm for a stupid remark and was justified in hitting him, the death imho is not part of that per se', so he should be brought up on assault battery and manslaughter, wiht the A & B sending him away for a while.

 

[manifold]

Racial comment sparked fatal punch in Las Vegas casino, say cops - Crimesider - CBS News

It isnt murder thats for sure. The racial slur is not a defense, but it is a mitigating circumstance. The defendant did not intend the blow to be fatal. This has Manslaughter two (if its in the juristiction) written all over it. The intent was not death but harm, and it was instigated. You are still responsible, however for the outcome, which was a homicde.

I agree. But still, I have to wonder about a guy that could get so enraged over the comment being reported that'd he'd need to punch the guy at all.

 

[Momanohedhunter]

The altercation began when Hawkins took offense to the Massie's comment about "a black man in a yellow shirt," police said. Hawkins reportedly felled the Utah man with a single punch to the face.

"One punch to the side of the face and he was out," police homicide Lt. Lewis Roberts said of the dead man to the Associated Press. "Never got back up."

...

Hawkins told detectives he interpreted Massie's actions as aggressive.

"Hawkins said he feared if he turned his back on Massie he would be punched in the back of the head, so he punched Massie one time in the jaw with his right hand," the police report said.

Hard to buy the self defense angle. Too bad the security video isn't public.

I wonder if the defense will go for an incitement defense (the idea being that there aer some words that are so inflammatory that they provoke an immediate emotional reaction that can lead to a breach of peace.

I doubt the guy knew when he punched Massie that Massie would die from a single punch.

Murder is murder. Dude go's to prison.

 

[Truthseeker420]

I would sy that is manslauter not murder.

 

[catzmeow]

I agree. But still, I have to wonder about a guy that could get so enraged over the comment being reported that'd he'd need to punch the guy at all.

Roids. That's my fallback.

 

[Momanohedhunter]

What was racist about this comment

"The altercation began when Hawkins took offense to the Massie's comment about "a black man in a yellow shirt," police said. Hawkins reportedly felled the Utah man with a single punch to the face."

 

[High_Gravity]

I don't get the insult?

 

[catzmeow]

Murder is murder. Dude go's to prison.

Wrong. Murder is much more complex than that. There's voluntary and involuntary manslaughter, which is unplanned killing for which you are at fault (like not paying attention to the road and wiping out another car). There's justifiable homicide, in which you cause the death of another human being, but it's justified (i.e., guy breaks into my home, threatens my life, and I shoot him). And then, there's criminal homicide which is broken down by degrees depending on the level of planning and motive involved, along with aggravating and mitigating factors.

This case is clearly voluntary manslaughter.