Is $68,000 the bare-bones family income?

[jillian]

Is $68,000 the bare-bones family income?
This post comes from Lynn Mucken at MSN Money.


Or is it? According to a study commissioned by the nonprofit Wider Opportunities for Women, a family with two full-time wage earners and two children needs nearly $68,000 a year to afford fundamentals like housing, utilities, food, health care, transportation, saving for retirement and child care. The average such family in America makes less than that. Post continues after video.

[bold added]

Are they serious?

My family does all of that with 5 kids and a $54k income.

How can msn expect to be taken seriously when people can read that tripe and know that is exactly what it is?

Seriously, if you "need" $68k with just 2 kids, you need to check what you are wasting your money on.

i would think it would depend largely on where one lives. in ny, you could not comfortably support a family of 4 on that amount. if the comments are based on national averages, its not an out-there number.

I think even a single person would have a hard time in NY with that salary Jillian, LA too. In California if you make under 100K you are a peasant.

NY, too. A 2 bedroom condo near the VZ Bridge is about $800K. The same apt in Brighton Beach is over a million. Houses run $500K and up... and what you get for $500K would probably need $100K of work.... at least that's what we saw when we were looking last year... and forget about what places cost in greenwich village or the upper east/west side.

 

[High_Gravity]

i would think it would depend largely on where one lives. in ny, you could not comfortably support a family of 4 on that amount. if the comments are based on national averages, its not an out-there number.

I think even a single person would have a hard time in NY with that salary Jillian, LA too. In California if you make under 100K you are a peasant.

NY, too. A 2 bedroom condo near the VZ Bridge is about $800K. The same apt in Brighton Beach is over a million. Houses run $500K and up... and what you get for $500K would probably need $100K of work.... at least that's what we saw when we were looking last year... and forget about what places cost in greenwich village or the upper east/west side.

So basically New York is only for the high rollers and movers and shakers right? how do pizza delivery boys and dish washers afford to live in that city?

 

[jillian]

I think even a single person would have a hard time in NY with that salary Jillian, LA too. In California if you make under 100K you are a peasant.

NY, too. A 2 bedroom condo near the VZ Bridge is about $800K. The same apt in Brighton Beach is over a million. Houses run $500K and up... and what you get for $500K would probably need $100K of work.... at least that's what we saw when we were looking last year... and forget about what places cost in greenwich village or the upper east/west side.

So basically New York is only for the high rollers and movers and shakers right? how do pizza delivery boys and dish washers afford to live in that city?

there's housing you can get that's cheap. but you have to be lucky and get a rent stabilized place or lived in a rent controlled apt for years and years. there's also all kinds of subsidized housing like mitchell lama, which are middle class co-ops, but the waiting list can be years and years; and, of course, there is public housing and section 8.

or people squeeze a lot of people into a place and kick in their $$$...

of course, every so often, that kind of place ends up being dangerous for the people who live there.

i remember when i got out of law school, i paid $500 a month for an illegal basement apartment.... and that was 20 years ago.

 

[Two Thumbs]

Is $68,000 the bare-bones family income?
This post comes from Lynn Mucken at MSN Money.


Or is it? According to a study commissioned by the nonprofit Wider Opportunities for Women, a family with two full-time wage earners and two children needs nearly $68,000 a year to afford fundamentals like housing, utilities, food, health care, transportation, saving for retirement and child care. The average such family in America makes less than that. Post continues after video.

[bold added]

Are they serious?

My family does all of that with 5 kids and a $54k income.

How can msn expect to be taken seriously when people can read that tripe and know that is exactly what it is?

Seriously, if you "need" $68k with just 2 kids, you need to check what you are wasting your money on.

i would think it would depend largely on where one lives. in ny, you could not comfortably support a family of 4 on that amount. if the comments are based on national averages, its not an out-there number.

I gotta know. Why do so many people say; "Well in NYC...."
NYC has 8 million people living in and around it.
292 million live every where else.

And in every where else, minus a few other cities, $68K is very good money. You aint got the big house at the top of the hill, but you are not in a row home either.

any way

My point is that you can do very well with less and more kids than msn claims. Maybe I have a very high reguard for my fellow Americans, even considering gen Y, than companies like that have.

 

[High_Gravity]

NY, too. A 2 bedroom condo near the VZ Bridge is about $800K. The same apt in Brighton Beach is over a million. Houses run $500K and up... and what you get for $500K would probably need $100K of work.... at least that's what we saw when we were looking last year... and forget about what places cost in greenwich village or the upper east/west side.

So basically New York is only for the high rollers and movers and shakers right? how do pizza delivery boys and dish washers afford to live in that city?

there's housing you can get that's cheap. but you have to be lucky and get a rent stabilized place or lived in a rent controlled apt for years and years. there's also all kinds of subsidized housing like mitchell lama, which are middle class co-ops, but the waiting list can be years and years; and, of course, there is public housing and section 8.

or people squeeze a lot of people into a place and kick in their $$$...

of course, every so often, that kind of place ends up being dangerous for the people who live there.

i remember when i got out of law school, i paid $500 a month for an illegal basement apartment.... and that was 20 years ago.

Its basically the same in California, you can find decent apartments for rent but their usually in bad areas, there is no middle line. You are either rich or poor in California, like Egypt.

 

[jillian]

Is $68,000 the bare-bones family income?
This post comes from Lynn Mucken at MSN Money.


Or is it? According to a study commissioned by the nonprofit Wider Opportunities for Women, a family with two full-time wage earners and two children needs nearly $68,000 a year to afford fundamentals like housing, utilities, food, health care, transportation, saving for retirement and child care. The average such family in America makes less than that. Post continues after video.

[bold added]

Are they serious?

My family does all of that with 5 kids and a $54k income.

How can msn expect to be taken seriously when people can read that tripe and know that is exactly what it is?

Seriously, if you "need" $68k with just 2 kids, you need to check what you are wasting your money on.

i would think it would depend largely on where one lives. in ny, you could not comfortably support a family of 4 on that amount. if the comments are based on national averages, its not an out-there number.

I gotta know. Why do so many people say; "Well in NYC...."
NYC has 8 million people living in and around it.
292 million live every where else.

And in every where else, minus a few other cities, $68K is very good money. You aint got the big house at the top of the hill, but you are not in a row home either.

any way

My point is that you can do very well with less and more kids than msn claims. Maybe I have a very high reguard for my fellow Americans, even considering gen Y, than companies like that have.

i think we say 'well, in ny' because it's expensive here. i also think ny'ers are a little socio-centric, for better or worse (is that a real word?)

and you may be right that people can do well with less, but i think they mean without having to work real hard at it.

 

[jillian]

So basically New York is only for the high rollers and movers and shakers right? how do pizza delivery boys and dish washers afford to live in that city?

there's housing you can get that's cheap. but you have to be lucky and get a rent stabilized place or lived in a rent controlled apt for years and years. there's also all kinds of subsidized housing like mitchell lama, which are middle class co-ops, but the waiting list can be years and years; and, of course, there is public housing and section 8.

or people squeeze a lot of people into a place and kick in their $$$...

of course, every so often, that kind of place ends up being dangerous for the people who live there.

i remember when i got out of law school, i paid $500 a month for an illegal basement apartment.... and that was 20 years ago.

Its basically the same in California, you can find decent apartments for rent but their usually in bad areas, there is no middle line. You are either rich or poor in California, like Egypt.

it will be moreso as the middle class keeps getting eroded by randians.

 

[High_Gravity]

there's housing you can get that's cheap. but you have to be lucky and get a rent stabilized place or lived in a rent controlled apt for years and years. there's also all kinds of subsidized housing like mitchell lama, which are middle class co-ops, but the waiting list can be years and years; and, of course, there is public housing and section 8.

or people squeeze a lot of people into a place and kick in their $$$...

of course, every so often, that kind of place ends up being dangerous for the people who live there.

i remember when i got out of law school, i paid $500 a month for an illegal basement apartment.... and that was 20 years ago.

Its basically the same in California, you can find decent apartments for rent but their usually in bad areas, there is no middle line. You are either rich or poor in California, like Egypt.

it will be moreso as the middle class keeps getting eroded by randians.

Well with $68K a year you can live very comfortably in places like Missouri, Illinois, Iowa, Nebraska, Texas etc. hell in the Southern States like Alabama and Mississipi $68K is a handsome ransom, so hope is not lost, but it is definently not in New York or Cali.

 

[jillian]

Its basically the same in California, you can find decent apartments for rent but their usually in bad areas, there is no middle line. You are either rich or poor in California, like Egypt.

it will be moreso as the middle class keeps getting eroded by randians.

Well with $68K a year you can live very comfortably in places like Missouri, Illinois, Iowa, Nebraska, Texas etc. hell in the Southern States like Alabama and Mississipi $68K is a handsome ransom, so hope is not lost, but it is definently not in New York or Cali.

yeah, but alabama and mississippi also have among the worst educational systems in the country... maybe there's a correlation?

 

[High_Gravity]

it will be moreso as the middle class keeps getting eroded by randians.

Well with $68K a year you can live very comfortably in places like Missouri, Illinois, Iowa, Nebraska, Texas etc. hell in the Southern States like Alabama and Mississipi $68K is a handsome ransom, so hope is not lost, but it is definently not in New York or Cali.

yeah, but alabama and mississippi also have among the worst educational systems in the country... maybe there's a correlation?

Well you got to take the good with the bad, the schools in California are also garbage but you have to pay an arm and a leg to live there, I would take Alabama or Mississipi over Cali anyday, at least I can own my house there and people actually speak English.

 

[Two Thumbs]

i would think it would depend largely on where one lives. in ny, you could not comfortably support a family of 4 on that amount. if the comments are based on national averages, its not an out-there number.

I gotta know. Why do so many people say; "Well in NYC...."
NYC has 8 million people living in and around it.
292 million live every where else.

And in every where else, minus a few other cities, $68K is very good money. You aint got the big house at the top of the hill, but you are not in a row home either.

any way

My point is that you can do very well with less and more kids than msn claims. Maybe I have a very high reguard for my fellow Americans, even considering gen Y, than companies like that have.

i think we say 'well, in ny' because it's expensive here. i also think ny'ers are a little socio-centric, for better or worse (is that a real word?) is now

and you may be right that people can do well with less, but i think they mean without having to work real hard at it.

I had a shipmate from Brooklyn, I'll qoute him;

"When I was liven in New Yawk I thawt the world was New Yawk City and the rest of it."

Thing is, we make much less and have more kids and it's not that hard.

meh, maybe it was the timing of my childhood and I'm some old fuddy duddy. But I still think that number is inflated.

 

[Cuyo]

did lynn preface this with a regional disclaimer? 68K here in the bay area? forget it. and 2 wage earners?68K what they each work for 10 bucks an hour?

$68,000 is poverty level in New York and California and even Miami too I believe.

Then somebody needs to pack there stuff up and move.

The places that have the lower cost of living tend to be the places where there's no work, or the wages are comparatively lower.

I did move TT as I think I've told you, from BurlCo NJ out here to the woods... Made sense for me as a business owner strictly in wholesale. But an underemployed home builder probably wouldn't benefit, since he wouldn't find work.

It's more complicated than "Just move" is all I'm sayin.

 

[Two Thumbs]

it will be moreso as the middle class keeps getting eroded by randians.

Well with $68K a year you can live very comfortably in places like Missouri, Illinois, Iowa, Nebraska, Texas etc. hell in the Southern States like Alabama and Mississipi $68K is a handsome ransom, so hope is not lost, but it is definently not in New York or Cali.

yeah, but alabama and mississippi also have among the worst educational systems in the country... maybe there's a correlation?

no.

There's an unfortunate attitude in the south;

Ifn it's good enough for my grandpappy, it'sa good enough for me.

People have a 'make do' attitude when it comes to learning cuz there's still people down there that made it with little book lernin.

pfft

My Uncle Don didn't finish K. He was allowed to leave after his dad died b/c he was the oldest boy and someone had to work the farm.

A man that could not read, printed his name, but could do long math in his head, died the families only millionaire.

 

[Trajan]

did lynn preface this with a regional disclaimer? 68K here in the bay area? forget it. and 2 wage earners?68K what they each work for 10 bucks an hour?

$68,000 is poverty level in New York and California and even Miami too I believe.

Then somebody needs to pack there stuff up and move.
.

I did, how do you think I wound up out here? I was NYer, and ETSed at Dix in NJ.
I hit the state line with $396.00 in my pocket and a Duffel bag of clothes. Fo' reel.

 

[Two Thumbs]

$68,000 is poverty level in New York and California and even Miami too I believe.

Then somebody needs to pack there stuff up and move.

The places that have the lower cost of living tend to be the places where there's no work, or the wages are comparatively lower.

I did move TT as I think I've told you, from BurlCo NJ out here to the woods... Made sense for me as a business owner strictly in wholesale. But an underemployed home builder probably wouldn't benefit, since he wouldn't find work.

It's more complicated than "Just move" is all I'm sayin.

Well yeah.

Ya don't throw a dart at the map and move hoping for the best.

You have to do some research.

but sticking it out is foolish when you can pack up and find a better opportunity to go to.

 

[jillian]

Well with $68K a year you can live very comfortably in places like Missouri, Illinois, Iowa, Nebraska, Texas etc. hell in the Southern States like Alabama and Mississipi $68K is a handsome ransom, so hope is not lost, but it is definently not in New York or Cali.

yeah, but alabama and mississippi also have among the worst educational systems in the country... maybe there's a correlation?

no.

There's an unfortunate attitude in the south;

Ifn it's good enough for my grandpappy, it'sa good enough for me.

People have a 'make do' attitude when it comes to learning cuz there's still people down there that made it with little book lernin.

pfft

My Uncle Don didn't finish K. He was allowed to leave after his dad died b/c he was the oldest boy and someone had to work the farm.

A man that could not read, printed his name, but could do long math in his head, died the families only millionaire.

that happens occasionally... but not often, i'd think. my dad grew up in brownsville and was sent to automotive high school "to learn a trade".

he ended up being pretty impressive. (of course, he got sent to college by one of the companies he worked for along the way, which helped).

i understand what you're saying, but you'd think at some point, they'd notice there are a lot more people like that who live in double-wides and have their working TV on top of their old TV.

 

[jillian]

Then somebody needs to pack there stuff up and move.

The places that have the lower cost of living tend to be the places where there's no work, or the wages are comparatively lower.

I did move TT as I think I've told you, from BurlCo NJ out here to the woods... Made sense for me as a business owner strictly in wholesale. But an underemployed home builder probably wouldn't benefit, since he wouldn't find work.

It's more complicated than "Just move" is all I'm sayin.

Well yeah.

Ya don't throw a dart at the map and move hoping for the best.

You have to do some research.

but sticking it out is foolish when you can pack up and find a better opportunity to go to.

its not always that easy to move. in my case, i'd have to take another bar exam (i already passed two states)... and i think maybe i'd prefer root canal to taking another bar exam right now.

 

[Two Thumbs]

yeah, but alabama and mississippi also have among the worst educational systems in the country... maybe there's a correlation?

no.

There's an unfortunate attitude in the south;

Ifn it's good enough for my grandpappy, it'sa good enough for me.

People have a 'make do' attitude when it comes to learning cuz there's still people down there that made it with little book lernin.

pfft

My Uncle Don didn't finish K. He was allowed to leave after his dad died b/c he was the oldest boy and someone had to work the farm.

A man that could not read, printed his name, but could do long math in his head, died the families only millionaire.

that happens occasionally... but not often, i'd think. my dad grew up in brownsville and was sent to automotive high school "to learn a trade".

he ended up being pretty impressive. (of course, he got sent to college by one of the companies he worked for along the way, which helped).

i understand what you're saying, but you'd think at some point, they'd notice there are a lot more people like that who live in double-wides and have their working TV on top of their old TV.

Here's the thing though; They are happy. Honest to god, that "double wide" makes them happy b/c it gives them a roof over thier heads that is thiers.

And I can tell you, it beats paying rent.

 

[Two Thumbs]

The places that have the lower cost of living tend to be the places where there's no work, or the wages are comparatively lower.

I did move TT as I think I've told you, from BurlCo NJ out here to the woods... Made sense for me as a business owner strictly in wholesale. But an underemployed home builder probably wouldn't benefit, since he wouldn't find work.

It's more complicated than "Just move" is all I'm sayin.

Well yeah.

Ya don't throw a dart at the map and move hoping for the best.

You have to do some research.

but sticking it out is foolish when you can pack up and find a better opportunity to go to.

its not always that easy to move. in my case, i'd have to take another bar exam (i already passed two states)... and i think maybe i'd prefer root canal to taking another bar exam right now.

Well since you are a lawyer, I'll be willing to bet, if you chose to move and do the bar again, you'd have a very high paying job [compared to the local average} in no time.

See, it comes down to choice. What are you willing to do to be happy?
You chose a crazy amount of college to become a lawyer, so you could make a lot of money, doing whatever you specifically do. [I'm certain it was more than the money] However, your choice has you trapped inside of 2 states, b/c root canal is better than another bar exam.

I chose the Navy b/c I wanted to see the world and learn a trade. I can take my skills anywhere I want and find some kinda job doing something. But I will never cash the same kinda check you will.

Which one of us is happier?

 

[Mr. Peepers]

You need $$$$ to move, if your living paycheck to paycheck in New York or California barely making it, its tough to move. Only reason I was able to leave California after I left the service is because the Military pays for 1 last move after you separate, thank god.

True that! I spent at least $4,000, moving here and I rented a U-Haul! Gotta have 1st, last and security deposit for 95% of apartments here. And also, who in their right mind is going to leave a job paying close to 70K in a great city like NYC with lots of opportunity and mobility, with a great transit system (remember, most NYC people do NOT have cars) to try their luck in Mississippi or Texas. There are few jobs anywhere, but it's for sure easier to get one (or two or three) here in NYC.