Infaticide and Abortion

[Moi]

Originally posted by acludem
The reason adoption agencies and orphanages are so packed with these kids and older kids in general is because the couples who can afford the massive cost of adoption generally want healthy, white newborns. Latino, Black and biracial babies, as well as older children of all races have a very difficult time finding homes.

acludem

How can you explain the large increase in adoptions from other countries? If people were so wedded to white children, why are there so many adoptions from China? Most of the people I know who are adopting from overseas care more about getting a baby whose parents aren't going to repossess them or track them down years later. They care more about not losing their adoptive children than they do about having ones that look like them.

Most of the couples that I know who've adopted from overseas say that there was no waiting, no hassels from the adoption agencies (several white couples I know were prevented from adopting black children) and less chance of the parents coming back to haunt them.

 

[Moi]

Originally posted by acludem
How about if I don't want MY money going to fund what I consider an immoral war in Iraq? Should we allow every American who pays taxes to dictate what their particular tax money goes to? Conservatives whine about money for abortion, and then try to use tax dollars to subsidize religion. The standard "I don't like it, therefore taxes shouldn't fund it" is ludicrous. Just think that your few grand in taxes went to feed soldiers in Iraq, they can use mine to fund abortions for poor women.

Just as you are free to vote your conscience and lobby on these matters, so am I. Unless I'm mistaken, that's what a democracy is all about.

 

[acludem]

That's correct, Moi, you do have the right to vote your conscience. The reason why overseas adoptions have picked up as you said is it's easier you don't have parents coming back for you, but it's also cheaper. I'm glad some of your friends have adopted from overseas and tried to adopt black babies, but they are the strong minority. Most couples who can afford to adopt (the average cost I believe is well over $20,000, but I honestly don't have the stats to back that, I'm going on memory) want healthy white newborns, some will adopt from overseas simply because it is easier.

Do you support allowing gay and lesbian couples to adopt? This would certainly increase the pool of adoptive parents.

 

[Big D]

White children are more costly to adopt because there are few white children up for adoption.

70% of the U.S population is White.
32% of children in the U.S waiting to be adopted are White.

Blacks and hispanics are 25% of the U.S population combined.
60% of children in the U.S waiting to be adopted are black or hispanic.

Blacks and hispanics barely want to take care of there own children, let alone someone elses.
Ever seen a commercial to help children in a foreign country? What color are they always?

This is combined with the fact that black and hispanic women have abortions at almost 3 times that the rate of White women.

 

[Moi]

Originally posted by acludem
That's correct, Moi, you do have the right to vote your conscience. The reason why overseas adoptions have picked up as you said is it's easier you don't have parents coming back for you, but it's also cheaper. I'm glad some of your friends have adopted from overseas and tried to adopt black babies, but they are the strong minority. Most couples who can afford to adopt (the average cost I believe is well over $20,000, but I honestly don't have the stats to back that, I'm going on memory) want healthy white newborns, some will adopt from overseas simply because it is easier.

Do you support allowing gay and lesbian couples to adopt? This would certainly increase the pool of adoptive parents.

I waited until I was in my thirties and able to afford taking care of a child before I procreated. I have only one child because that's the best way for me to ensure that I can afford to feed, clothe, house and take care of him while saving for a future for him too. That is my goal in life, taking care of my own.

Without offering any opinion on gay adoptions, I will say this, what do you think causes adoptions in this country to be so expensive? It's certainly not those who oppose abortion. What's causing the rise in costs is the bottomless pit that has become our welfare system. The more "help" people seem to be getting the more they bellyache and whine for more. Unfortunately, we seem to have politicians who are more than willing to keep throwing money into such a vast black hole.

 

[jon_forward]

I personally dont believe that gay couples should be able to adopt or for that matter even be foster parents. while I am sure there are lots of gay couples wanting to adopt...being gay is not like being a democrat or republican....btw..has rosie's ship sank yet??

 

[MtnBiker]

No but I think it had to redock for extra food.

 

[bamthin]

Wow moi,

You didn't have sex until you were in your thirties?

You stated this earlier:


"That's the most ridiculous rationalization I have every heard for this supposed right to privacy. Because some ignorant idiots can't keep their pants on, I'm supposed to take the money out of my son's future and support their mistakes? "

And then this:

"I waited until I was in my thirties and able to afford taking care of a child before I procreated."


-Bam

 

[lilcountriegal]

I'm just gonna help ya out a bit here bam... you seem to be digging yourself in pretty far.

v. pro·cre·at·ed, pro·cre·at·ing, pro·cre·ates
v. tr.
To beget and conceive (offspring).
To produce or create; originate.

v. intr.
To beget and conceive offspring; reproduce.


conceive offspring and having sex are far from the same. Might wanna consult good 'ol Websters before posting.

 

[bamthin]

Originally posted by lilcountriegal
I'm just gonna help ya out a bit here bam... you seem to be digging yourself in pretty far.

v. pro·cre·at·ed, pro·cre·at·ing, pro·cre·ates
v. tr.
To beget and conceive (offspring).
To produce or create; originate.

v. intr.
To beget and conceive offspring; reproduce.


conceive offspring and having sex are far from the same. Might wanna consult good 'ol Websters before posting.

I couldn't find "Keeping their pants on" in "Good ol' Websters", but I believe that means "having sex", and I believe procreating involves taking pants off. You really ought to practice english comprehension before you look any more foolish.

Having sexual intercourse (taking your pants off) brings with it the possibility of conceiving which would require 1) procreating 2) aborting or 3) praying for a miscarriage.

You should start digging yourself out instead of worrying about me.

-Bam

 

[lilcountriegal]

*sigh*. Keeping your attention on the finer details can be quite exhausting.

Posted by Moi:

I waited until I was in my thirties and able to afford taking care of a child before I procreated.

Posted by you:

Wow moi,You didn't have sex until you were in your thirties?

And you're worried about MY English Comprehension??!?

Thanks for the laugh bam. Carry on with your idiotic argument. I quite enjoy seeing people make you look foolish. It's just like free entertainment.

 

[jon_forward]

there has been alot of FREE entertainment tonite lil so much Im calling it a nite my sides have not hurt this bad in years...

 

[bamthin]

Originally posted by lilcountriegal
*sigh*. Keeping your attention on the finer details can be quite exhausting.

Posted by Moi:



Posted by you:



And you're worried about MY English Comprehension??!?

Thanks for the laugh bam. Carry on with your idiotic argument. I quite enjoy seeing people make you look foolish. It's just like free entertainment.

I can see you now, The chuckling idiot with drool on his chin. I am so sorry you can't comprehend something so simple. I guess I will break it down for you since you are such an idiot and all.

Moi chastized people in a previous entry for "not keeping their pants on" . This means "having intercourse and risking conception"

He later bragged how he waited until he was in his thirties to procreate. So, if he had intercourse at any time BEFORE his thirties, he was running the risk of procreating. You see, this makes him a hypocrite unless he didn't have sexual intercourse until he was in his thirties.

Now, please stop bothering me your general ineptitude and go take an english class. mmmk?


-Bam

 

[jimnyc]

Bam, I think you're getting a bit too personal with countriegal. That'll be the end of it now. Consider this your one and only warning.

 

[Moi]

I will give you the benefit of the doubt, Bam, that between your sarcasm you would actually like to debate something. First and foremost, my original post and its subsequent replies were regarding someone's idiotic statement that those of us who are against the abortion laws in this country and didn't want to keep throwing money at other people's unwanted offspring, weren't entitled to an opinion nor did they have the right to lobby for laws related to their beliefs (unless, of course, they'd adopted those unwanted offspring).

You can be sarcastic and belittle anyone you want...although you're eventually going to get banned for being so snide...but the fact remains that abortion and welfare are not part of the constititution and I'm well within my rights to try and change any law which does not conform to my own beliefs.

If the people who believe in abortion and support it don't want me to have any say in the matter, they should begin by lobbying congress to pass laws which would make it inapplicable for taxpayers money to be spent on them. That's the entire reason for the Revolutionary War- people were angry that they had to pay taxes yet had no voice in how those taxes were spent or levied.

If you'd like to live in a land where citizens have no voice in these matters, I suggest you move out of the country and find someplace. Until that happens, you just have to sit there and take knowing that people who oppose abortion, oppose welfare and/or oppose tax money being spent on these causes have the right to lobby for their beliefs.

 

[Bern80]

Boy, lot's of good stuff here.

With most any social problem you really need to get to the heart of the matter. As some alluded to earlier the problem w/ abortion obviously isn't whether it's okay or not.

Abortion is not a problem. It is simply a consequence of people having sex w/o being prepared for one of many possible negative outcomes.

I fully support a woman's right to choose.....whether or not she decides to have sex based on the possible consequences. If your talking about the right to choose an abortion however, why on earth should anyone have the right to decide if a baby lives or dies when it's their own fault that their in that situation in the first place.

I do agree w/ Bamthin on one minute point, however. Until we actually start educting people on the issue in an attempt to curb these unwanted pregnancies, (which will cost tax dollars, unless the minds of America suddenly undergo a moral revolution there is no solution to this problem that won't cost tax money), we pro-lifers better seriously consider adoption for the time being when it comes to decisions about having children.

The ideal outcome being that hopefully both abortion rates and adoptoin rates fall.

 

[MtnBiker]

How much education does it take for a person to realize having sex leads to pregnacy?

 

[Annie]

Really? Wow! I guess perhaps we need to spend more on sex education? More condoms at schools? What could we NEED to stop unplanned pregnancies?

 

[Bern80]

and there in kathianne is the fine line. Not sure if you are being sarcastic or not. I think the best education would be to encourage students not to have sex until there ready for the cnsequences. Kids will be kids of course and have sex anyway.

Personally I think it is very hard to say "don't have sex, but if you're gonna anyway use this" and not sound like you are making it okay.

 

[acludem]

Education is the key to preventing unwanted pregnancies. That's why family planning organizations like Planned Parenthood are so important. So many conservatives want to hide behind abistinence only sex education and assume that if you don't talk about sex, it won't happen. Young people need to know about birth control. They need to understand that if they do have sex there are consequences. They need to be taught that abstinence is the only 100% way to know unwanted pregancies or STDs won't affect them, but that if they choose to have sex that they should use a condom.

Until the right wing stops fighting reality based, common sense sex education this problem won't go away.