If prostitution was legalized countrywide...?

[manifold]

If prostitution was legalized countrywide, do you think it would lead to a great many women being forced into the trade against their will?

I've always argued on principle that prostitution shouldn't be against the law. I mean, why shouldn't a woman be allowed to legally sell what she can legally give away for free. But I recently heard an opposing argument I hadn't thought about. Basically that legalized prostitution would lead to more, not less oppression of women and many would be forced into the trade against their will. And for that reason, surrendering this liberty is worth the price.

I'm not totally convinced, but the argument does make some sense.

 

[Bern80]

If prostitution was legalized countrywide, do you think it would lead to a great many women being forced into the trade against their will?

I've always argued on principle that prostitution shouldn't be against the law. I mean, why shouldn't a woman be allowed to legally sell what she can legally give away for free. But I recently heard an opposing argument I hadn't thought about. Basically that legalized prostitution would lead to more, not less oppression of women and many would be forced into the trade against their will. And for that reason, surrendering this liberty is worth the price.

I'm not totally convinced, but the argument does make some sense.

Reminds me of what George Carlin said on the subject;

Selling is legal. Fucking is legal. Why isn't selling fucking legal?

As a libertarian I think it should be legal along with lots of other things. I don't get the argument you were presented honestly. How would women be forced into the industry? And why more so than if it were kept illegal?

 

[MikeK]

The notion that more women would be forced into prostitution if prostitution were legal is patently false. The only reason that kind of slavery can take place is because prostitution is an illegal, therefore underground activity.

If prostitution were legal prostitutes would be as protected as any other citizen. The profession would be monitored, exposed to the light of day and the police would be closely involved.

Like marijuana, prostitution is presently subjected to a prohibition -- and we know what prohibitions bring about. End the prohibition and it will eliminate the associated criminal activity. And the effect on controlling STD infections will be extremely positive.

Unfortunately we live in an obsessively authoritarian culture in which the majority population is enamored with enforcement of laws, even when the laws are counterproductive.

 

[Care4all]

how would that work though?

let's say the bordello owner fires the prostitute, does she then collect unemployment compensation, but if she refuses to take a new job offer for a new prostitution place, and wants to get out of the field of prostitution, do we take her unemployment away because she refused the prostitution job offer?

 

[Ravi]

how would that work though?

let's say the bordello owner fires the prostitute, does she then collect unemployment compensation, but if she refuses to take a new job offer for a new prostitution place, and wants to get out of the field of prostitution, do we take her unemployment away because she refused the prostitution job offer?

Oh, my! Good question.

And what of male prostitutes?

 

[MikeK]

how would that work though?

let's say the bordello owner fires the prostitute, does she then collect unemployment compensation, but if she refuses to take a new job offer for a new prostitution place, and wants to get out of the field of prostitution, do we take her unemployment away because she refused the prostitution job offer?

Interesting question. But I'm sure we could work something out. (Know what I mean?)

 

[Sallow]

You mean more then now?

No.

But the government can get it's take. And..it would be cleaner and safer.

 

[Defiant1]

The art of bartering would grow.

 

[Pax Romana]

I don't think so.

 

[martybegan]

how would that work though?

let's say the bordello owner fires the prostitute, does she then collect unemployment compensation, but if she refuses to take a new job offer for a new prostitution place, and wants to get out of the field of prostitution, do we take her unemployment away because she refused the prostitution job offer?

They would probably handle it as a contract worker. The bordello would rent out space to the prostitute as an independent contractor, taking a cut for the service. It would not be an employee-employer relationship. I think this is how the bunny ranch works out in Nevada.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

If prostitution was legalized countrywide, do you think it would lead to a great many women being forced into the trade against their will?

I've always argued on principle that prostitution shouldn't be against the law. I mean, why shouldn't a woman be allowed to legally sell what she can legally give away for free. But I recently heard an opposing argument I hadn't thought about. Basically that legalized prostitution would lead to more, not less oppression of women and many would be forced into the trade against their will. And for that reason, surrendering this liberty is worth the price.

I'm not totally convinced, but the argument does make some sense.

Why would they be forced into prostitution against their will? Nobody forces people to do other jobs, so I don't understand how this is a legitimate concern.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

how would that work though?

let's say the bordello owner fires the prostitute, does she then collect unemployment compensation, but if she refuses to take a new job offer for a new prostitution place, and wants to get out of the field of prostitution, do we take her unemployment away because she refused the prostitution job offer?

Don't offer unemployment in the first place.

 

[Care4all]

could welfare moms be told they have to take a job in prostitution that they were offered part time, in order to collect welfare?

could prostitutes being laid off be told they HAVE TO accept a prostitution job being offered to them, while collecting unemployment?

and by no means will this make prostitution more safe....most prostitutes are streetwalkers....drug addicts and they will be rejected by legal cat houses and continue walking the streets and others are college students trying to discreetly pay their way through school....they will never join a bordello or register themselves as prostitutes, then there are the single moms doing this discreetly as well, they too will never register as a legal whore either...

and there will be plenty, and i mean plenty, of men that will never go the legal bordello route, with a paper trail and security video of them in the lobby, especially if married...

the illegal streetwalkers will still be a demanded trade....

wonder if the bordello owners will be invited to high school job fairs?

would the gvt restrict where a bordello is set up, like ''not within so many blocks from a school?''

will the gvt restrict the hours they can be opened?


I;m not certain WHAT advantages there really would be legalizing it?

maybe decriminalizing it would have more advantages?

 

[Care4all]

how would that work though?

let's say the bordello owner fires the prostitute, does she then collect unemployment compensation, but if she refuses to take a new job offer for a new prostitution place, and wants to get out of the field of prostitution, do we take her unemployment away because she refused the prostitution job offer?

They would probably handle it as a contract worker. The bordello would rent out space to the prostitute as an independent contractor, taking a cut for the service. It would not be an employee-employer relationship. I think this is how the bunny ranch works out in Nevada.

no, from my readings and understanding that is not how it works in nevada.

the girls are not independent of the bordello, they are even held there....do not go home at night, they have to be tested weekly for HIV, they have to agree to not 'work' outside of the bordello....lot's of restrictions, if memory serves....

 

[MikeK]

could welfare moms be told they have to take a job in prostitution that they were offered part time, in order to collect welfare?

That would be compulsory prostitution imposed by the State, so it's a cynical prospect that I can't imagine happening.

could prostitutes being laid off be told they HAVE TO accept a prostitution job being offered to them, while collecting unemployment?

That is a difficult hypothesis to wrestle with because it presumes too much. First we need to establish what sort of circumstances would affect the practice of that trade. Under the present circumstances, if one is an unemployed barber, for example, would that barber be told he MUST accept a particular job if he can offer a valid reason for it being objectionable.

and by no means will this make prostitution more safe....most prostitutes are streetwalkers. . .

Most prostitutes are not streetwalkers. If it seems that way to you it's because streetwalkers are the only prostitutes you see and are therefore aware of. The fact is they represent the low end of the trade. Most prostitutes in today's America are "outcall" ladies who are referred by so-called "escort services," which is a thriving underground business. Unfortunately, because it is illegal it is dominated by criminal syndicates who take advantage of the women who are not protected by the law.

. . .drug addicts and they will be rejected by legal cat houses and continue walking the streets

If prostitution were legal there would be no place for the stereotypical junkie streetwalker. That level of prostitute would go the way of the often toxic "bathtub gin" which was common during alcohol prohibition.

and others are college students trying to discreetly pay their way through school....they will never join a bordello or register themselves as prostitutes, then there are the single moms doing this discreetly as well, they too will never register as a legal whore either

And there are people who do plumbing and electrical work off the books and without licenses, but they are the fringe. One of the best reasons for legalizing prostitution is the ability to require weekly VD exams to retain one's license. This requirement is known to signficantly reduce the rate of venereal infections. Another important licensing requirement is that condoms and antiseptic products be used during any contact. While there will be men who would not require such protection from disease their number would be minimal.

This policy was in place when I was stationed in Japan and Okinawa in the 50s and it was very effective in controlling the VD rate. A GI would have to be a fool to patronize a jo-san who wasn't licensed or whose license wasn't up to date. He would also be in trouble if he got caught.

and there will be plenty, and i mean plenty, of men that will never go the legal bordello route, with a paper trail and security video of them in the lobby, especially if married

Here again we have a hypothesis that assumes too much. There will of course be alternatives to bordellos with security cameras and transaction records.

the illegal streetwalkers will still be a demanded trade

Why do you believe that? How many men who presently patronize streetwalkers would do so if there were a much safer, much more appealing alternative available for the same, or even less, money? And I'm not including those men with perverse appetites -- who are a fringe exception.

wonder if the bordello owners will be invited to high school job fairs?

If you truly think they would I'd be curious to know why you think so.

would the gvt restrict where a bordello is set up, like ''not within so many blocks from a school?''

I'm quite sure there would be districting requirements, just as exists in the city of Amsterdam. Non-residential areas where their presence would not be offensive or out of place.

will the gvt restrict the hours they can be opened?

Why should they?

I'm not certain WHAT advantages there really would be legalizing it?

You need to give it more thought.

maybe decriminalizing it would have more advantages?

I agree that it might be a good experimental step. Try it and see how it works out. I'd have no problem with that

 

[007]

Reminds me of what George Carlin said on the subject;

Selling is legal. Fucking is legal. Why isn't selling fucking legal?

And that's about it right there ---^

I lived in Reno. There were many brothels just outside of there and Carson City, and I've been to a fee. The girls are not "employed" by the brothel. They go there to "work," and then give the brothel owner a cut of their earnings. They are there of their own free will, and I don't believe that if it were legal nation wide that women would be forced into it at all. The industry is watched very close in Nevada, and I believe it would be nation wide too.

 

[Care4all]

could welfare moms be told they have to take a job in prostitution that they were offered part time, in order to collect welfare?

That would be compulsory prostitution imposed by the State, so it's a cynical prospect that I can't imagine happening.

could prostitutes being laid off be told they HAVE TO accept a prostitution job being offered to them, while collecting unemployment?

That is a difficult hypothesis to wrestle with because it presumes too much. First we need to establish what sort of circumstances would affect the practice of that trade. Under the present circumstances, if one is an unemployed barber, for example, would that barber be told he MUST accept a particular job if he can offer a valid reason for it being objectionable.


Most prostitutes are not streetwalkers. If it seems that way to you it's because streetwalkers are the only prostitutes you see and are therefore aware of. The fact is they represent the low end of the trade. Most prostitutes in today's America are "outcall" ladies who are referred by so-called "escort services," which is a thriving underground business. Unfortunately, because it is illegal it is dominated by criminal syndicates who take advantage of the women who are not protected by the law.


If prostitution were legal there would be no place for the stereotypical junkie streetwalker. That level of prostitute would go the way of the often toxic "bathtub gin" which was common during alcohol prohibition.


And there are people who do plumbing and electrical work off the books and without licenses, but they are the fringe. One of the best reasons for legalizing prostitution is the ability to require weekly VD exams to retain one's license. This requirement is known to signficantly reduce the rate of venereal infections. Another important licensing requirement is that condoms and antiseptic products be used during any contact. While there will be men who would not require such protection from disease their number would be minimal.

This policy was in place when I was stationed in Japan and Okinawa in the 50s and it was very effective in controlling the VD rate. A GI would have to be a fool to patronize a jo-san who wasn't licensed or whose license wasn't up to date. He would also be in trouble if he got caught.


Here again we have a hypothesis that assumes too much. There will of course be alternatives to bordellos with security cameras and transaction records.


Why do you believe that? How many men who presently patronize streetwalkers would do so if there were a much safer, much more appealing alternative available for the same, or even less, money? And I'm not including those men with perverse appetites -- who are a fringe exception.


If you truly think they would I'd be curious to know why you think so.


I'm quite sure there would be districting requirements, just as exists in the city of Amsterdam. Non-residential areas where their presence would not be offensive or out of place.


Why should they?

I'm not certain WHAT advantages there really would be legalizing it?

You need to give it more thought.

maybe decriminalizing it would have more advantages?

I agree that it might be a good experimental step. Try it and see how it works out. I'd have no problem with that

You may THINK all is fine and dandy with the sex trade in Nevada, but I can assure you, IT IS NOT! Most of the women are HELD CAPTIVE and not permitted to leave the brothel after 5pm or in some cases even have cars.

The Nevada counties prefer not to acknowledge the contribution made by licensed prostitution to their bottom line. Some counties and towns impose some extraordinary restrictions on commercial sex workers. The net effect of these regulations is to separate sex workers from the local community. Some jurisdictions require brothel prostitutes to leave the county when they are not working, while others take the opposite tack, forbidding them to leave the brothel where they work. Some do not allow the children of the women who work in the brothels to live in the same area.

The city of Winnemucca requires brothel workers who have cars to register the vehicle with the local police, and workers are not permitted to leave the brothel after 5pm. In some places, registered sex workers are not allowed to have cars at all, so that they must pay someone else to buy necessities like shampoo and soap. These unique regulations treat brothels and the women who work there as if they are not a part of the local community – despite the contributions they make to the state and the community in the form of taxes, fees and jobs.Melissa Ditmore: Nevada's refusal to tax brothels further alienates sex workers | Comment is free | guardian.co.uk

you should do a little more research on the topic....seems to me, these women are STILL SEX SLAVES.

a plan to legalize prostitution in Brothels only, is only supporting BIG BUSINESS and not 'the women in the business' imo.

 

[Article 15]

Yes, please!

^--- she seems happy to me!

 

[editec]

If prostitution was legalized countrywide, do you think it would lead to a great many women being forced into the trade against their will?

I've always argued on principle that prostitution shouldn't be against the law. I mean, why shouldn't a woman be allowed to legally sell what she can legally give away for free. But I recently heard an opposing argument I hadn't thought about. Basically that legalized prostitution would lead to more, not less oppression of women and many would be forced into the trade against their will. And for that reason, surrendering this liberty is worth the price.

I'm not totally convinced, but the argument does make some sense.

Done correctly White Slavery ought not to be a problem.

But its that "done correctly" thing that we probably should not count on, eh?

Givent hat much of prostitution is already a kind of White Slavery, though, it might be worth a try.

 

[Care4all]

If prostitution was legalized countrywide, do you think it would lead to a great many women being forced into the trade against their will?

I've always argued on principle that prostitution shouldn't be against the law. I mean, why shouldn't a woman be allowed to legally sell what she can legally give away for free. But I recently heard an opposing argument I hadn't thought about. Basically that legalized prostitution would lead to more, not less oppression of women and many would be forced into the trade against their will. And for that reason, surrendering this liberty is worth the price.

I'm not totally convinced, but the argument does make some sense.

Done correctly White Slavery ought not to be a problem.

But its that "done correctly" thing that we probably should not count on, eh?

Givent hat much of prostitution is already a kind of White Slavery, though, it might be worth a try.

see, I don't think we can do it rightly...

with the brothels in vegas as a test, we have a very long way to go....the women are still treated as outcasts, and for the most part, held captive by the big business pimp/brothel owner.