CDZ If guns won't help against evil government, why do those governments take the guns anyway?

[2aguy]

We always here from the anti gunners that it is just crazy to think that you could fight off a government that was determined to murder you and other citizens like you. Yet, those evil governments still take guns away from the people they plan on killing. Why? Sure, you could say some of their soldiers are going to get killed if the victims can shoot back, but that isn't the argument the anti gunners make.....besides, soldiers can be replaced, why go to the trouble of taking guns away from the target populations? Just send in the troops and murder them...righ?

 

[bgrouse]

Liberal clowns think an internal rebellion can only matter if it can outright defeat decisively the government troops in an open battle. You'll see them posting images of a redneck with a rifle and a strategic bomber.

 

[2aguy]

Liberal clowns think an internal rebellion can only matter if it can outright defeat decisively the government troops in an open battle. You'll see them posting images of a redneck with a rifle and a strategic bomber.

Exactly....here is a former infantry officer describing irregular warfare.......and one thing the anti gunners don't understand? The entire population wouldn't be doing the fighting, but.....with 320 million guns in private hands, the majority of the population can arm those who fight...

Kurt Schlichter - Why Democrats Would Lose the Second Civil War, Too

Let’s talk terrain and numbers. Remember the famous red v. blue voting map? There is a lot of red, and in the interior the few blue splotches are all cities like Las Vegas or Denver. That is a lot of territory for a counter-insurgent force to control, and this is critical. The red is where the food is grown, the oil pumped, and through which everything is transported. And that red space is filled with millions of American citizens with small arms, a fairly large percentage of whom have military training.

Remember what two untrained idiots did in Boston with a couple of pistols? They shut a city down. Now multiply that by several million, with better weapons and training.

Let’s look at the counter-insurgent forces in the Democrat oppression scenario should they attempt to misuse our law enforcement and military in an unconstitutional manner to take the rights of American citizens. There are a lot of civilian law enforcement officers, but the vast majority of the agencies are local – sheriffs, small town police departments. They will not be reliable allies in supporting unlawful oppression of their friends and neighbors. The major cities’ police departments are run by Democrat appointees, so the commands would be loyal. But the rank-and-file? A small percentage would be ideologically loyal. More would be loyal because that’s their paycheck – they could be swayed or intimidated to support the rebels. Others would be actively sympathetic to the insurgents. This is true of federal law enforcement agencies as well.


And the military? Well, wouldn’t the military just crush any resistance? Not so fast. The military would have the combat power to win any major engagement, but insurgents don’t get into major engagements with forces that have more combat power. They instead leverage their decentralized ability to strike at the counter-insurgents’ weak points to eliminate the government’s firepower advantage. In other words, hit and run, and no stand-up fights.

For example, how do a bunch of hunters in Wisconsin defeat a company of M1A2 Abrams tanks? They ambush the fuel and ammo trucks.

Oh, and they wait until the gunner pops the hatch to take a leak and put a .30-06 round in his back from 300 meters.

Then they disappear. What do the tanks do then? Go level the nearest town? Great. Now they just moved the needle in favor of the insurgents among the population. Pretty soon, they can’t be outside of their armored vehicles in public. Their forces are spending 90% of their efforts not on actual counter-insurgency operations but on force protection. Sure, they own their forward operating bases, and they own a few hundred meters around them wherever they happen to be standing at the moment, but the rest of the territory is bright red. As my recent novel illustrates, American guerillas with small arms are a deadly threat to the forces of a dictatorship.


But the military is so big it would overwhelm any rebels, right? Well, how big do you think the military is? And, more importantly, how many actual boots on the ground can it deploy? Let’s put it in terms of brigade combat teams, which total about 4,500 troops each. There are about 60 brigades in the Army, active and reserve, here and abroad, and let’s give the Marines another 10 brigades, for about 70 brigades. Sounds impressive. But that’s deceptive.

 

[cnm]

If guns won't help against evil government, why do those governments take the guns anyway?

Just to fuck with your head.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

Liberal clowns think an internal rebellion can only matter if it can outright defeat decisively the government troops in an open battle. You'll see them posting images of a redneck with a rifle and a strategic bomber.

Exactly....here is a former infantry officer describing irregular warfare.......and one thing the anti gunners don't understand? The entire population wouldn't be doing the fighting, but.....with 320 million guns in private hands, the majority of the population can arm those who fight...

Kurt Schlichter - Why Democrats Would Lose the Second Civil War, Too

Let’s talk terrain and numbers. Remember the famous red v. blue voting map? There is a lot of red, and in the interior the few blue splotches are all cities like Las Vegas or Denver. That is a lot of territory for a counter-insurgent force to control, and this is critical. The red is where the food is grown, the oil pumped, and through which everything is transported. And that red space is filled with millions of American citizens with small arms, a fairly large percentage of whom have military training.

Remember what two untrained idiots did in Boston with a couple of pistols? They shut a city down. Now multiply that by several million, with better weapons and training.

Let’s look at the counter-insurgent forces in the Democrat oppression scenario should they attempt to misuse our law enforcement and military in an unconstitutional manner to take the rights of American citizens. There are a lot of civilian law enforcement officers, but the vast majority of the agencies are local – sheriffs, small town police departments. They will not be reliable allies in supporting unlawful oppression of their friends and neighbors. The major cities’ police departments are run by Democrat appointees, so the commands would be loyal. But the rank-and-file? A small percentage would be ideologically loyal. More would be loyal because that’s their paycheck – they could be swayed or intimidated to support the rebels. Others would be actively sympathetic to the insurgents. This is true of federal law enforcement agencies as well.


And the military? Well, wouldn’t the military just crush any resistance? Not so fast. The military would have the combat power to win any major engagement, but insurgents don’t get into major engagements with forces that have more combat power. They instead leverage their decentralized ability to strike at the counter-insurgents’ weak points to eliminate the government’s firepower advantage. In other words, hit and run, and no stand-up fights.

For example, how do a bunch of hunters in Wisconsin defeat a company of M1A2 Abrams tanks? They ambush the fuel and ammo trucks.

Oh, and they wait until the gunner pops the hatch to take a leak and put a .30-06 round in his back from 300 meters.

Then they disappear. What do the tanks do then? Go level the nearest town? Great. Now they just moved the needle in favor of the insurgents among the population. Pretty soon, they can’t be outside of their armored vehicles in public. Their forces are spending 90% of their efforts not on actual counter-insurgency operations but on force protection. Sure, they own their forward operating bases, and they own a few hundred meters around them wherever they happen to be standing at the moment, but the rest of the territory is bright red. As my recent novel illustrates, American guerillas with small arms are a deadly threat to the forces of a dictatorship.


But the military is so big it would overwhelm any rebels, right? Well, how big do you think the military is? And, more importantly, how many actual boots on the ground can it deploy? Let’s put it in terms of brigade combat teams, which total about 4,500 troops each. There are about 60 brigades in the Army, active and reserve, here and abroad, and let’s give the Marines another 10 brigades, for about 70 brigades. Sounds impressive. But that’s deceptive.

I've read both of Schlichter's books on the subject.

 

[Ridgerunner]

Thanks 2aguy... Great OP...

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

The only way to win such a war would be to openly slaughter American citizens in mass.
Ain't gonna happen leftist.

 

[bgrouse]

Liberal clowns think an internal rebellion can only matter if it can outright defeat decisively the government troops in an open battle. You'll see them posting images of a redneck with a rifle and a strategic bomber.

Exactly....here is a former infantry officer describing irregular warfare.......and one thing the anti gunners don't understand? The entire population wouldn't be doing the fighting, but.....with 320 million guns in private hands, the majority of the population can arm those who fight...

Exactly. You can't non-lethally disarm a bunch of people with AR-15s. And you can't kill too much of your own population since there won't be much left to rule even if you do win. That's why evil dictators want their populations disarmed: so they can be safely herded into forced labor camps like in the Soviet Union, which had very tough gun laws that would make democrats proud!

 

[sakinago]

We always here from the anti gunners that it is just crazy to think that you could fight off a government that was determined to murder you and other citizens like you. Yet, those evil governments still take guns away from the people they plan on killing. Why? Sure, you could say some of their soldiers are going to get killed if the victims can shoot back, but that isn't the argument the anti gunners make.....besides, soldiers can be replaced, why go to the trouble of taking guns away from the target populations? Just send in the troops and murder them...righ?

Vietnam, Afghanistan vs Russia, Afghanistan vs US.

 

[Toronado3800]

We always here from the anti gunners that it is just crazy to think that you could fight off a government that was determined to murder you and other citizens like you. Yet, those evil governments still take guns away from the people they plan on killing. Why? Sure, you could say some of their soldiers are going to get killed if the victims can shoot back, but that isn't the argument the anti gunners make.....besides, soldiers can be replaced, why go to the trouble of taking guns away from the target populations? Just send in the troops and murder them...righ?

No conspiracy. Just ppl go two ways on the gun issue. Many educated folks (from the northern U.S.?) don't really like the idea of guns. I don't like the idea of fighting a man with a knife either....not sure if I want to have to carry around either to feel safe though.

But yeah, some ppl just see a higher murder rate and wants to go after the instrument of choice.

 

[Dan Stubbs]

We always here from the anti gunners that it is just crazy to think that you could fight off a government that was determined to murder you and other citizens like you. Yet, those evil governments still take guns away from the people they plan on killing. Why? Sure, you could say some of their soldiers are going to get killed if the victims can shoot back, but that isn't the argument the anti gunners make.....besides, soldiers can be replaced, why go to the trouble of taking guns away from the target populations? Just send in the troops and murder them...righ?

You only have put some Psychos in charge of the killing squads of normal people to do murder. Read the Diary of a German solider who was force to shoot Jews. Still bothers him until he died.