CDZ I don't know whether Hodgkinson actually sought to kill someone.

Discussion in 'Clean Debate Zone' started by Xelor, Jun 14, 2017.

  1. Divine.Wind
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    Divine.Wind Platinum Member Gold Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    While I agree he wanted to kill, I fail to see why selecting an AK or an AR makes much difference. Both are well known to be excellent combat rifles and excellent weapons in the field.

    That said, I'm a AK fan since it, along with the SKS, are better hog hunting rifles than the AR with it's puny 5.56. :)

    Img_1243.jpg
     
  2. Stasha_Sz
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    Stasha_Sz Gold Member

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    Hi Xelor, the M4 is a version of the Stoner M16 family. The M4 is the current issue to the US military and its allies. One can be identified vis-à-vis the M16 by the telescoping butt-stock and shorter barrel. It is described as a "carbine" which is the name of a short rifle. Functionally, the M4 and M16 operate the same and fire the same round from the same magazine. Besides the size, the M4 also has a burst fire setting, which the M16 does not.
    While what the shooter was firing may have looked like an M4, it most certainly was not one. The civilian versions fire only on semi-automatic.
    They are a rifle/carbine
    Semi-automatic
    Velocity would vary by round & caliber, for this exercise, the civilian load for an 5.56mm round is close enough to the military round to be moot for this discussion, not sure if the round is FMJ/HP/SP, though the differences in velocity would be minor, the differences in damage may be greater.
    Does this help?
     
  3. Iceweasel
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    Iceweasel Diamond Member

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    I heard it was a 7.76 SKS.
     
  4. Xelor
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    Xelor Gold Member

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    I didn't because I was reading very quickly and saw only one question mark, and I didn't think you seriously wanted me to answer the question "You know what else I may have not seen in your OP?" Obviously, as you've written "questions," plural, I was mistaken. So....
    No. There is no way I can know what you may have not seen anywhere or at anytime.

    What follows is how I define "professional":
    • Professionals, thus, are governed minimally by their professions' codes of ethics and other standards, and profess commitment to high competence, integrity and morality, altruism, and the promotion of the public good within their expert domain. In turn, professionals are thus accountable to those who they serve directly, their clients, and to society in general. A “professional” is someone who derives earns their living by selling their intellectual expertise or specific talents in a given discipline. This is in contrast with a hobbyist or amateur who may occasionally receive compensation for their work in a given discipline, but doing so isn't how they primarily and actively earn a living. Also, a professional is an active member in good standing of a profession. A profession is a disciplined group of individuals who adhere to a clearly defined and publicly disclosed set of ethical and work-product delivery standards. This group positions itself as possessing special knowledge and skills in a widely recognised body of learning derived from research, education and training at a high level, and is recognised by the public as such.
      • Professionals have a sense of history; they live neither in the past nor completely in the present and they see the future as an outgrowth of, thus part of, the present and the past. Accordingly, a professional doesn't repeat the mistakes of the past and yet s/he eschews the hubris that overly discounts the lessons of the past. In short, a professional maintains a mental and practical perspective whereby s/he does not, in their discipline suffer from myopia, s/he does not "wear" blinders
      • .Professionals recognize emerging and ebbing patterns resulting from the interdependence of time, place, person and space.
      • Professionals focus on achieving goals through cooperation rather than doing so in isolation.
      • Professionals have an acute awareness of the nature of complexity in the world, his/her and humanity's knowledge about that world, thus about their work. Professionals know they don't know everything, are neither diminished nor intimidated by that. Accordingly, professionals are not reticent to say "I don't know," and they know how to "find out whatever" if/when need be.
      • Professionals continuously work on their own personal and professional development, in terms of raw knowledge, understanding it, and increasing their sagacity -- in general and in specific areas -- as a result of having done so. In other words, a professional never stops training and learning. For a professional, life is a matter of what to learn about, learn to do, what to think about, discover, etc. next. The journey doesn't end.
    In a prior post, I shared my professional status. If you want to know more, click here.
     
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  5. Xelor
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    Xelor Gold Member

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    Yes. It tells me that for the scope and context you've likely addressed in the remainder of the post I have to finish reading that the differences between the M4 and the M16 don't matter and that if I find you have written something that doesn't align with the similarities and differences you've just above noted they may matter and that I should ask about them (or do some research of my own) if I determine that they do to me seem to matter.
     
  6. westwall
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    westwall USMB Mod Staff Member Gold Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    Not suitable for CDZ. Moved to Current Events.
     
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  7. Xelor
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    Xelor Gold Member

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    TY for the discussion about guns. Unfortunately, none of what you wrote in post 31 helps me understand which among Hodgkinson's "behaviors or statements, in your professional opinion, indicate/suggest the man meant to do "X" rather than "Y," where "X" and "Y" are any of the options offered explicitly in my OP's bulleted list of options, or implicitly in the thread title.

    Of course, I can infer that by his having obtained and fired at people an M4-like gun, Hodgkinson minimally intended to harm someone. Should I instead from those two actions and their objects be of the mind that killing somebody is the only outcome one can soundly infer Hodgkinson had?
    Based on my having read that Hodgkinson used an "M4-like" gun, I knew that, unless the writer was a poor or sloppy one, Hodgkinson didn't use an M4. The article I read didn't discuss the manner and extent to which Hodgkinson's weapon is like an M4, so I don't know whether appearance is among the two weapons' homologous traits.
     
  8. Two Thumbs
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    Two Thumbs Platinum Member

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    He was clearly trying to murder republicans.

    the fact that this is the spin only means that the dnc and their media cronies know that the run of the mill dem is dumber than

    than


    well, I can't think of anything that could be that dumb.
     
  9. Chuz Life
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    Chuz Life Gold Member

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    Some people just can't shoot for shit . . .

    Especially when the shit is hitting the fan.

    The North Hollywood shootout, . . . Both perpetrators were killed, twelve police officers and eight civilians were injured, and numerous vehicles and other property were damaged or destroyed by the nearly 2,000 rounds of ammunition fired by the robbers and police.[1]


     

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