I don’t get the narrative the Democrats are trying with old America

[rightwinger]

you understand the "government" is made up of the people of this country?
so GOVERNMENT didn't force anything...you live in the wrong country

Yes I do. But it was the same "people" who were enforcing segregation, restricting open access to employment of women and is now securing rights for gays

You can't play it both ways with the government. You can't claim they are useless and do nothing and then when they do, claim that the governement is just the people anyway

But the government was not needed to have new laws. We just needed them to remove laws and enforce laws in the books. Society was already growing up. It was already changing. Government just jumped in to make more laws to win votes.

Yes, the Government made new laws and started enforcing old ones. That is the role of Government

In this case, the Government stood up for the rights of a minority against oppression from the majority. That is also a role of Government

 

[ClosedCaption]

Oh and America is number one...Number 1 in the number of fat asses and Number 1 in the number of citizens in Prison

Woot!

 

[rdean]

Have Democrats truly been able to convince people that America of old was truly an awful place? We are talking about the top country in the world. We are talking about a country where everyone wished they could be. We are talking about one of the most successful nations of all times. How can anyone be dumb enough to believe it was a failure?

So the Democrats are selling that America of old was a failure and they want to offer what every other country has as a fix? This makes no sense either seeing that people in those other countries wanted to come here. True with Obama that has decreased because we are getting closer to what they already have. The Democrats are successfully destroying this country and making it like every other country. I mean no country has had as much success as America in its prime nor have they even come close.

I can’t see how so many people are buying this narrative? We are talking almost half the country. Are there that many people with blinders on? I just don’t get it. Do they not know what the reality is of these other countries people like Michael Moore try to put out as successful. I mean come on they have to know people risk their lives in dinky little boats just to get out of Cuba. Come on what gives?

Are you talking about slavery times or when the elderly were homeless and lived off cat food? Or some time in between? And can you name that time?

When it comes to Cuba, it's a matter of perspective. Better here doesn't mean "great" here. You can always make things better, but Conservative and Republican policies have ruined the economy and killed and maimed tens of thousands of young Americans for no reason even they can name. And their solution is to crush the middle class.

Are you sure you've thought this through?

 

[miami_thomas]

It had everything to do with the government. The government forced integration, the government forced equal rights for women, the government forced civil rights and affirmative action

All were fought by conservatives and the states rights crowd. It was only after years of forced integration that people came around and said.....Blacks can do this job, women can do this job, other religions are not so bad

No it didn’t. It had everything to do with the citizens of the United States allowing it. If they did not want it, they would have put people in office that would have prevented this from happening. Government wants you to think you can’t do it without them. They want you to need them so they can have control. Last how is someone free if they are to be forced by the government? All those things were gained by citizens standing up and not the government. In fact the government got in the way many times.

We would not have gotten civil rights without the government. The "people" had a hundred years to resolve the role of blacks in this country. They couldn't do it. It took the courts (non elected) and the Federal Government to force the issue. People fought it, many still do. Most eventually realized it was not that big a deal after all

They were doing it. Sure it was a battle but growing up is always a battle. But it was happening without government. You do realize the first black congressman was in 1868 and the first black senator was in 1870. The first black federal judge was in 1901. Those were long before the government got involved. Society grew up and that is why those things happened. It had nothing to do with the government and everything to do with the people in the government.

 

[miami_thomas]

America is on the same path it's been on since the industrial revolution - Corporatocracy. If you don't see this, you're blind. If you're all enveloped with the passions of right vs. left and shit - you're had.

Didnt get much of a response with this huh? Not surprised

I responded.

 

[miami_thomas]

Yes I do. But it was the same "people" who were enforcing segregation, restricting open access to employment of women and is now securing rights for gays

You can't play it both ways with the government. You can't claim they are useless and do nothing and then when they do, claim that the governement is just the people anyway

But the government was not needed to have new laws. We just needed them to remove laws and enforce laws in the books. Society was already growing up. It was already changing. Government just jumped in to make more laws to win votes.

Yes, the Government made new laws and started enforcing old ones. That is the role of Government

In this case, the Government stood up for the rights of a minority against oppression from the majority. That is also a role of Government

Again if the majority did not want it, it never would have happened. Don't be that guy. Politicians want votes and if the majority of America had not wanted this it would have never been allowed to happen. Thing is it did not have to happen as things were already changing without government having to be involved. Only they wanted votes so they felt they could win votes by taking action.

You are correct that is the problem with government. They are there so they always think they have to do something. They have to make some law. Their very existence causes us citizens problems.

 

[G.T.]

America is on the same path it's been on since the industrial revolution - Corporatocracy. If you don't see this, you're blind. If you're all enveloped with the passions of right vs. left and shit - you're had.

Didnt get much of a response with this huh? Not surprised

I responded.

You responded with common-sense statements and implied that I wouldn't have known otherwise, which is a great subversion of rational discussion.

the fact is, the Government is taken over by big money, and big money comes from big corporate interests.

This is not even hidden anymore, it's out in the wide open - so to not acknowledge it and be a bit peeved about it, is to have fallen for the "look over there, at the left! look over there, at the right!" subversion tactic they play you overtly political types with, like a fiddle.

You honestly think Boehner sits and has a beer with Obama taking pictures and giggling - really thinks Obama is evil and destroying the country at the same time? Grow up, if so.

 

[miami_thomas]

Oh and America is number one...Number 1 in the number of fat asses and Number 1 in the number of citizens in Prison

Woot!

Yes and Democrats trying to get rid of morals and destroy family values really has been a great help. Thanks for playing.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

America of old was not an awful place for most. But we are a better society today by far

Liberals have made this a better country

Yeah, that 1/6 of Americans on public assistance, credit downgrades, $5,000,000,000,000 new debt in 3 years, 40+ months of 8%+ unemployment, no growth, worthless U.S. $ is an awesome thing.

Thanks, thanks a lot.

 

[G.T.]

Oh and America is number one...Number 1 in the number of fat asses and Number 1 in the number of citizens in Prison

Woot!

Yes and Democrats trying to get rid of morals and destroy family values really has been a great help. Thanks for playing.

oh gosh.


Nevermind on any of the discussion we were having.

 

[G.T.]

America of old was not an awful place for most. But we are a better society today by far

Liberals have made this a better country

Yeah, that 1/6 of Americans on public assistance, credit downgrades, $5,000,000,000,000 new debt in 3 years, 40+ months of 8%+ unemployment, no growth, worthless U.S. $ is an awesome thing.

Thanks, thanks a lot.

Unemployment is supposed to be controlled by self-sufficient entrepreneurs. Where's all the hard working risk-takers? Certainly not *not* taking risks because of Government & taxes, whereas they actually had testicles when tax rates were 90%? Amiright?

 

[miami_thomas]

Have Democrats truly been able to convince people that America of old was truly an awful place? We are talking about the top country in the world. We are talking about a country where everyone wished they could be. We are talking about one of the most successful nations of all times. How can anyone be dumb enough to believe it was a failure?

So the Democrats are selling that America of old was a failure and they want to offer what every other country has as a fix? This makes no sense either seeing that people in those other countries wanted to come here. True with Obama that has decreased because we are getting closer to what they already have. The Democrats are successfully destroying this country and making it like every other country. I mean no country has had as much success as America in its prime nor have they even come close.

I can’t see how so many people are buying this narrative? We are talking almost half the country. Are there that many people with blinders on? I just don’t get it. Do they not know what the reality is of these other countries people like Michael Moore try to put out as successful. I mean come on they have to know people risk their lives in dinky little boats just to get out of Cuba. Come on what gives?

Are you talking about slavery times or when the elderly were homeless and lived off cat food? Or some time in between? And can you name that time?

When it comes to Cuba, it's a matter of perspective. Better here doesn't mean "great" here. You can always make things better, but Conservative and Republican policies have ruined the economy and killed and maimed tens of thousands of young Americans for no reason even they can name. And their solution is to crush the middle class.

Are you sure you've thought this through?

Again read other comments in regard to the dumb slavery comment. As far as homeless living off cat food that is just plain dumb. That has not been the case since prior to the 1920s. Charities and churches provide for the poor. There is no perspective when it comes to Cuba. It is a God awful place and the people there that are not in the government live in hell. When you always try to make things better you can make things worse. Sometimes you have to do less to make things better especially when it comes to Government. Government is the ones not to be trusted not some evil corporation. Government has always been the enemy of freedom not the deliverer of freedom.

 

[Moonglow]

They didn't have to pass laws. All they had to do was enforce the laws protecting people. Eventually society would have grown up past the point. In fact the majority of the country had already changed at the time the government had got involved. I guarantee you if most of the country was against it then the laws would not have been passed. They want you to think people need the government to do these things. And as you can tell by your response they got you believing it as well.

Really, so the gay have the right to marriage already?

First society is still growing up. Second, Gays can get married they just want it recognized by the government. Why does the government have to recognize any marriage? Marriage is a religious thing that the government should get out of the middle of. As far as tax breaks for married couples, that did not work. It did not prevent a single family from breaking up. So get rid of it.

Why? Taxes(married gays want the status as hereto's). the right to marry is not a religious issue, you can be married without any religional influence, I have, twice.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

I think the Democrat narrative for 2012 seems to be that Ann Romney rides horses and that Mitt Romney is rich and kills cancer patients.

 

[G.T.]

I think the Democrat narrative for 2012 seems to be that Ann Romney rides horses, Mitt Romney is rich and kills cancer patients.

Yes, grown up, they all met in their secret room and conspired together to make the Superpac ad. all tens of millions of them.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

I think the Democrat narrative for 2012 seems to be that Ann Romney rides horses, Mitt Romney is rich and kills cancer patients.

Yes, grown up, they all met in their secret room and conspired together to make the Superpac ad. all tens of millions of them.

I doubt that, but most of you guys sure embrace the message...

 

[rightwinger]

No it didn’t. It had everything to do with the citizens of the United States allowing it. If they did not want it, they would have put people in office that would have prevented this from happening. Government wants you to think you can’t do it without them. They want you to need them so they can have control. Last how is someone free if they are to be forced by the government? All those things were gained by citizens standing up and not the government. In fact the government got in the way many times.

We would not have gotten civil rights without the government. The "people" had a hundred years to resolve the role of blacks in this country. They couldn't do it. It took the courts (non elected) and the Federal Government to force the issue. People fought it, many still do. Most eventually realized it was not that big a deal after all

They were doing it. Sure it was a battle but growing up is always a battle. But it was happening without government. You do realize the first black congressman was in 1868 and the first black senator was in 1870. The first black federal judge was in 1901. Those were long before the government got involved. Society grew up and that is why those things happened. It had nothing to do with the government and everything to do with the people in the government.

Learn your history. The black congressmen, senators and politicians were a result of reconstruction. They were forced on the people of the south and helped lead to the emergence of the clan. It had nothing to do with newfound liberalism in the south and everything to do with punitive reconstruction. Led to Jim Crow laws

After the Civil War we had 100 years to resolve the issue of blacks in America. Society on its own could not do it. It took a small group of protestors and the strength of the Federal Government to force the issue

 

[squeeze berry]

HA! Why did they have to pass laws to allow minorities the same rights as the WASP's

They didn't have to pass laws. All they had to do was enforce the laws protecting people. Eventually society would have grown up past the point. In fact the majority of the country had already changed at the time the government had got involved. I guarantee you if most of the country was against it then the laws would not have been passed. They want you to think people need the government to do these things. And as you can tell by your response they got you believing it as well.

Really, so the gay have the right to marriage already?

my GF and I are co-habitating.
We were able to get a mortgage and HE loan together. We have not sufferd b/c we are not married, quite the opposite. There are zero fights over money b/c her paycheck belongs to her and my paycheck belongs to me.

We split the bills amicably.

perhaps gays are better off in the long run not being married. Marriage is over-rated.

BTW, the state we live in has a law that prohibits co-habitation for unmarried heterosexual couples. It's OK for gays to live together however.

So don't tell me about how the poor gays are all that bad off.

 

[miami_thomas]

Didnt get much of a response with this huh? Not surprised

I responded.

You responded with common-sense statements and implied that I wouldn't have known otherwise, which is a great subversion of rational discussion.

the fact is, the Government is taken over by big money, and big money comes from big corporate interests.

This is not even hidden anymore, it's out in the wide open - so to not acknowledge it and be a bit peeved about it, is to have fallen for the "look over there, at the left! look over there, at the right!" subversion tactic they play you overtly political types with, like a fiddle.

You honestly think Boehner sits and has a beer with Obama taking pictures and giggling - really thinks Obama is evil and destroying the country at the same time? Grow up, if so.

Democrats have been supposedly fighting big bad corporations for how long? Yet corporations are still doing fine. It is the small business that has paid the price for this battle. Second the big things that have hit corporations negatively would not have happened if what you say is true. In fact if what you say is true then it could never happen because they already run everything. The fact is that it is a lie. It is an excuse to give more power to the government to protect us from the big evil corporations. Fear is the way government uses to get us to give away our freedoms. To “Protect Us” But at the end of the day it is the government people should fear. People will always have a way to attack a corporation and prevent it from truly taking over; however, you have no recourse against the government. Once it has total control it is all over.

 

[G.T.]

I think the Democrat narrative for 2012 seems to be that Ann Romney rides horses, Mitt Romney is rich and kills cancer patients.

Yes, grown up, they all met in their secret room and conspired together to make the Superpac ad. all tens of millions of them.

I doubt that, but most of you guys sure embrace the message...

Who? the 15 or so probable D's on here, or the 10-20 D commentators you read or hear about daily........................................out of TENS OF MILLIONS? so like, 0.0000583%?

you sure you don't fall for propoganda? Absolutely POSITIVE you don't?