"I am not telling you how to vote, but ... "

[Shattered]

I know people who work at Walmart and I don't think 10 bucks an hour for running a cash register is low pay.

That's just it.. $10 an hour for simply dragging items across a scanner is NOT low pay. They don't even have to think to do that.. The register counts the change for them. Reread my post. I wasn't saying they were underpaid.. In fact, I think a lot of them are overpaid for the job they do.

 

[CA95380]

I heard that "some" Some Muslim workers at Target refuse to handle pork products and will not scan them at the registers - I think I heard that "some" Walmart employees, refuse to also

 

[Shogun]

I fully support employees forming unions. Not the bureaucracy they tend to become but the representation for labor that they are in the face of chicken necked capitalist greed anyway. Wal mart is one piece of the fucked up economy puzzle anyway. It's like a fucking wide open siv facilitating our addiction to cheap plastic shit from china. This is why Tarrifing the fuck out of imports is important.




Made in the U.S.A?
Despite a well-publicized "Made in the U.S.A." campaign, 85 percent of the stores' items are made overseas, often in Third World sweatshops. In fact, only after Wal-Mart's "Buy American" ad campaign was in full swing did the company become the country's largest importer of Chinese goods in any industry. By taking its orders abroad, Wal-Mart has forced many U.S. manufacturers out of business. The chain was broadly criticized for being the primary distributor of many goods attracting controversy, including Kathie Lee Gifford's clothing line, Disney's Haitian-made pajamas, child-produced clothing from Bangladesh and sweatshop-produced toys and sports gear from Asia. Difficult working conditions also exist in the United States: In 1991, labor inspectors found labels for Wal-Mart brands being made in Manhattan's Chinatown. There, 16 and 17 year-old Chinese immigrants without permits had been working for one month without being paid.
PBS - STORE WARS: Wal-Mart Business Practices


Union: Wal-Mart `Buy American' program is a sham
Wal-Mart is the only retailer in the country with "Buy American" as a central feature of its marketing program. The reason others don't is that they are afraid of being caught in a lie. Wal-Mart, the Arkansas-based mass merchandiser, is different. Wal-Mart officials don't care. They just continue to repeat patriotic slogans while they scour the world for ever cheaper sources of cheap, exploited labor.

With annual sales of more than $100 billion, this retail behemoth still has American flags hanging strategically all over its stores and posts a large photograph trimmed in red, white and blue of workers from a U.S. company where Wal-Mart claims it created 30 jobs. Its "Bring It Home to the USA" slogan can be found looking down on aisles full of imported products. If it were a sincere program, our union, United Food and Commercial Workers Local 1444, and its members would be praising Wal-Mart instead of criticizing the company. So would workers everywhere in this country, because what America needs desperately are more and better-paying jobs.
Union: Wal-Mart `Buy American' program is a sham - The Business Journal of Milwaukee:



THIS is what listening to free market capitalists telling you that they know more about economics than you gets you.

 

[Jeepers]

I heard that "some" Some Muslim workers at Target refuse to handle pork products and will not scan them at the registers - I think I heard that "some" Walmart employees, refuse to also

Yeah.. well I hear that christians wont sell condoms and birthcontrol at mainstream drug stores..

 

[Shattered]

I heard that "some" Some Muslim workers at Target refuse to handle pork products and will not scan them at the registers - I think I heard that "some" Walmart employees, refuse to also

Yeah.. well I hear that christians wont sell condoms and birthcontrol at mainstream drug stores..

These are all people that need to change their line of work. If your religion prohibits you from doing something, then obviously you have no business taking a job that infringes on that belief.

 

[Prefx]

That's just it.. $10 an hour for simply dragging items across a scanner is NOT low pay. They don't even have to think to do that.. The register counts the change for them. Reread my post. I wasn't saying they were underpaid.. In fact, I think a lot of them are overpaid for the job they do.

Retail expects a level of costumer and service involvement not found in most markets. You're not factoring in the lack of benefits and lopsided work hours - front end employees at WalMart are especially strained through hours and underemployment. When I was younger I worked for Kroger (unionized) as a cashier, and I found the job more reprehensible than my first job as a groomer/pet carer in PetSmart (try washing and clipping two bipolar dogs, and having to care for the corpse of dead dogs). We had benefits, but the average pay for a cashier was $6.50. I can tell you from my experience in retail that cashiers do not "just" pass food over a scanner, and this attidue really infuriates me - it's part of the reason I'll gladly defend retail workers whenever a nasty customer comes around. They oftentimes have the responsibilities of a janitor, bagger, and stocker. There are speeds you must go (which is really inconvenient, because customers always have that one thing they forgot). You deal with incompetent higher ups who refuse to accept your excuses for not selling their credit card in less than 30 seconds. New cashiers are expected to learn at least a hundred PLUs (4011 makes for a good joke amongst cashiers. "Is that a 4011 in your pocket, or are you just happy to see me?"). Sometimes late at night you will be the only front-end service person around and there will be a line that literally creates a fire hazard. Coupons are absolutely atrocious. You learn a lot about people from their use of coupons. Some will give you them upfront and remind you about their existence every three seconds. Others will throw them onto the conveyor belt, not realizing they can get caught beneath that machina. The worst can be found in people who wait to the last moment. If they forget before the transaction is complete, they'll yell for you to get management (as if that does anything - management oftentimes tells you to not remind customers of coupons).

So please don't try to pass off the excuse that they're overpaid. Retail is one of the most stressful experiences anyone could have (next to food service - and don't get me started there). The fact people work 40 hours a work for the biggest American corporation only to get $20,000 - which is scarily close to the country's average - is despicable.. If wages had kept up with growth, a minimum wage job in America shouldn't be less than $15/hour. Just look at the growth rate for executive salaries and wealth.

$20,000 a year in most places is pauper change. Bills from insurance, rent, and health care would easily wipe over half that out, and food/car expenses another couple thousand.

A better solution than building up unions would be ending all the assistance corporations get from the state. The same assistance they've been getting since feudalism became obsolete: no personhood protection, no subsidization, no special tax loopholes, no incorporation process - period. Corporations are the most destructive form of business, and in a natural market cooperatives would beat them into the ground.

 

[dilloduck]

Retail expects a level of costumer and service involvement not found in most markets. You're not factoring in the lack of benefits and lopsided work hours - front end employees at WalMart are especially strained through hours and underemployment. When I was younger I worked for Kroger (unionized) as a cashier, and I found the job more reprehensible than my first job as a groomer/pet carer in PetSmart (try washing and clipping two bipolar dogs, and having to care for the corpse of dead dogs). We had benefits, but the average pay for a cashier was $6.50. I can tell you from my experience in retail that cashiers do not "just" pass food over a scanner, and this attidue really infuriates me - it's part of the reason I'll gladly defend retail workers whenever a nasty customer comes around. They oftentimes have the responsibilities of a janitor, bagger, and stocker. There are speeds you must go (which is really inconvenient, because customers always have that one thing they forgot). You deal with incompetent higher ups who refuse to accept your excuses for not selling their credit card in less than 30 seconds. New cashiers are expected to learn at least a hundred PLUs (4011 makes for a good joke amongst cashiers. "Is that a 4011 in your pocket, or are you just happy to see me?). Sometimes late at night you will be the only front-end service person around and there will be a line that literally creates a fire hazard. So please don't try to pass off the excuse that they're overemployed. Retail is one of the most stressful experiences anyone could have (next to food service - and don't get me started there). The fact people work 40 hours a work for the biggest American corporation only to get $20,000 - which is scarily close to the country's average - is despicable.. If wages had kept up with growth, a minimum wage job in America shouldn't be less than $15/hour. Just look at the growth rate for executive salaries and wealth.

$20,000 a year in most places is pauper change. Bills from insurance, rent, and health care would easily wipe over half that out, and food/car expenses another couple thousand.

Isn't where you work voluntary--why aren't these people going for the exec positions ?

 

[Shattered]

Retail expects a level of costumer and service involvement not found in most markets. You're not factoring in the lack of benefits and lopsided work hours - front end employees at WalMart are especially strained through hours and underemployment. When I was younger I worked for Kroger (unionized) as a cashier, and I found the job more reprehensible than my first job as a groomer/pet carer in PetSmart (try washing and clipping two bipolar dogs, and having to care for the corpse of dead dogs). We had benefits, but the average pay for a cashier was $6.50. I can tell you from my experience in retail that cashiers do not "just" pass food over a scanner, and this attidue really infuriates me - it's part of the reason I'll gladly defend retail workers whenever a nasty customer comes around. They oftentimes have the responsibilities of a janitor, bagger, and stocker. There are speeds you must go (which is really inconvenient, because customers always have that one thing they forgot). You deal with incompetent higher ups who refuse to accept your excuses for not selling their credit card in less than 30 seconds. New cashiers are expected to learn at least a hundred PLUs (4011 makes for a good joke amongst cashiers. "Is that a 4011 in your pocket, or are you just happy to see me?). Sometimes late at night you will be the only front-end service person around and there will be a line that literally creates a fire hazard. So please don't try to pass off the excuse that they're overemployed. Retail is one of the most stressful experiences anyone could have (next to food service - and don't get me started there). Coupons are absolutely atrocious. You learn a lot about people from their use of coupons. Some will give you them upfront and remind you about their existence every three seconds. Others will throw them onto the conveyor belt, not realizing they can get caught beneath that machina. The worst can be found in people who wait to the last moment. If they forget before the transaction is complete, they'll yell for you to get management (as if that does anything - management oftentimes tells you to not remind customers of coupons). The fact people work 40 hours a work for the biggest American corporation only to get $20,000 - which is scarily close to the country's average - is despicable.. If wages had kept up with growth, a minimum wage job in America shouldn't be less than $15/hour. Just look at the growth rate for executive salaries and wealth.

$20,000 a year in most places is pauper change. Bills from insurance, rent, and health care would easily wipe over half that out, and food/car expenses another couple thousand.

A better solution than building up unions would be ending all the assistance corporations get from the state. The same assistance they've been getting since feudalism became obsolete: no personhood protection, no subsidization, no special tax loopholes, no incorporation process - period. Corporations are the most destructive form of business, and in a natural market cooperatives would beat them into the ground.

Here's a clue for you.. If you don't want to deail with "cranky" customers, and have to bag items as well as scan them, and wait on people, then pick another job. MOST people pick these jobs because they figure they can do a minimal amount of actual work for a decent amount of money, and don't bother striving to do any better. That's THEIR fault. USE your education to pursue another career choice. What exactly do you think someone with no education, no social skills, and an ingrained sense of laziness SHOULD be making?

 

[Chris]

Retail expects a level of costumer and service involvement not found in most markets. You're not factoring in the lack of benefits and lopsided work hours - front end employees at WalMart are especially strained through hours and underemployment. When I was younger I worked for Kroger (unionized) as a cashier, and I found the job more reprehensible than my first job as a groomer/pet carer in PetSmart (try washing and clipping two bipolar dogs, and having to care for the corpse of dead dogs). We had benefits, but the average pay for a cashier was $6.50. I can tell you from my experience in retail that cashiers do not "just" pass food over a scanner, and this attidue really infuriates me - it's part of the reason I'll gladly defend retail workers whenever a nasty customer comes around. They oftentimes have the responsibilities of a janitor, bagger, and stocker. There are speeds you must go (which is really inconvenient, because customers always have that one thing they forgot). You deal with incompetent higher ups who refuse to accept your excuses for not selling their credit card in less than 30 seconds. New cashiers are expected to learn at least a hundred PLUs (4011 makes for a good joke amongst cashiers. "Is that a 4011 in your pocket, or are you just happy to see me?"). Sometimes late at night you will be the only front-end service person around and there will be a line that literally creates a fire hazard. Coupons are absolutely atrocious. You learn a lot about people from their use of coupons. Some will give you them upfront and remind you about their existence every three seconds. Others will throw them onto the conveyor belt, not realizing they can get caught beneath that machina. The worst can be found in people who wait to the last moment. If they forget before the transaction is complete, they'll yell for you to get management (as if that does anything - management oftentimes tells you to not remind customers of coupons).

So please don't try to pass off the excuse that they're overpaid. Retail is one of the most stressful experiences anyone could have (next to food service - and don't get me started there). The fact people work 40 hours a work for the biggest American corporation only to get $20,000 - which is scarily close to the country's average - is despicable.. If wages had kept up with growth, a minimum wage job in America shouldn't be less than $15/hour. Just look at the growth rate for executive salaries and wealth.

$20,000 a year in most places is pauper change. Bills from insurance, rent, and health care would easily wipe over half that out, and food/car expenses another couple thousand.

A better solution than building up unions would be ending all the assistance corporations get from the state. The same assistance they've been getting since feudalism became obsolete: no personhood protection, no subsidization, no special tax loopholes, no incorporation process - period. Corporations are the most destructive form of business, and in a natural market cooperatives would beat them into the ground.

Nice post. I am all for getting rid of welfare, corporate and individual.

 

[Prefx]

Isn't where you work voluntary--why aren't these people going for the exec positions ?

Beyond incremental pay increases, which are tacked onto responcibility not fit for anything less than $15, you don't work your way up a retail corporation. You enter into it. Supervisors and managers either stagnate, or they're sacked. You have a better chance of keeping your job if you've only been working for a few weeks than you do working for years.

Truthfully, the claim of exclusive rights to land is an authoritarian act (you didn't create the land). Those without claim to property should be compensated for others' use of resources. The monopolization of land needs to end.

People enter the market at a natural disadvantage for simply not having access to resources. This should end. I should also point out most executives (85%+) come from families with wealth numbers that would put them in the top 10%. The "American dream" is a noble goal, but as it currently exists under a system of monopolies (money, ideas, land, state) - it doesn't work.

USE your education to pursue another career choice.

Most retail jobs are held by people close to retirement, or exceptionally young (>25). At this time in their lives career choices aren't open. They're putting up with economic rent enacted on them by land monopolies.

then pick another job.

Clearly not so easy, as most entering the market could tell you. It's not a choice of better or worse. It's a choice of one form of a crap or another form. If you need benefits, go to Kroger. If you need a higher wage, go to Target or Wal-Mart.

Almost all markets are oligopolies, and this fact is reflected in the labor market.

and an ingrained sense of laziness SHOULD be making?

Your bias and ignorance towards retail workers is duly noted. I had supervisors making $11 for 45+ hours of work each week.

no social skills

The fact retail workers aren't laughing at their customers should be social skills enough. I'm quite amused by this remark for the simple reason that management never knew how to address customers. I remember one fine autumn night, working late at night, a young woman came to me (with her baby) wanting to purchase baby food. The scanner said it couldn't be bought with the food stamps, although clearly it could. I ask my manager what I should do after struggling with it for 10 minutes. His remark: I don't know. You figure it out.

Then he left.

I'll just say I wasn't going to let company policy trump this girl's need for baby food.

 

[Gunny]

Reduces the financial burden? By selling crappy merchandise and paying low wages?

Target is a better value, and they are Democrats.

What does Target being "Democrats" (a ridiculous assertion to begin with) have to do with anything? That's a last resort place for me to begin with, but thanks for giving me another reason to not go there.

 

[Chris]

My favorite comment by a manager I worked for......

He was trying to calm an irate customer, and I overheard him say to the customer, "Mr. Jones we don't want lose the revenue stream that you represent."

Later that year he fired me on the day after Christmas. It was the best thing that ever happened to me.

 

[Shattered]

Beyond incremental pay increases, which are tacked onto responcibility not fit for anything less than $15, you don't work your way up a retail corporation. You enter into it. Supervisors and managers either stagnate, or they're sacked. You have a better chance of keeping your job if you've only been working for a few weeks than you do working for years.

Truthfully, the claim of exclusive rights to land is an authoritarian act (you didn't create the land). Those without claim to property should be compensated for others' use of resources. The monopolization of land needs to end.

People enter the market at a natural disadvantage for simply not having access to resources. This should end. I should also point out most executives (85%+) come from families with wealth numbers that would put them in the top 10%. The "American dream" is a noble goal, but as it currently exists under a system of monopolies (money, ideas, land, state) - it doesn't work.



Most retail jobs are held by people close to retirement, or exceptionally young (>25). At this time in their lives career choices aren't open. They're putting up with economic rent enacted on them by land monopolies.



Clearly not so easy, as most entering the market could tell you. It's not a choice of better or worse. It's a choice of one form of a crap or another form. If you need benefits, go to Kroger. If you need a higher wage, go to Target or Wal-Mart.

Almost all markets are oligopolies, and this fact is reflected in the labor market.



Your bias and ignorance towards retail workers is duly noted. I had supervisors making $11 for 45+ hours of work each week.



The fact retail workers aren't laughing at their customers should be social skills enough. I'm quite amused by this remark for the simple reason that management never knew how to address customers. I remember one fine autumn night, working late at night, a young woman came to me (with her baby) wanting to purchase baby food. The scanner said it couldn't be bought with the food stamps, although clearly it could. I ask my manager what I should do after struggling with it for 10 minutes. His remark: I don't know. You figure it out.

Then he left.

I'll just say I wasn't going to let company policy trump this girl's need for baby food.

Having worked retail, I'm hardly biased. Your attitude toward live, and the public dictates what type of retail job you hold, if that's your choice. There's good retail, and there's crappy retail, and only YOU can make that decision. If you can't fill out a simple job application in complete, and legible detail, you're going to end up at the likes of Walmart. Customer service skills, and a better attitude will likely land you behind the jewelry counter at a higher end department store.

You make your own choices in life. Having dealt with the ammbition of the typical Walmart employee, I stand by my original assessment that one gets what one is qualified for.

 

[Gunny]

You right cats are proof that even the smartest and saneist of people can be easily duped and manipulated using the right techniques of coersion... Its actually almost worth getting a job there just to see how much pressure they put on their employees to vote in any particular way...

Sure thing because we KNOW the unions don't put pressure on to vote left. You left cats are proof that even the smartest and sanest of people can be easily duped and manipulated using the right techniques of coersion.

But it's NOT worth joing the union to watch.

Pot calling the kettle black.

Interestingly enough. I've never worked anywhere that politics were discussed any higher than the individual level. As it should be. If there was a good conservative candidate I planned to vote for and the place I worked put pressure on me to vote for him, I'd STILL resent it and find another job.

 

[Chris]

What does Target being "Democrats" (a ridiculous assertion to begin with) have to do with anything? That's a last resort place for me to begin with, but thanks for giving me another reason to not go there.

I was wrong. You are correct. Actually WalMart has contributed more to Dems than Target. WalMart still sucks though.

Here is the list of retail contributions. I love OpenSecrets....

Retail Sales: Top Contributors to Federal Candidates and Parties | OpenSecrets

 

[Gunny]

I heard that "some" Some Muslim workers at Target refuse to handle pork products and will not scan them at the registers - I think I heard that "some" Walmart employees, refuse to also

If they cannot perform the job(s) they are hired to do, fire them.

And before any of you lefties get on here talking shit about THAT statement, do reconcile what you are thinking of saying with the wailing and gnashing of teeth y'all went through when some religious fanatic at a pharmacy refused to dispense the pill.

 

[CA95380]

These are all people that need to change their line of work. If your religion prohibits you from doing something, then obviously you have no business taking a job that infringes on that belief.

If they cannot perform the job(s) they are hired to do, fire them.

Exactly! Well said.

 

[Shattered]

Exactly! Well said.

On the flip side, if you so desperately need that particular job, you suck it up and do what's required to meet the demands of that job.

 

[Gunny]

I was wrong. You are correct. Actually WalMart has contributed more to Dems than Target. WalMart still sucks though.

Here is the list of retail contributions. I love OpenSecrets....

Retail Sales: Top Contributors to Federal Candidates and Parties | OpenSecrets

I don't care how they vote. Corporations are naturally going to vote for whoever is going to give that corporation the most breaks in taxes and levies. Juast as individuals do the same.

If WalMart is nonunion and imports most of its merchandise, voting Democrat doesn't appear to be in WalMart's best interest.

WalMart DOES suck and it's usually an emergency run for me to have to go there. Otherwise, I support the local grocery store chain because the quality of merchandise is NOTICEABLY better, they made their name buying from local producers to keep overhead down and support the local economy, and that precludes supporting trinkets stamped with "Made in China" on them.

The actual price is a little higher at the local grocery chain, but then, so is the quality of product, AND WalMart purposefully tries to undersell them. They'll take a loss in one area to run someone out of business, and make the difference somewhere else where they have the market locked.

 

[Gunny]

I was wrong. You are correct. Actually WalMart has contributed more to Dems than Target. WalMart still sucks though.

Here is the list of retail contributions. I love OpenSecrets....

Retail Sales: Top Contributors to Federal Candidates and Parties | OpenSecrets

Add: Either way, I don't care if a corporation votes in its own best interest. I DO care if they try to coerce me and they can kiss my ass.