I am a builder

[CockySOB]

Sounds like a crappy contractor. Unfortunately, they DO exist. From the sounds of it, you might want to talk to a lawyer about it.

The payment thing isn't a bad idea, but an even better one is research your contractors before hiring another one. Ask your friends, people at work -- there ARE good ones out there that have no problem honoring their contracts and/or doing good work.

I don't really have the desire to do bathrooms or any other rooms, but I DO posess the skill, and would rather suck it up and do it than pay for more than the cost of material.

The best rule of thumb to go by if you don't personally know the contractor:
if they can start immediately, they probably aren't that good. The best contractors will have to schedule your project(s) for a later date. They'll probably to an initial inspection pretty quick, but actual work won't begin for a couple weeks to a couple of months.

They are worth waiting for.

 

[Joz]

The best rule of thumb to go by if you don't personally know the contractor:
if they can start immediately, they probably aren't that good. The best contractors will have to schedule your project(s) for a later date. They'll probably to an initial inspection pretty quick, but actual work won't begin for a couple weeks to a couple of months.

They are worth waiting for.

This is so true. I talked to Steve the other day. He has a waiting list about 6 months out. People tend to think that he's just sitting by the phone awaiting their call.

We use to pick up small fill-in jobs while waiting for the electrician or plumber to finish their part of the job. Can be a r-e-a-l time-eater. So Steve learned the basics so we didn't always have to wait. Only on the big, professional stuff.

Some counties require their contractors to be licensed (but not here) so you might want to check on that in your area. Another thing, if a contractor asks for money up front, beware. He should have enough credit to be able to purchase your materials and start the job.

Going 6 weeks without money coming in can be a drag. You learn to budget money real well from the last job. And we were hosed out of some money on a big job. So what we started doing was billing the customer, every two weeks, for the work completed. As long as the customer was satisfied and the payments were made the work continued. No money, no work. All this was written in a estimate. Then on the big jobs, Steve & the customer would sign an estimate when the job description & terms were accepted. On the smaller jobs, payment was due on the completion of the work.

 

[Gunny]

This is so true. I talked to Steve the other day. He has a waiting list about 6 months out. People tend to think that he's just sitting by the phone awaiting their call.

We use to pick up small fill-in jobs while waiting for the electrician or plumber to finish their part of the job. Can be a r-e-a-l time-eater. So Steve learned the basics so we didn't always have to wait. Only on the big, professional stuff.

Some counties require their contractors to be licensed (but not here) so you might want to check on that in your area. Another thing, if a contractor asks for money up front, beware. He should have enough credit to be able to purchase your materials and start the job.

Going 6 weeks without money coming in can be a drag. You learn to budget money real well from the last job. And we were hosed out of some money on a big job. So what we started doing was billing the customer, every two weeks, for the work completed. As long as the customer was satisfied and the payments were made the work continued. No money, no work. All this was written in a estimate. Then on the big jobs, Steve & the customer would sign an estimate when the job description & terms were accepted. On the smaller jobs, payment was due on the completion of the work.

Just to play Devil's Advocate, I am going to disagree. Workload is not necessarily an indicator of quality work. It means they bid low enough to get enough work to keep them busy.

I would do my best to check out their credentials. If they're THAT busy, they have a backtrail.

 

[Joz]

Just to play Devil's Advocate, I am going to disagree. Workload is not necessarily an indicator of quality work. It means they bid low enough to get enough work to keep them busy.

I would do my best to check out their credentials. If they're THAT busy, they have a backtrail.

TOTALLY agree. I was just bragging.
There are ALOT of hacks out there with work. But people soon learn, through word of mouth, who does a good job, who you can trust in your home, things like that. Especially at a hen party.

 

[nt250]

Sounds like a crappy contractor. Unfortunately, they DO exist. From the sounds of it, you might want to talk to a lawyer about it.

The payment thing isn't a bad idea, but an even better one is research your contractors before hiring another one. Ask your friends, people at work -- there ARE good ones out there that have no problem honoring their contracts and/or doing good work.

I don't really have the desire to do bathrooms or any other rooms, but I DO posess the skill, and would rather suck it up and do it than pay for more than the cost of material.

The thing that gets me is that I bought a real dump.

I lived in Rhode Island and for eight years I commuted to Marlboro, Massachusetts. I just couldn't take it anymore. So I decided to move. But I had no idea how high the value of houses were around Marlboro.

I found The Dump. It was $228,000 and I knew I could afford to make it nice. It was 15 minutes from work. It had a level yard. An attached garage. It was awful, but I'd seen much, much worse. This I could work with. So I bought it.

The common wisdom when you need renovations or construction done is to get recommendations from friends, co-workers, family. The problem is that those contractors don't need the work. They don't advertise. If you can get them to return your phone calls at all, you're lucky. Someone mentioned 6 months to wait for the good ones? Shit. It's more like two years.

I went that route. But I couldn't live in this house the way it was long enough to wait for the highly recommended contractors to get to me. Out of 3 or 4 recommendations, only 1 even bothered to call me back. And he came out and told me it would be $80,000 to $100,000 to do what I wanted.

So I looked in the Yellow Pages and found Jeff. His first estimate was $45,000 but I would have to pay for pretty much everything. Even the plywood. I went to Home Depot and Lowe's and opened accounts. I called the bank, but I couldn't get a home improvement loan big enough because they wouldn't take the value of the house finished into consideration. I was going to have to pay for it all on credit.

Jeff hooked me up with a designer and it cost me $1250 for the plans. But the plans were great. I got everything I wanted. So Jeff's second proposal was for $74,000. I would still have to pay for all the fixtures, but all the structural stuff was now covered.

I charged the electrical fixtures, bathroom fixtures, kitchen cabinets and granite counters at Lowe's. I charged all the appliances at Sears. I had two MBNA credit cards that were offering 0% on cash advances, so I used those to get $30,000 in cash to pay Jeff when the money from the sale of my house in Rhode Island ran out. At one point I owed $60,000 on credit cards.

They did a great job though. I doubled the size of The Dump, got a second bathroom, and inside utility room, brand new kitchen. I got HVAC, and resided the whole house. I don't cringe when I drive in the driveway anymore. I refinanced and paid off all the debt except for about $10,000. I still owe Sears and Lowe's.

It cost me about $110,000 total. But I still have the other half of the house to do. But I won't hire either one of those contractors again. Jeff left things undone that would have taken one of his guys 2-3 hours, tops, to finish. He never sent anyone back. This last guy? Drugs. Only thing I can think of. At the start of the job he seemd like he was going to be great. By the end? All he wanted was the money.

Nuts. Next year I'm doing the front room, hallway, and all the doors. None of the doors in this house fit their frames. I figure it'll be $20,000 at least.

 

[manu1959]

as a licensed architect, apprentice carpenter, and in house legal for my firm

biggest mistakes.....

1. hiring unlicensed contractors
2. not getting good references on the contractor
3. accepting the low bid
4. paying in advance of work completed
5. not holding 10% retention 35 days past completion of the project
6. not having a written contract and good set of plans with a hard bid before you start
7. changing your mind during construction
8. not having a 10% contingency to deal with surprises
9. not getting a permit
10. living in the house while you remodel it

 

[Gunny]

The thing that gets me is that I bought a real dump.

I lived in Rhode Island and for eight years I commuted to Marlboro, Massachusetts. I just couldn't take it anymore. So I decided to move. But I had no idea how high the value of houses were around Marlboro.

I found The Dump. It was $228,000 and I knew I could afford to make it nice. It was 15 minutes from work. It had a level yard. An attached garage. It was awful, but I'd seen much, much worse. This I could work with. So I bought it.

The common wisdom when you need renovations or construction done is to get recommendations from friends, co-workers, family. The problem is that those contractors don't need the work. They don't advertise. If you can get them to return your phone calls at all, you're lucky. Someone mentioned 6 months to wait for the good ones? Shit. It's more like two years.

I went that route. But I couldn't live in this house the way it was long enough to wait for the highly recommended contractors to get to me. Out of 3 or 4 recommendations, only 1 even bothered to call me back. And he came out and told me it would be $80,000 to $100,000 to do what I wanted.

So I looked in the Yellow Pages and found Jeff. His first estimate was $45,000 but I would have to pay for pretty much everything. Even the plywood. I went to Home Depot and Lowe's and opened accounts. I called the bank, but I couldn't get a home improvement loan big enough because they wouldn't take the value of the house finished into consideration. I was going to have to pay for it all on credit.

Jeff hooked me up with a designer and it cost me $1250 for the plans. But the plans were great. I got everything I wanted. So Jeff's second proposal was for $74,000. I would still have to pay for all the fixtures, but all the structural stuff was now covered.

I charged the electrical fixtures, bathroom fixtures, kitchen cabinets and granite counters at Lowe's. I charged all the appliances at Sears. I had two MBNA credit cards that were offering 0% on cash advances, so I used those to get $30,000 in cash to pay Jeff when the money from the sale of my house in Rhode Island ran out. At one point I owed $60,000 on credit cards.

They did a great job though. I doubled the size of The Dump, got a second bathroom, and inside utility room, brand new kitchen. I got HVAC, and resided the whole house. I don't cringe when I drive in the driveway anymore. I refinanced and paid off all the debt except for about $10,000. I still owe Sears and Lowe's.

It cost me about $110,000 total. But I still have the other half of the house to do. But I won't hire either one of those contractors again. Jeff left things undone that would have taken one of his guys 2-3 hours, tops, to finish. He never sent anyone back. This last guy? Drugs. Only thing I can think of. At the start of the job he seemd like he was going to be great. By the end? All he wanted was the money.

Nuts. Next year I'm doing the front room, hallway, and all the doors. None of the doors in this house fit their frames. I figure it'll be $20,000 at least.

The underlying problem as I see it is impatience. While that did not cause your contractor to be a scumbag ripoff artist, it DID open the door for him.

Manu's list of don't's is pretty good. Was I you, I would use it.

 

[nt250]

The underlying problem as I see it is impatience. While that did not cause your contractor to be a scumbag ripoff artist, it DID open the door for him.

Manu's list of don't's is pretty good. Was I you, I would use it.

Yeah, that list pretty much covers it.

Living here was hell. I went 5 months without a kitchen. The fridge was in the living room, and most days they'd plug my electric stove back in. But for most of the 5 months that's all I had. I had to do dishes in the bathroom. So I didn't do much more than boil water. We ate a lot of pasta. The only thing I asked was that they make sure the fridge worked. "Just keep my beer cold, Guys" was all I asked.

Here's what my kitchen looked like for most of those 5 months:

 

[Joz]

..... I went 5 months without a kitchen. The fridge was in the living room, and most days they'd plug my electric stove back in. But for most of the 5 months that's all I had. I had to do dishes in the bathroom. So I didn't do much more than boil water. We ate a lot of pasta.....

Sounds like our first apartment when I was married. It was a real cute place. Small but I liked it. Thing is I had no stove for the first 3 months so I cooked on allthe small appliances that we'd gotten. Then I kept blowing fuses. So I cooked part in the kitchen and part in the living room.