How Tom Daschle Might Kill Conservatism

[CrimsonWhite]

This guy is right. We are screwed.

The GOP strategist had been joking about the upcoming presidential election and giving his humorous assessments of the candidates. Then he suddenly cut out the schtick and got scary serious. "Let me tell you something, if Democrats take the White House and pass a big-government healthcare plan, that's it. Game over. Government will dominate the economy like it does in Europe. Conservatives will spend the rest of their lives trying to turn things around and they will fail."

And it turns out that the fearsome harbinger of free-market doom is the mild-mannered ex-U.S. senator with the little, red glasses, Tom Daschle. He'll be the guy shepherding President Barack Obama's healthcare plan through Congress via his probable role as secretary of health and human services. At the core of Daschle's thinking on the subject is the creation of a "Federal Health Board that would resemble our current Federal Reserve Board" and ensure "harmonization across public programs of health-care protocols, benefits, and transparency." (Forget secretary of state, Hillary Clinton should shoot for chairman of Fed Health and run one seventh of the U.S. economy.) And the subject of that "harmonization" would be a $100 billion to $150 billion a year plan that would let individuals (and small businesses) buy insurance from private companies or from a government plan.

Daschle and the Obamacrats certainly have the momentum: a near-landslide presidential election victory, at least 58 Democratic votes in the Senate, and a nasty recession that will make many Americans yearn for economic security. Already the health insurance companies seem set back on their heels. The industry's trade organization now says it would accept new rules requiring them to cover pre-existing conditions as long as there was a universal mandate for all Americans to have health insurance. On top of all that, Obama clearly wants to make healthcare reform a priority in his first term, as evidenced by the selection of a heavy hitter like Daschle. And even if he wasn't interested, Congress sure is, with Max Baucus and Ted Kennedy readying a plan in the Senate. A few observations:

How Tom Daschle Might Kill Conservatism - Capital Commerce (usnews.com)

 

[rayboyusmc]

It's okay. Under a universal health care plan, even conservatives will be able to get coverage.

Probably only at an HMO level, but still coverage.

 

[CrimsonWhite]

It's okay. Under a universal health care plan, even conservatives will be able to get coverage.

Probably only at an HMO level, but still coverage.

I'm more worried about the exponential growth of government. I can afford my own healthcare.

 

[Epsilon Delta]

So, what do you suggest?

EDIT: Cuz, I mean, under the current system, then the size of government won't matter, because the cost of the current system is going to overflow it. On the other hand, those 'evil' European systems are much less costly. I'm sure you've seen the figures with the percentages (how it's something like 20% of the US budget, but 7% everywhere else with a reasonable health care system)

 

[CrimsonWhite]

So, what do you suggest?

EDIT: Cuz, I mean, under the current system, then the size of government won't matter, because the cost of the current system is going to overflow it. On the other hand, those 'evil' European systems are much less costly. I'm sure you've seen the figures with the percentages (how it's something like 20% of the US budget, but 7% everywhere else with a reasonable health care system)

Actually, I liked McCain's plan. The problem is that it was too complicated for the election cycle.

 

[NOBama]

This guy is right. We are screwed.

Doggon' serious stuff man. It would be all well and fine if the country had the money to support welfare programs like this, but we don't.

I've talked with numerous business owners lately and I think we've finally come up with a plan to protect ourselves. Hell, by the time it's all said and done, we may qualify for some of these bennies.

All I can say is, I'm damned glad we have our house and vehicles paid for.

 

[bk1983]

Actually, I liked McCain's plan. The problem is that it was too complicated for the election cycle.

I thought McCain's plan was terrible. Funny he called Obama's tax credit

welfare yet called his tax credit reform. He actually was going to tax

our healthcare benefits as income. On top of that, the $5000 credit would

not cover the costs of healthcare, not too mention healthcare costs rise

an average of 7% every year. Is he going to raise the tax credit every year

to compensate? It was a very very bad plan imo.

 

[bk1983]

John McCain gives many Americans a $5000 tax credit to pay for healthcare. (This is the part he's happy to tell you!)

To pay for that tax credit, he taxes - for the first time ever - your employer-provided healthcare benefits as though they were your income. (This part, he talks about less!)

In many cases, the difference between the McCain tax hike and his $5000 credit means a tax hike on day one.

But even for the few people who do start out with a tax cut, it won't last long, because:

McCain's tax credit grows every year at the speed of inflation, which is about 2%.

But the cost of healthcare grows over three times faster every year: ~6%! This means that every year, the McCain tax grows and grows. It's a stealth tax, and it falls hardest on the middle class.

 

[CrimsonWhite]

I thought McCain's plan was terrible. Funny he called Obama's tax credit

welfare yet called his tax credit reform. He actually was going to tax

our healthcare benefits as income. On top of that, the $5000 credit would

not cover the costs of healthcare, not too mention healthcare costs rise

an average of 7% every year. Is he going to raise the tax credit every year

to compensate? It was a very very bad plan imo.

John McCain gives many Americans a $5000 tax credit to pay for healthcare. (This is the part he's happy to tell you!)

To pay for that tax credit, he taxes - for the first time ever - your employer-provided healthcare benefits as though they were your income. (This part, he talks about less!)

In many cases, the difference between the McCain tax hike and his $5000 credit means a tax hike on day one.

But even for the few people who do start out with a tax cut, it won't last long, because:

McCain's tax credit grows every year at the speed of inflation, which is about 2%.

But the cost of healthcare grows over three times faster every year: ~6%! This means that every year, the McCain tax grows and grows. It's a stealth tax, and it falls hardest on the middle class.

The election is over. You can put the talking points back in the drawer.

 

[DiveCon]

The election is over. You can put the talking points back in the drawer.

no shit
lol
they still dont understand, THEY WON!!!!

 

[bk1983]

The election is over. You can put the talking points back in the drawer.

I know the election is over, but what part of McCain's healthcare

plan did you think would be good for this country? I dont need any

talking points, his policy is flawed enough as it is.

 

[PeterS]

This guy is right. We are screwed.

And whose fault is it? Conservatives have continually ignored health care as a national problem and the irony is that that ideological myopia is likely now to be their political demise. Tisk, tisk...

 

[DavidS]

I'm more worried about the exponential growth of government. I can afford my own healthcare.

You're only worried about exponential growth of government NOW? Where have you been the past 7 and a half years?

 

[DavidS]

Actually, I liked McCain's plan. The problem is that it was too complicated for the election cycle.

Let me get this straight just so I have it clear.

You liked the idea of government paying for someone's health insurance, but you don't the idea of someone paying for their own health insurance because it's run by the government. Please tell me you're joking.

Under Obama's plan, the government has the opportunity to make a profit like any other health insurance plan does.

Under McCain's plan, well... there's no income to the government at all.

 

[DiveCon]

You're only worried about exponential growth of government NOW? Where have you been the past 7 and a half years?

i guess you've missed all the conservatives being pissed at Bush and the GOP in general for not staying with conservative principles

 

[Annie]

I know the election is over, but what part of McCain's healthcare

plan did you think would be good for this country? I dont need any

talking points, his policy is flawed enough as it is.

What policy? He lost, it never was or will be. Get it? Moving on, my guess is it's unlikely that any 'nationalized health care' is coming soon. I'm sure it's missed many, but the economy has hit a rough spot. While it will take a while for it to trickle up to the fed, the villages, towns, cities are feeling it to the extreme already. States are now beginning to feel the bite too. Guess what? Unemployment is rising and business are generating less and less revenue. IRS is next to feel it.

Debt is already over the top and countries with the health care packages are going to run into more trouble than US today. I don't think Obama is stupid.

 

[DavidS]

i guess you've missed all the conservatives being pissed at Bush and the GOP in general for not staying with conservative principles

So, who specifically has actually reduced government spending and reduced the size of the government? And if you tell me Reagan, please provide some evidence to back it up.

I kind of feel like Reaganomics and Communism are very similar in that they look great on paper, but they've never actually been tried. And I don't think after Obama is elected, that we can possibly even think about it. What's Palin/Huckabee/Romney going to do? Cancel government health insurance while millions of people receive coverage from it?

 

[Shadow]

The election is over. You can put the talking points back in the drawer.

They can't...that's the only script Obama's camp handed out to the sock puppets.

 

[bk1983]

What policy? He lost, it never was or will be. Get it? Moving on, my guess is it's unlikely that any 'nationalized health care' is coming soon. I'm sure it's missed many, but the economy has hit a rough spot. While it will take a while for it to trickle up to the fed, the villages, towns, cities are feeling it to the extreme already. States are now beginning to feel the bite too. Guess what? Unemployment is rising and business are generating less and less revenue. IRS is next to feel it.

Debt is already over the top and countries with the health care packages are going to run into more trouble than US today. I don't think Obama is stupid.

Thanks for the late breaking news, I was responding to a post in which

McCain's healthcare plan was mentioned. Therefore in my response I

included my problems with said plan. I know it will never be a reality due to

McCain's loss, but we were discussing differnt opinions of both policys.

You know the same way some debate for how effective Ron Paul would

be as our POTUS even though he already lost. I think his policy convictions

are still relevant to debate win or lose.

 

[bk1983]

They can't...that's the only script Obama's camp handed out to the sock puppets.

Coming from you? The guy whose post consist of a recycled lineup

of the same one liners. You take liberal,sock puppet,obama lovers, throw it all

together then spend a half hour typing out your 1 sentence mindless

irrelevant opinion that never adds anything of value to the discussion.