How to change Unions for the 21st Century

[Toronado3800]

100 years ago labor unions were a necessity. The power of big business and monopolies made work after the industrial revolution unsafe, unprofitable, and unreasonable. Combined with the closure of the American West folks could no longer count on big government aid to provide them with a way out even if that sometimes meant braving the Indians.

Simply put there were not enough businesses which could compete that had an incentive to pay sufficiently, not use child labor, keep work hours reasonable, or keep their adult workers safe. Then came labor unions, then came Pinkertons, then came mob protection, then came big government to the aid with fair labor laws.

Public sentiment swung entirely against the corruption of big business and thanks to the fear of work stoppages, sympathetic strikes, and boycotts some companies, our auto manufacturers for example, somehow signed very terrible labor contracts.

For some time now this movement and big government has given us things like the 40 hour work week, OSHA, and the rest of the labor laws which were needed. Are unions still necessary? I think yes, just as a balance against the quasi-collusional power of businesses.

So what is left for unions to do? My brothers and sisters in the Construction Unions picket businesses which don't hire them. When I ask the protesters they're unaware of the specifics of the contract differences which caused the non-union firm to get the job.

I believe to be competitive Unions need to:

1.provide mandatory 3rd party drug testing for all members.

2.not hire convicted felons

3.continue with their certification of members spreading it to include the IT fields

Any other ideas?

 

[Mr Natural]

They're as necessary today as they were 100 years ago.

 

[Toronado3800]

Mr. Clean, in America I believe the government now does the historical job of labor unions. Enforcing a minimum wage. Imposing safety and dignity standards in the workplace and all.

I agree folks who are united bargain considerably better than those who are alone end up begging. But why should a corporation want to deal with a union?
**************
Oh,

Unions should (and I think they do):

4. Guarantee every member is a real U.S. citizen or at least has a work permit.

 

[Truthmatters]

Americans have the right to unionsize whenever they feel its needed.

They will be the ones to deside if they are useful or not.

If they were not needed anymore than the Coprs would not fight to smear them every day.

 

[noose4]

They're as necessary today as they were 100 years ago.

In some cases even more so, the last few decades the working class has been moving backwards while those at the top are getting even more.

 

[rightwinger]

And yet, the standard of living for working Americans continues to decline. US workers put in more hours than any workers in the industrialized world, many lack health insurance, most US households require two incomes where one used to be enough, advanced education is no longer affordable to working Americans.

All of this is because unions have lost their clout with management. In the "lost decade' of 2000-2009, worker income was stagnant, workers gave up rights and benefits while management recorded record bonuses and increased income.

We need unions or the threat of unions as much as ever.

 

[noose4]

Mr. Clean, in America I believe the government now does the historical job of labor unions. Enforcing a minimum wage. Imposing safety and dignity standards in the workplace and all.

I agree folks who are united bargain considerably better than those who are alone end up begging. But why should a corporation want to deal with a union?
**************
Oh,

Unions should (and I think they do):

4. Guarantee every member is a real U.S. citizen or at least has a work permit.

It is no coincidence that the 2 major mining accidents that happened the last decade involved non union mining companies, the conservative admin at that time weakened the mining regulations but union mining companies had to adhere to the safety provisions set by and enforced by the union while non union companies could work using the more lax regulations resulting in unsafe working conditions that resulted in 2 tragedies.

 

[Toronado3800]

It is no coincidence that the 2 major mining accidents that happened the last decade involved non union mining companies, the conservative admin at that time weakened the mining regulations but union mining companies had to adhere to the safety provisions set by and enforced by the union while non union companies could work using the more lax regulations resulting in unsafe working conditions that resulted in 2 tragedies.

I agree.

Perhaps I should change my question...
What can Unions do to better compete in the modern world? Keep membership from falling and all.

 

[garyd]

The first thing you could do to make unions which now represent less than 15% of the work force in the private sector And most of the work force in the public sector, is insurance portability and the best way to do that is to get you boss out the insurance biz. This would mean you would not be free to shop your sevices to the highest bidder rather than being stuck where you're at if your married in order to get insurance coverage at a reasonable price.

That would allow you and your insurance agent to define your coverage rather than being stuck with what some third party has to give you because of state mandates. Also mandate that every body who buys insurance from a given provider is part of the same group. Instead of the current system in which every different employer is its own group for insurance purposes.

 

[noose4]

It is no coincidence that the 2 major mining accidents that happened the last decade involved non union mining companies, the conservative admin at that time weakened the mining regulations but union mining companies had to adhere to the safety provisions set by and enforced by the union while non union companies could work using the more lax regulations resulting in unsafe working conditions that resulted in 2 tragedies.

I agree.

Perhaps I should change my question...
What can Unions do to better compete in the modern world? Keep membership from falling and all.

The one thing that they do do that conservatives generally complain about is union involvement in politics, which in my opinion the unions should do more of and not less of, the decline of unions has coincided with legislation that has weakened the unions.

 

[☭proletarian☭]

1.provide mandatory 3rd party drug testing for all members.

What you do on your own time is your own business, so long as t does not interfere with your ability to do your job.

2.not hire convicted felons

If you oppose the employment of felons, I never want to hear you bitch when someone who isn't allowed to make clean money sticks you in an alley and takes your wallet.

Any other ideas?

The unions got greedy and made it far easier and more profitable to hire illegals instead. They need to deflate their egos and snap back to reality and the ideals and principles that once made the unions strong and successful.

 

[Toronado3800]

What you do on your own time is your own business, so long as t does not interfere with your ability to do your job.

I waiver. On the one hand I agree in principle.

On my capitalist free market hand I can accept employees who pass drug tests stand a 95% less chance of ever being caught driving stoned or having an accident because of being high. So as a free business owner I'd pay more, maybe Union wages, for folks who pass the drug test.

If you oppose the employment of felons, I never want to hear you bitch when someone who isn't allowed to make clean money sticks you in an alley and takes your wallet.

A valid point. I will argue its all about percentages. Say 70% of employee theft is from cashiers with felony theft records vs. 30% from those w/o. Obviously your business can benefit from hiring those w/o and in theory this will make folks less likely to commit crime. Not perfect but when unions who don't allow felons to join reach 50% of the work force I'll deal with this problem.

The last point we are in agreement. The UAW got amazingly good contracts from the Big 3. From what I hear them contracts need updated. Perhaps balanced with a "if your workforce earns xxx dollars per year on average then your CEO can only make XXX% more type clause.

 

[Toronado3800]

What you do on your own time is your own business, so long as t does not interfere with your ability to do your job.

I waiver. On the one hand I agree in principle.

On my capitalist free market hand I can accept employees who pass drug tests stand a 95% less chance of ever being caught driving stoned or having an accident because of being high. So as a free business owner I'd pay more, maybe Union wages, for folks who pass the drug test.

If you oppose the employment of felons, I never want to hear you bitch when someone who isn't allowed to make clean money sticks you in an alley and takes your wallet.

A valid point. I will argue its all about percentages. Say 70% of employee theft is from cashiers with felony theft records vs. 30% from those w/o. Obviously your business can benefit from hiring those w/o and in theory this will make folks less likely to commit crime. Not perfect but when unions who don't allow felons to join reach 50% of the work force I'll deal with this problem.

The last point we are in agreement. The UAW got amazingly good contracts from the Big 3. From what I hear them contracts need updated. Perhaps balanced with a "if your workforce earns xxx dollars per year on average then your CEO can only make XXX% more type clause.

 

[Diuretic]

Unions have ameliorated the excesses of capitalism, for that alone capitalists should be grateful to them.

 

[garyd]

Sorry never happened. The single biggest step up for the American worker came before much of anything was Unionized.

 

[Diuretic]

Sorry never happened. The single biggest step up for the American worker came before much of anything was Unionized.

What didn't happen gary? Was that for me? Not being combative here, just interested in a discussion. I'm not that familiar with US labour history I have a sketchy knowledge but I am interested in the Gompers/Lewis split, not that I have read much about it I mean.

 

[Brubricker]

Unions will either globalize or die. They must unionize China, India, etc. or else they will continue to shrivel. The single greatest enemy of unions is foreign non-union labor.

 

[noose4]

Sorry never happened. The single biggest step up for the American worker came before much of anything was Unionized.

What was that step?

 

[Toronado3800]

I would venture w/o the labor movement it would be a pretty painful industrialized world we live in.

 

[SwingVoter]

Private sector unions used to serve a purpose, but today Government employee unions are bankrupting the country. I'm tired of paying for these people to get fat pensions few in the private sector get. Look at most state deficits and you'll see a huge payment to an outdated defined-benefit pension plan, which ultimately gets funded with more debt or higher taxes.