How To Become A Muslim

[nt250]

The site owner makes an interesting promise on his site. He says that if anyone can prove him wrong, he will take down the site. I've passed the site and the information on to my British friends who are neck deep in apology for Islam and call anyone with a gripe about it a "bigot." I've suggested that they try to prove this former Muslim wrong.

The problem with sites like that is that they're useless. The Koran is the true, literal word of God and any Muslim who claims otherwise is worse than an infidel. No Muslim would give the time of day to anyone claiming to be an ex-Muslim. Or anyone who critizes Muhammed. They might kill them, but they sure as hell won't listen to them.

Groups like that are just as useless as groups who claim to speak for "peaceful Islam". They claim Islam has been "high jacked" by the extremists. They claim the terrorists are not following "true Islam". They're full of shit. It's the extremists who are the true Muslims and the apologists very often are not the least bit sincere. And the deception is comical.

The problem with Islam is that so many people are totally ignorant about what it is. There is such a need to defend it, even by people who know nothing about it, because it's a "religion". Islam is the only religion I have ever seen liberals defend on message boards. They'll go out of their way to defend it, and many times these are the same people who will attack Christianity. They'll even use Christianity as some kind of half assed defense of Islam.

I stopped quoting from the Koran and Hadiths a long time ago. It does no good. People simply do not care what the Islamic texts say. They don't care that since 9/11 not a single prominent Muslim has condemned the attacks without some qualifying excuse or justification.

And I just love the people who think we should be looking for a "root cause" of terrorism. Oh, yeah, right. Let's look for that "root cause" by starting at America's hands and ending at Islam's door. Can't go there.

 

[Otter_Creek]

The site owner makes an interesting promise on his site. He says that if anyone can prove him wrong, he will take down the site. I've passed the site and the information on to my British friends who are neck deep in apology for Islam and call anyone with a gripe about it a "bigot." I've suggested that they try to prove this former Muslim wrong.

Good luck with your Brit friends, let us know thier comments if you get a chance.
Who better to have a site like this than former Muslims?
From what I've read there so far, I'll do all I can to support them and thier desire to live in peace with all others.

 

[Otter_Creek]

Your god isn't indestructable?

Thank You!

 

[Inquisitive One]

The problem with Islam is that so many people are totally ignorant about what it is. There is such a need to defend it, even by people who know nothing about it, because it's a "religion".

Exactly. But, if you check out the site, it's an ex-Muslim trying to explain to the ignorant just how bad it is.

Islam is the only religion I have ever seen liberals defend on message boards. They'll go out of their way to defend it, and many times these are the same people who will attack Christianity. They'll even use Christianity as some kind of half assed defense of Islam.

So true... If one so much as criticizes it, allegations are made of bigotry and hate. In other words, don't talk about Islam unless you're going to say it's the "religion of peace."

With regard to Christianity, those who defend Islam whip out Christianity, attempting to use equivocation to render one as bad as the other - relativism (which I despise).

I stopped quoting from the Koran and Hadiths a long time ago. It does no good. People simply do not care what the Islamic texts say. They don't care that since 9/11 not a single prominent Muslim has condemned the attacks without some qualifying excuse or justification.

No, they don't. I think that we have our intelligentsia (educational system to start) to blame for that. It's produced a generation of self loathers who have bought into the "blame America" meme.

You can show these folks video clips of Muslims on the London street shouting support for OBL and calling for the West's destruction, and the post will fall to the bottom. It's a mystery to me - well, mostly. I have a theory but will save it for another time.

And I just love the people who think we should be looking for a "root cause" of terrorism. Oh, yeah, right. Let's look for that "root cause" by starting at America's hands and ending at Islam's door. Can't go there.

Exactly. What is really hysterical is them hearkening back to the Crusades. What a farce! Check this out: http://hnn.us/articles/1178.html It's very enlightening.

 

[1549]

So true... If one so much as criticizes it, allegations are made of bigotry and hate. In other words, don't talk about Islam unless you're going to say it's the "religion of peace."

With regard to Christianity, those who defend Islam whip out Christianity, attempting to use equivocation to render one as bad as the other - relativism (which I despise).

Two religions are defended here: Islam and Judaism. Christianity is rarely defended because posters don't claim that the bible preaches killing, and posters do not believe in a Christian attempt to take over the world. If these matters come up, I will defend Christianity. As a Christian, I believe both are false.

With regards to your other comments: social environment is the cause for muslim violence. Some conservatives believe we should teach that muslims are violent. In reality, muslims are no more violent than you or I. The difference is the conditions under which muslims are forced to live; poverty, prejudice, and injustice. These are perfect ingredients for breeding violence and picking out scapegoats for life's problems (the US/Israel).

We should concentrate our efforts on fixing the problems to alleviate the need for extremist mentalities that are abused by powerful manipulators like Bin Laden.

 

[nt250]

Two religions are defended here: Islam and Judaism. Christianity is rarely defended because posters don't claim that the bible preaches killing, and posters do not believe in a Christian attempt to take over the world. If these matters come up, I will defend Christianity. As a Christian, I believe both are false.

With regards to your other comments: social environment is the cause for muslim violence. Some conservatives believe we should teach that muslims are violent. In reality, muslims are no more violent than you or I. The difference is the conditions under which muslims are forced to live; poverty, prejudice, and injustice. These are perfect ingredients for breeding violence and picking out scapegoats for life's problems (the US/Israel).

We should concentrate our efforts on fixing the problems to alleviate the need for extremist mentalities that are abused by powerful manipulators like Bin Laden.

That's a crock of shit. Suicide killers are some of the most well-off and educated Muslims there are. Poverty has nothing to do with it. It's Islam. It's what Islam was invented for and it's Islam's goal.

But let's play Devil's advocate here and say that it is poverty. Why is the vast majority of the Muslim world still living in poverty when for over a hundred years they have sat on the richest soil this world has ever known?

One of the Five Pillars of Islam is Alms Giving. All Muslims are supposed to give so much of their income to charity. That's the common belief, right? Wrong. Like every other rule in Islam, Alms Giving is voluntary. All a Muslim has to do to satisfy the Alms Giving pillar is to want to give to charity. That's right. Just the desire is enough. They do not actually have to give anything to charity, and those that DO give to charity are admonished to not call attention to their giving. It's considered being immodest, or bragging, and is frowned upon.

Poverty has nothing to do with why grown, educated, men boarded four planes, saw children, and carried out their plan anyway. Poverty has nothing to do with why a person could set their sights on a child running for their lives, and shoot them in the back. Poverty has nothing to do with why Muslims would deliberately kill little kids because they took candy from American GI's.

It's called Islam, and killing enemies is it's purpose. If Islam were a true peaceful, benovolent religion, there wouldn't be millions of Muslims living in poverty. There wouldn't be millions of Muslims who can't read. But there are. Because Islam was designed that way. And it's worked beautifully.

 

[007]

And here's what I think of muhammed the false prophet and the kuran...

 

[Abbey Normal]

At dinner tonight I saw a Muslim woman (judging by her veil or hijab), and like most other Muslim women I see, she looked very unhappy, actually sort of angry. Why do Muslim women often look so downtroden or outright belligerent?

If I were wearing a scarf around my head all the time, I'd be pretty cranky too. I mean, who would see my great earrings or my auburn shoulder-length hair? But somehow I don't think that's the reason.

Has anyone else noticed this phenomenon?

 

[nt250]

At dinner tonight I saw a Muslim woman (judging by her veil or hijab), and like most other Muslim women I see, she looked very unhappy, actually sort of angry. Why do Muslim women often look so downtroden or outright belligerent?

If I were wearing a scarf around my head all the time, I'd be pretty cranky too. I mean, who would see my great earrings or my auburn shoulder-length hair? But somehow I don't think that's the reason.

Has anyone else noticed this phenomenon?

I don't know any Muslims. I don't associate with stupid people and there are no more stupid people on this planet than a woman who claims to be a Muslim.

 

[Emmett]

And here's what I think of muhammed the false prophet and the kuran...

You know that is gonna stop your toilet!

 

[Abbey Normal]

I don't know any Muslims. I don't associate with stupid people and there are no more stupid people on this planet than a woman who claims to be a Muslim.

I saw her in a restaurant. Surely you run into such women every now and then?

 

[theHawk]

I don't know any Muslims. I don't associate with stupid people and there are no more stupid people on this planet than a woman who claims to be a Muslim.

That might be a little harsh, most Muslim women are probably born into it. Brainwashed since birth and live in societies where they have no more rights than a dog. Same effect of totalitarianism: if they voice any kind of opinion against Islam ....

 

[1549]

That's a crock of shit. Suicide killers are some of the most well-off and educated Muslims there are. Poverty has nothing to do with it. It's Islam. It's what Islam was invented for and it's Islam's goal.

But let's play Devil's advocate here and say that it is poverty. Why is the vast majority of the Muslim world still living in poverty when for over a hundred years they have sat on the richest soil this world has ever known?

One of the Five Pillars of Islam is Alms Giving. All Muslims are supposed to give so much of their income to charity. That's the common belief, right? Wrong. Like every other rule in Islam, Alms Giving is voluntary. All a Muslim has to do to satisfy the Alms Giving pillar is to want to give to charity. That's rig
ht. Just the desire is enough. They do not actually have to give anything to charity, and those that DO give to charity are admonished to not call attention to their giving. It's considered being immodest, or bragging, and is frowned upon.
Poverty has nothing to do with why grown, educated, men boarded four planes, saw children, and carried out their plan anyway. Poverty has nothing to do with why a person could set their sights on a child running for their lives, and shoot them in the back. Poverty has nothing to do with why Muslims would deliberately kill little kids because they took candy from American GI's.

It's called Islam, and killing enemies is it's purpose. If Islam were a true peaceful, benovolent religion, there wouldn't be millions of Muslims living in poverty. There wouldn't be millions of Muslims who can't read. But there are. Because Islam was designed that way. And it's worked beautifully.

Lets analyze your mistakes:

Suicide killers are some of the most well-off and educated Muslims there are. Poverty has nothing to do with it. It's Islam. It's what Islam was invented for and it's Islam's goal.

Some are educated and come from middle class backgrounds. They do not fall victim to a need for terror, for them it is the ideology that inspires their actions. The ideology is an extremist mindset created by those who are looking to change the muslim world and make it more conservative.

Lets find a parallel. Communism was created as a way to give power to the poor; society's proletariat. Yet its heroes were not always poor people. Che Guevarra was raised in an upper class background. Many far-left academics and hollywood figures that have been involved with communism certainly are not poor. Yet the communist ideology would not exist without poor workers to rally in support of.

Back to the middle east. There are poor beaten down middle eastern people who struggle mightily. Some ultra-conservative religious leaders and academics started an anti-western movement thinking this was the answer for social problems. It put the blame for the middle east's short-comings square on countries like the US. It is not just a movement for the poor and struggling, but without them the whole ideology would be worthless.

This ideology has also been taken up by power hungry manipulators who can use it to their own advantage.

One of the Five Pillars of Islam is Alms Giving. All Muslims are supposed to give so much of their income to charity. That's the common belief, right? Wrong. Like every other rule in Islam, Alms Giving is voluntary. All a Muslim has to do to satisfy the Alms Giving pillar is to want to give to charity. That's right. Just the desire is enough. They do not actually have to give anything to charity, and those that DO give to charity are admonished to not call attention to their giving. It's considered being immodest, or bragging, and is frowned upon.

All religions recommend charity...not everyone in those religions participates. What is your point?

If Islam were a true peaceful, benovolent religion, there wouldn't be millions of Muslims living in poverty.

Muslims were instrumental in the development of mathematics and also in the early sciences. They also were crucial in early trading. Those muslims read the same texts as the muslims today.

So what do you think the problem is...the texts themselves or those that have abused the muslim scriptures?

 

[nt250]

Lets analyze your mistakes:



Some are educated and come from middle class backgrounds. They do not fall victim to a need for terror, for them it is the ideology that inspires their actions. The ideology is an extremist mindset created by those who are looking to change the muslim world and make it more conservative.

Lets find a parallel. Communism was created as a way to give power to the poor; society's proletariat. Yet its heroes were not always poor people. Che Guevarra was raised in an upper class background. Many far-left academics and hollywood figures that have been involved with communism certainly are not poor. Yet the communist ideology would not exist without poor workers to rally in support of.

Back to the middle east. There are poor beaten down middle eastern people who struggle mightily. Some ultra-conservative religious leaders and academics started an anti-western movement thinking this was the answer for social problems. It put the blame for the middle east's short-comings square on countries like the US. It is not just a movement for the poor and struggling, but without them the whole ideology would be worthless.

This ideology has also been taken up by power hungry manipulators who can use it to their own advantage.



All religions recommend charity...not everyone in those religions participates. What is your point?



Muslims were instrumental in the development of mathematics and also in the early sciences. They also were crucial in early trading. Those muslims read the same texts as the muslims today.

So what do you think the problem is...the texts themselves or those that have abused the muslim scriptures?

It's the texts themselves.

You should read up on it. Then you wouldn't make the mistake of saying something like they can be "abused".

You have fallen into the same trap that many people do who have no idea what Islam is. Islam has not been "hijacked" or in any way "abused".

It's what Islam was invented for, it's all right there in the Koran and Hadiths.

Don't believe me? Just go to Google and type in "Islam". Skip any and all sites that are obviously anti-Muslim. They're easy to spot right away. No, stick to pro-Islamic sites. Read their FAQ's. Read any Q&A's they have. If there is a message board, read that.

You will be amazed. Most people have no idea how backward, and horrible Islam is. Not 500 years ago. But today.

 

[nukeman]

It's the texts themselves.

You should read up on it. Then you wouldn't make the mistake of saying something like they can be "abused".

You have fallen into the same trap that many people do who have no idea what Islam is. Islam has not been "hijacked" or in any way "abused".

It's what Islam was invented for, it's all right there in the Koran and Hadiths.

Don't believe me? Just go to Google and type in "Islam". Skip any and all sites that are obviously anti-Muslim. They're easy to spot right away. No, stick to pro-Islamic sites. Read their FAQ's. Read any Q&A's they have. If there is a message board, read that.

You will be amazed. Most people have no idea how backward, and horrible Islam is. Not 500 years ago. But today.

I have to agree with you I frequent a couple of islamic chat rooms to see what they are discussing and it is terrible how they can make excuses for suicide murders and the like. I find it amazing how they always say that no one understands them. I personally think we understand them very well..

I think some here should check out the web sigh Shiachat.com just to get a feel for some of these people. Some are very friendly and open to dialogue and are even willing to say that a lot of the people in Islam are wrong but they are deffinitly the minority..

 

[1549]

You will be amazed. Most people have no idea how backward, and horrible Islam is. Not 500 years ago. But today.

This is my point exactly. If the muslim scriptures were the cause of violence, it would have existed hundreds of years ago.

Time has not been kind to the people of that region. Bad leadership, wars, etc. have taken their toll. The result is an extremist mindset.

 

[1549]

I have to agree with you I frequent a couple of islamic chat rooms to see what they are discussing and it is terrible how they can make excuses for suicide murders and the like. I find it amazing how they always say that no one understands them. I personally think we understand them very well..

I think some here should check out the web sigh Shiachat.com just to get a feel for some of these people. Some are very friendly and open to dialogue and are even willing to say that a lot of the people in Islam are wrong but they are deffinitly the minority..

I went to the site. Then checked out a thread about yesterdays bomb blast. Pretty much all said it was sad, unfortunate, or something to that affect. All wished that it did not happen, and all seemed to hope that there would be no revenge attacks or quick accusations.

I should not say all, a poster by the name of Christian did not offer any sympathies to the victims.

 

[bush lover]

Smiley, I appreciate your hope that Muslim is the true religion. But let me ask you to consider that my religion, Roman Catholicism, is the true religion of the world, because it is derived from the true Prophet and Son of God, Jesus Christ. Should you wish to convert, Smiley, you will find our collective embrace to be warm and welcoming. Please, Smiley, locate a Catholic priest in your neighborhood and explore our religion. I am sure you will want to embrace our light. All 1.3 billion of us will embrace you. May God show you the way.

 

[Annie]

Smiley, I appreciate your hope that Muslim is the true religion. But let me ask you to consider that my religion, Roman Catholicism, is the true religion of the world, because it is derived from the true Prophet and Son of God, Jesus Christ. Should you wish to convert, Smiley, you will find our collective embrace to be warm and welcoming. Please, Smiley, locate a Catholic priest in your neighborhood and explore our religion. I am sure you will want to embrace our light. All 1.3 billion of us will embrace you. May God show you the way.

based on all your other posts and sincerity level:

Smiley, I appreciate your hope that Islam, (sorry I can't copy), is the true religion. Let me ask you to consider the majority of the EU, and a significant and influential component of the UN, that there is no deity. Really. I hate to break it to you and g_d knows the other hordes that still buy into those weird stories from all sorts of points of view. Really Smiley, you know and I know that a goat in the hand is worth a 'deity in the bush', get real man! And what that other guy said about 1.3 billion, don't you believe any of that crap. Islam rules! US get out of Middle EAST!!!

 

[Bonnie]

You know I wouldnt mind if people came here to talk about their faith, but when people are going to do drive by posts like this it really bugs the heck out of me.

Not to mention those really big red letters hurts the eyes