How 'bout them grants?

[The Rabbi]

Some research that is tremendously valuable to society generally, doesn't offer any immediate advantage to those who discover it.

We cannot expect private industry to fund that kind of research, but it still behooves us to fund it as a society.

Now it's easy to lampoon research that is obviously goofy, but seriously....do we always know what research will be useful and what won't?

I mean what was the immediate benefit of us learning that E=MC2?

Now try to imagine what industry (existing in the turn of the century) would have supported that frizzy headed thinker who came up with that WORTHLESS data point.

I think we should let Granny decide which research should be funded. She obviously has the best perception of what research will lead to valuable discoveries

Somehow I would trust Granny more than some government bureaucrat with an agenda.

 

[rightwinger]

Some research that is tremendously valuable to society generally, doesn't offer any immediate advantage to those who discover it.

We cannot expect private industry to fund that kind of research, but it still behooves us to fund it as a society.

Now it's easy to lampoon research that is obviously goofy, but seriously....do we always know what research will be useful and what won't?

I mean what was the immediate benefit of us learning that E=MC2?

Now try to imagine what industry (existing in the turn of the century) would have supported that frizzy headed thinker who came up with that WORTHLESS data point.

I think we should let Granny decide which research should be funded. She obviously has the best perception of what research will lead to valuable discoveries

Somehow I would trust Granny more than some government bureaucrat with an agenda.

Or an internet message board poster with an agenda

 

[Dr Gregg]

If it wasn't for government grants that sounded stupid, we wouldn't have the internet, flat screen TVs, or nearly any prescription drug on the market.

Post hoc ergo propter hoc to the absurd extreme.

Not really, but okay.

the Dude says so, so any bullshit he spouts must be true.

 

[Foxfyre]

I think we should let Granny decide which research should be funded. She obviously has the best perception of what research will lead to valuable discoveries

Somehow I would trust Granny more than some government bureaucrat with an agenda.

Or an internet message board poster with an agenda

Yeah right. Like you don't?

 

[Foxfyre]

Some research that is tremendously valuable to society generally, doesn't offer any immediate advantage to those who discover it.

We cannot expect private industry to fund that kind of research, but it still behooves us to fund it as a society.

Now it's easy to lampoon research that is obviously goofy, but seriously....do we always know what research will be useful and what won't?

I mean what was the immediate benefit of us learning that E=MC2?

Now try to imagine what industry (existing in the turn of the century) would have supported that frizzy headed thinker who came up with that WORTHLESS data point.

I think we should let Granny decide which research should be funded. She obviously has the best perception of what research will lead to valuable discoveries

Somehow I would trust Granny more than some government bureaucrat with an agenda.

I would also trust Granny to allocate tax monies more than I would a government bureaucrat with an agenda. I would trust you more. I would trust Dude more. I would trust a lot of us more.

For one thing Granny or Dude or a lot of us would be closing down a whole big bunch of those bureaucratic offices if we had the power to do so. If a lot of us had the power, not a dime of hard earned tax payer money would be going for anything other than what the Constitution says the government is supposed to be doing.

A request for funding a grant for a study of whether pigeons follow the same economic principles as humans would be laughed right into the circular file. I kid you not, some years ago, our Federal government authorized more than $100,000 for just such a study. That wiped out the entire tax contributions of probably 10 to 20 families.

 

[Dr Gregg]

I think we should let Granny decide which research should be funded. She obviously has the best perception of what research will lead to valuable discoveries

Somehow I would trust Granny more than some government bureaucrat with an agenda.

I would also trust Granny to allocate tax monies more than I would a government bureaucrat with an agenda. I would trust you more. I would trust Dude more. I would trust a lot of us more.

For one thing Granny or Dude or a lot of us would be closing down a whole big bunch of those bureaucratic offices if we had the power to do so. If a lot of us had the power, not a dime of hard earned tax payer money would be going for anything other than what the Constitution says the government is supposed to be doing.

A request for funding a grant for a study of whether pigeons follow the same economic principles as humans would be laughed right into the circular file. I kid you not, some years ago, our Federal government authorized more than $100,000 for just such a study. That wiped out the entire tax contributions of probably 10 to 20 families.

if that happened, you'd shut down many Universities in this country, in which professors salaries are paid off of, as well as other expenses. College would cost much much more money, even more than the large expense it costs now.

 

[Foxfyre]

Somehow I would trust Granny more than some government bureaucrat with an agenda.

I would also trust Granny to allocate tax monies more than I would a government bureaucrat with an agenda. I would trust you more. I would trust Dude more. I would trust a lot of us more.

For one thing Granny or Dude or a lot of us would be closing down a whole big bunch of those bureaucratic offices if we had the power to do so. If a lot of us had the power, not a dime of hard earned tax payer money would be going for anything other than what the Constitution says the government is supposed to be doing.

A request for funding a grant for a study of whether pigeons follow the same economic principles as humans would be laughed right into the circular file. I kid you not, some years ago, our Federal government authorized more than $100,000 for just such a study. That wiped out the entire tax contributions of probably 10 to 20 families.

if that happened, you'd shut down many Universities in this country, in which professors salaries are paid off of, as well as other expenses. College would cost much much more money, even more than the large expense it costs now.

Would they? Show me where it is engraved in granite that universities cannot function or operate without an infusion of federal tax dollars. I wonder how they all managed to get along just fine before federal monies were being funneled into them?

Does it make you feel good to know that all of the tax monies you have contributed in a lifetime might have gone into that pigeon study? Do you really condone that sort of thing?

 

[blu]

I would also trust Granny to allocate tax monies more than I would a government bureaucrat with an agenda. I would trust you more. I would trust Dude more. I would trust a lot of us more.

For one thing Granny or Dude or a lot of us would be closing down a whole big bunch of those bureaucratic offices if we had the power to do so. If a lot of us had the power, not a dime of hard earned tax payer money would be going for anything other than what the Constitution says the government is supposed to be doing.

A request for funding a grant for a study of whether pigeons follow the same economic principles as humans would be laughed right into the circular file. I kid you not, some years ago, our Federal government authorized more than $100,000 for just such a study. That wiped out the entire tax contributions of probably 10 to 20 families.

if that happened, you'd shut down many Universities in this country, in which professors salaries are paid off of, as well as other expenses. College would cost much much more money, even more than the large expense it costs now.

Would they? Show me where it is engraved in granite that universities cannot function or operate without an infusion of federal tax dollars. I wonder how they all managed to get along just fine before federal monies were being funneled into them?

Does it make you feel good to know that all of the tax monies you have contributed in a lifetime might have gone into that pigeon study? Do you really condone that sort of thing?

I bet the studies are much deeper than people are passing them off to be.

 

[Foxfyre]

if that happened, you'd shut down many Universities in this country, in which professors salaries are paid off of, as well as other expenses. College would cost much much more money, even more than the large expense it costs now.

Would they? Show me where it is engraved in granite that universities cannot function or operate without an infusion of federal tax dollars. I wonder how they all managed to get along just fine before federal monies were being funneled into them?

Does it make you feel good to know that all of the tax monies you have contributed in a lifetime might have gone into that pigeon study? Do you really condone that sort of thing?

I bet the studies are much deeper than people are passing them off to be.

Well, according to those who researched them, they weren't. But those of you who want to finance that sort of thing, I wish you would just write out a check and help fund them. I am 100% opposed to such expenditures coming from the people's treasury.

 

[Dr Gregg]

I would also trust Granny to allocate tax monies more than I would a government bureaucrat with an agenda. I would trust you more. I would trust Dude more. I would trust a lot of us more.

For one thing Granny or Dude or a lot of us would be closing down a whole big bunch of those bureaucratic offices if we had the power to do so. If a lot of us had the power, not a dime of hard earned tax payer money would be going for anything other than what the Constitution says the government is supposed to be doing.

A request for funding a grant for a study of whether pigeons follow the same economic principles as humans would be laughed right into the circular file. I kid you not, some years ago, our Federal government authorized more than $100,000 for just such a study. That wiped out the entire tax contributions of probably 10 to 20 families.

if that happened, you'd shut down many Universities in this country, in which professors salaries are paid off of, as well as other expenses. College would cost much much more money, even more than the large expense it costs now.

Would they? Show me where it is engraved in granite that universities cannot function or operate without an infusion of federal tax dollars. I wonder how they all managed to get along just fine before federal monies were being funneled into them?

Does it make you feel good to know that all of the tax monies you have contributed in a lifetime might have gone into that pigeon study? Do you really condone that sort of thing?

Umm, its called common sense. so much of the professors salary is paid for through their research grants, especially in the biomedical research. College already costs a lot, how much more would it cost if professors salaries were paid from tuitiion? A ton, plus all the valuable knowledge lost from the stopping of funding. Private companies for the most part will just fund what can lead to a commercial product, you need basic research to advance human knowlege.

I know I've benefitted from gov't sponsored research, from having an educated work force, and all the innovative technologies developed from gov't sponsored research that has led to many jobs and people being employed and a higher standard of living in this country thanks to things tax money gets used for. I feel fine by it

 

[The Rabbi]

Somehow I would trust Granny more than some government bureaucrat with an agenda.

I would also trust Granny to allocate tax monies more than I would a government bureaucrat with an agenda. I would trust you more. I would trust Dude more. I would trust a lot of us more.

For one thing Granny or Dude or a lot of us would be closing down a whole big bunch of those bureaucratic offices if we had the power to do so. If a lot of us had the power, not a dime of hard earned tax payer money would be going for anything other than what the Constitution says the government is supposed to be doing.

A request for funding a grant for a study of whether pigeons follow the same economic principles as humans would be laughed right into the circular file. I kid you not, some years ago, our Federal government authorized more than $100,000 for just such a study. That wiped out the entire tax contributions of probably 10 to 20 families.

if that happened, you'd shut down many Universities in this country, in which professors salaries are paid off of, as well as other expenses. College would cost much much more money, even more than the large expense it costs now.

You say all that like it's a bad thing.

 

[SpidermanTuba]

None of which proves that such innovations wouldn't have been made in the absence of gubmint funding.

No one can prove that you wouldn't still be an idiot if your mother hadn't dropped you on your head - but that doesn't mean your mother dropping you on your head has nothing to do with you being an idiot.

Well, from a logical perspective, you might have some kind of point....or another....or another...

Yet, the calling to question of the fallacious post hoc ergo propter hoc argument stands, to the point that the poster who employed said fallacy admitted so of his own accord.

So, what are you trying to prove here?

Stop using latin. It doesn't make you look smart. It only makes you look like you think you are smart.

 

[beowolfe]

None of which proves that such innovations wouldn't have been made in the absence of gubmint funding.

True. But NOTHING could prove that they would have been made in the absence of government funding. We'll never know what would have happened - it's a quite a debate cop-out.

It's not a cop out on my part...It's the invocation of flawed logic on your part.

I'm not the one who invoked the post hoc ergo propter hoc argument...You were.

Neither of you did. You simply misused the concept.

 

[beowolfe]

No one can prove that you wouldn't still be an idiot if your mother hadn't dropped you on your head - but that doesn't mean your mother dropping you on your head has nothing to do with you being an idiot.

Well, from a logical perspective, you might have some kind of point....or another....or another...

Yet, the calling to question of the fallacious post hoc ergo propter hoc argument stands, to the point that the poster who employed said fallacy admitted so of his own accord.

So, what are you trying to prove here?

Stop using latin. It doesn't make you look smart. It only makes you look like you think you are smart.

Especially when he uses it incorrectly.

 

[The Rabbi]

Well, from a logical perspective, you might have some kind of point....or another....or another...

Yet, the calling to question of the fallacious post hoc ergo propter hoc argument stands, to the point that the poster who employed said fallacy admitted so of his own accord.

So, what are you trying to prove here?

Stop using latin. It doesn't make you look smart. It only makes you look like you think you are smart.

Especially when he uses it incorrectly.

What was incorrect about it?