Hitler was laughing out loud at FDR

[K9Buck]

Before WWII started, Roosevelt had let our military go straight to seed. We basically didn't have a serious army, just a handful of men were under arms, and that was of course the real cause of WWII. Hitler would not have thought to start the Holocaust if America was able to stop it immediately.

But in any event, when we did enter WWII, FDR recruited and fielded a Jim Crow Army to fight Hitler. Hitler thought it was hilarious and hypocritical that America would fight against racism, using a racist institution.

If FDR would have integrated the army right at Pearl Harbor, it would have given the message to Mr. Hitler we were serious.

Your assertions are not based in reality.

 

[Polishprince]

As I mentioned in a previous post FDR tried to strengthen the military by having Congress passing a peace-time draft law in 1940. It was passed with the Republicans in the House voting "NO" by 88 and yes by 46.

Europe was already at war in 1940, and so was Asia. By that point in time, a draft could not have stopped WWII.

However, if we had a draft in 1937 , it would have been a different story.

The idea of a Strong Military isn't to fight a war, but to avoid fighting a war.

For America at that time a strong military was to avoid an invasion.

America didn't have a strong military in the 1930's. FDR reduced the percentage of the federal budget used for defense from 16% under President Hoover to 8% . And Mr. Hoover was a freaking Quaker who didn't believe in the army.

Our army was smaller than that of the Netherlands.

An Army with No Bullets

 

[Polishprince]

Before WWII started, Roosevelt had let our military go straight to seed. We basically didn't have a serious army, just a handful of men were under arms, and that was of course the real cause of WWII. Hitler would not have thought to start the Holocaust if America was able to stop it immediately.

But in any event, when we did enter WWII, FDR recruited and fielded a Jim Crow Army to fight Hitler. Hitler thought it was hilarious and hypocritical that America would fight against racism, using a racist institution.

If FDR would have integrated the army right at Pearl Harbor, it would have given the message to Mr. Hitler we were serious.

Your assertions are not based in reality.

What's wrong with an integrated military? In actuality, 1941 was the IDEAL time to integrate the military. The Army and other services were giving orientation to millions of new recruits, before 1941 the army was very small.

The vast majority of the men coming in weren't used to the Jim Crow Army, it isn't like they would be missing anything or have to readjust.

 

[deanrd]

If only Truman had nuked California and New York before he left office.Things would be much better today.

Why would you say something so reprehensible?

What makes you better than people in California and New York?

 

[Markle]

FDR made no preparations for war until war broke out in Europe. By then, it was too late to actually stop WWII from breaking out.

The key should have been to have the US armed to the teeth, so that Germany wouldn't start the war in the first place.

Sure, its expensive to have a large army and thousands of tanks, planes and bombs. But we are STILL paying for WWII to this very date, for veterans and widows pensions and medical care.

Comfy in your fantasy world are you?

I have no clue as to your point, perhaps it is riding one of those unicorns in your fantasy.

 

[Markle]

As I mentioned in a previous post FDR tried to strengthen the military by having Congress passing a peace-time draft law in 1940. It was passed with the Republicans in the House voting "NO" by 88 and yes by 46.

Europe was already at war in 1940, and so was Asia. By that point in time, a draft could not have stopped WWII.

However, if we had a draft in 1937 , it would have been a different story.

The idea of a Strong Military isn't to fight a war, but to avoid fighting a war.

 

[Picaro]

The 'founders' never intended the central government to have a large standing army.

Yes, and they always suffered from that stupid policy from the start. And, FDR faced a Congress loaded with isolationist morons that refused to increase 'peacetime' military spending in the fact of direct threats of war, so he isn't where the blame lies for being 'unprepared'. It was also his idea to concentrate on building pocket carriers instead of just a few giant carriers, a great decision that won the war in the Pacific several years earlier than expected.

 

[Markle]

Yes, and they always suffered from that stupid policy from the start. And, FDR faced a Congress loaded with isolationist morons that refused to increase 'peacetime' military spending in the fact of direct threats of war, so he isn't where the blame lies for being 'unprepared'. It was also his idea to concentrate on building pocket carriers instead of just a few giant carriers, a great decision that won the war in the Pacific several years earlier than expected.

There were no "morons" in Congress. American citizens, by a vast majority, wanted isolationism. The US had suffered great losses in WW-1 and, so few years later, American's wanted no part of another bloodbath. It took years of persuasion and incremental moves for America's to move to a war footing.

 

[there4eyeM]

The 'founders' never intended the central government to have a large standing army.

Times and equipment sort of change with passing of time.

Is this to suggest the Constitution and American government be updated?

 

[jillian]

Before WWII started, Roosevelt had let our military go straight to seed. We basically didn't have a serious army, just a handful of men were under arms, and that was of course the real cause of WWII. Hitler would not have thought to start the Holocaust if America was able to stop it immediately.

But in any event, when we did enter WWII, FDR recruited and fielded a Jim Crow Army to fight Hitler. Hitler thought it was hilarious and hypocritical that America would fight against racism, using a racist institution.

If FDR would have integrated the army right at Pearl Harbor, it would have given the message to Mr. Hitler we were serious.

Poor baby

 

[Picaro]

Yes, and they always suffered from that stupid policy from the start. And, FDR faced a Congress loaded with isolationist morons that refused to increase 'peacetime' military spending in the fact of direct threats of war, so he isn't where the blame lies for being 'unprepared'. It was also his idea to concentrate on building pocket carriers instead of just a few giant carriers, a great decision that won the war in the Pacific several years earlier than expected.

There were no "morons" in Congress. American citizens, by a vast majority, wanted isolationism. The US had suffered great losses in WW-1 and, so few years later, American's wanted no part of another bloodbath. It took years of persuasion and incremental moves for America's to move to a war footing.

Yes, they were morons; doesn't matter what 'the majority' wanted, Congress is elected to make those decisions, not 'the majority of the public'. They shot down all manner of budget increases, in no small part because many liked Hitler, for one. FDR had intelligent foresight, the 'isolationists' chose to ignore history and what was right in their faces.

 

[there4eyeM]

Japan began its part of WWII in 1937. Germany began its part in 1939. Where and how would America have directed its attention? What was known at that time that would have guided a realistic military response, especially given the clear fact that the majority of Americans did not desire to spend their youth and treasure on wars far away?

 

[Picaro]

As I mentioned in a previous post FDR tried to strengthen the military by having Congress passing a peace-time draft law in 1940. It was passed with the Republicans in the House voting "NO" by 88 and yes by 46.

Europe was already at war in 1940, and so was Asia. By that point in time, a draft could not have stopped WWII.

However, if we had a draft in 1937 , it would have been a different story.

The idea of a Strong Military isn't to fight a war, but to avoid fighting a war.

For America at that time a strong military was to avoid an invasion.

America didn't have a strong military in the 1930's. FDR reduced the percentage of the federal budget used for defense from 16% under President Hoover to 8% . And Mr. Hoover was a freaking Quaker who didn't believe in the army.

Our army was smaller than that of the Netherlands.

An Army with No Bullets

FDR wasn't President from 1919 til 1945; several other Presidents played a big role in gutting our military before he came along. Eisenhower and Patton had to use trucks with plywood mock ups to practice and develop tank tactics for the next decade after WW I, for instance. The budget was reduced to satisfy Congress that the rich people who owned them wouldn't have theri taxes raised any more, and the spending had to go to keeping people alive, while the isolationists all hid out on their estates hiding behind private armies and screaming for Hoover and FDR to call out the military to shoot all the uppity proles down for not meekly accepting starvation and watching their kids die just because some rich guys, many of whom caused the Depression in the first place,. thought they should.

 

[Picaro]

Japan began its part of WWII in 1937. Germany began its part in 1939. Where and how would America have directed its attention? What was known at that time that would have guided a realistic military response, especially given the clear fact that the majority of Americans did not desire to spend their youth and treasure on wars far away?

Isolationism never worked, and never will; they forgot that lesson. A strong standing Army would have given both Japan and Hitler great pause; obviously our low strength, along with many of the rich in this country gushing over how wonderful Hitler was, crushing unions and having what was virtually a slave labor system imposed by a police state, as they do today re Red China, made us a target.

 

[there4eyeM]

So, if America's enemies had been deterred for a while, wouldn't they have improved logistically and technologically even more quickly? That is to say, the sudden, overwhelming entry against already over-extended foes was arguably more effective than gradual escalation.

 

[rightwinger]

Hitler was laughing out loud at FDR

at first,

later on, Hitler killed himself.

But Mr. Hitler still died knowing what a hypocrite Mr. Roosevelt was.

Wouldn't it have been better for FDR to field an Equal Opportunity Army instead of a Jim Crow military force?

Hitler was amazed we used blacks at all

 

[Pogo]

Before WWII started, Roosevelt had let our military go straight to seed. We basically didn't have a serious army, just a handful of men were under arms, and that was of course the real cause of WWII. Hitler would not have thought to start the Holocaust if America was able to stop it immediately.

But in any event, when we did enter WWII, FDR recruited and fielded a Jim Crow Army to fight Hitler. Hitler thought it was hilarious and hypocritical that America would fight against racism, using a racist institution.

If FDR would have integrated the army right at Pearl Harbor, it would have given the message to Mr. Hitler we were serious.

FDR made the US into a Superpower

But if he had done it in the 1930's, instead of wasting money on his Raw Deal programs, the world would have been saved the misery of WWII and the millions killed and incalculable distraction of property.

If America had a first class army by 1939, Mr. Hitler would have abandoned his evil ideas of offending America and getting his kraut ass kicked. But America appeared weak, so he felt free to launch the H-Caust.

You really don't know Hitler apparently...…, he was never intimidated by America at anytime right up to his declaration of war in December 1941.

I read a number of Hitler speeches on his views of America, they clearly showed he was never afraid and was dismissive of them.

By the way World War started in September 1939, when Germany attacked Poland, which England and France joined slowly in response. America went to war starting in December 1941, long after Germany had gotten many nations directly involved in War, over TWO years after Hitler started WW2.

​

Thus your claims are silly.

OP doesn't seem to know geography either, imagining some fantasy world where Hitler's looking over his shoulder all the way across an ocean, as if Britain and France and the rest of his neighbors didn't exist or something.

Apparently Pogo never heard of U-boats.

Apparently Maid Marion thinks "The U-boats" were a comedy act.

 

[Camp]

Japan began its part of WWII in 1937. Germany began its part in 1939. Where and how would America have directed its attention? What was known at that time that would have guided a realistic military response, especially given the clear fact that the majority of Americans did not desire to spend their youth and treasure on wars far away?

Support for increasing the size and strength of the American military had neither Congressional nor public support. FDR, using his experience as an Assistant Secretary of the Navy during WW1 began a quiet but busy and successful effort to develop the modern weapons that would make America the most advanced military power in history. While these weapons were only produced in small quantities, American industry was ready to begin mass production as soon as Congress gave the OK. Modern aircraft carriers were already being built, three of them when the war began. All rhe modern aircraft of WWII fame were on rhe drawing boards and most, already in limited production and updated production phase. B-17's and B-24's that would bomb Germany were flying. Even the infantry rifle, the M1 Garrand was in early production.

 

[there4eyeM]

Japan began its part of WWII in 1937. Germany began its part in 1939. Where and how would America have directed its attention? What was known at that time that would have guided a realistic military response, especially given the clear fact that the majority of Americans did not desire to spend their youth and treasure on wars far away?

Support for increasing the size and strength of the American military had neither Congressional nor public support. FDR, using his experience as an Assistant Secretary of the Navy during WW1 began a quiet but busy and successful effort to develop the modern weapons that would make America the most advanced military power in history. While these weapons were only produced in small quantities, American industry was ready to begin mass production as soon as Congress gave the OK. Modern aircraft carriers were already being built, three of them when the war began. All rhe modern aircraft of WWII fame were on rhe drawing boards and most, already in limited production and updated production phase. B-17's and B-24's that would bomb Germany were flying. Even the infantry rifle, the M1 Garrand was in early production.

Given the actual situation in the U.S. at that time, those measures were doubtlessly close to the maximum feasible. Though not particularly a Roosevelt fan, his margin of maneuver was very limited vis-a-vis things military.

 

[regent]

In the Thirties FDR's biggest problem was the Great Depression. One of the fears in America other than the Depression was that rise of dictators. Had FDR ordered the army integrated it would have been bad timing and would the military brass have supported integration? I'm sure the historians have gone all through these,
"what if's of history."