Hillary needs to burn in political hell...

[jillian]

Of course you are right. Thankfully, I think the primary campaign has drawn some of the poison from these wounds, and the volleys headed towards the McCain camp haven't even started yet. I would say that this could be fun, but there is too much at stake to remain a neutral observer. I am already tensing in preparation for the next 5 months.

Well, they say its always better to draw attention to the negatives of your own case than let your adversary do it for you. So that certainly seems to be the case. And I don't think McCain will hold up well under scrutiny. But what it comes down to is going to be, unfortunately, who people feel more comfortable with. Obama's clearly smarter and more capable on an intelleectual level. But that hasn't, apparently, been a requirement as of late.

I do agree with you that there's too much at stake to remain neutral. It's also time to stop airing our dirty laundry in front of the repubs. We need to do a four part harmony and hold hands and have a group hug... no matter WHAT we think of the other team's supporters. The goal now has to be turned outward.

 

[ReillyT]

Well, they say its always better to draw attention to the negatives of your own case than let your adversary do it for you. So that certainly seems to be the case. And I don't think McCain will hold up well under scrutiny. But what it comes down to is going to be, unfortunately, who people feel more comfortable with. Obama's clearly smarter and more capable on an intelleectual level. But that hasn't, apparently, been a requirement as of late.

I do agree with you that there's too much at stake to remain neutral. It's also time to stop airing our dirty laundry in front of the repubs. We need to do a four part harmony and hold hands and have a group hug... no matter WHAT we think of the other team's supporters. The goal now has to be turned outward.

Does the message board have a group hug function?

 

[jillian]

Does the message board have a group hug function?

heh... we'll have to take it up with the owner.

But I will point out that thread titles like this one and the sentiments that are expressed are probably less than helpful. Obama's supporters need to buy a thicker skin. This is politics...and its for all the marbles. I used to work for someone who said politics is a full contact team sport. The weenie-ness is reflective of the demographics -- college kids and intelligensia -- too soft -- which is why we keep losing. Repubs play to win.

 

[ReillyT]

heh... we'll have to take it up with the owner.

But I will point out that thread titles like this one and the sentiments that are expressed are probably less than helpful. Obama's supporters need to buy a thicker skin. This is politics...and its for all the marbles. I used to work for someone who said politics is a full contact team sport. The weenie-ness is reflective of the demographics -- college kids and intelligensia -- too soft -- which is why we keep losing. Repubs play to win.

Obama and Clinton supporters both need thicker skin. There is a lot of outrage over some rather reasonable (if I may say so) efforts by two people driven enough to want to be leader of the world's most powerful country. How can one expect people so driven to not give it their all?

Anyway, I am trying gently to point out to Jeeper, et al. that perhaps it is time to move on from this kind of thread to something more... unifying.

 

[jillian]

Obama and Clinton supporters both need thicker skin. There is a lot of outrage over some rather reasonable (if I may say so) efforts by two people driven enough to want to be leader of the world's most powerful country. How can one expect people so driven to not give it their all?

Anyway, I am trying gently to point out to Jeeper, et al. that perhaps it is time to move on from this kind of thread to something more... unifying.

I am, yet again, in total agreement with you.

 

[ReillyT]

I am, yet again, in total agreement with you.

Love ya.

 

[jillian]

Love ya.

Backatcha!

 

[Larkinn]

But this is a message board full of people interested in politics, and the McCain camp has more or less been biding their time. There is no reason for them to join the fray when the Democratic candidates are teeing off on one another. I suspect it will get a good deal rougher before the end. Thankfully, I think McCain has his own skeletons in the closet and position-flipping that he will have to deal with as well, and, importantly, we have more money and Bush to fall back on this time.

True, but there is hatred of Obama (and Hillary, although that seems to have diminished lately for reasons I don't entirely understand), which can be quite extreme sometimes from the McCain camp. But overall the attacks have been worse from the Hillary camp.

And yes this is a small, unrepresentative sample here, but I think that the people here do represent real views that people have out there. Not as extreme, and not as passionately, but those views are held.

Obama and Clinton supporters both need thicker skin. There is a lot of outrage over some rather reasonable (if I may say so) efforts by two people driven enough to want to be leader of the world's most powerful country. How can one expect people so driven to not give it their all?

But there have been some shoddy things done, by both sides. And the last Democratic primaries haven't lasted this long, so they haven't gotten this bad, but I do expect a bit of holding back when you are attacking another member of your party. One you may need to support in the general.

 

[Shogun]

Obama's policies are little different than Clinton's. He didn't run a campaign that was any dirtier than Clinton's (neither was particularly dirty, but most pundits would say that she crossed the line more than he). He seems like a decent human being - never charged with a crime or anything like that.

What exactly is it about Obama that you dislike so much?

Ravi: "Because Obama has a penis and i'm voting on the labia ticket this year"

 

[Ravi]

Ravi: "Because Obama has a penis and i'm voting on the labia ticket this year"

Wuh? I heard he didn't have one.

 

[Shogun]

He strikes me as a phony and a user. Not much different than any politician, true. But somehow he seems more of both than most.

in other words,

Ravi: "Because he and I don't share the same plumbing and I am uber desperate to see that a vagina wins come hell or highwater"

 

[Shogun]

I give Obama credit for working as a community organizer but his association with Rezko seems too shady to me to ignore. That he once considered Jeremiah Wright a father figure is troublesome and that he or anyone running for president feels they have to belong to a church at all annoys me.
I give him the benefit of the doubt, he has done a lot of good things even if he does come off as a bit of a phony.

oh yes.. rezco is a deal breaker but WHITEWATER.. that's just good business.

 

[ReillyT]

True, but there is hatred of Obama (and Hillary, although that seems to have diminished lately for reasons I don't entirely understand), which can be quite extreme sometimes from the McCain camp. But overall the attacks have been worse from the Hillary camp.

And yes this is a small, unrepresentative sample here, but I think that the people here do represent real views that people have out there. Not as extreme, and not as passionately, but those views are held.

The hatred of Clinton has diminished because she has lost. It is easier for Obama supporters to be magnanimous and forgiving when their candidate has won. It will understandably be harder for Clinton supporters. I have felt my views soften towards her over the last month as I became convinced that Obama was going to be the nominee. Given time, I expect that most will come back into the fold. At least, I hope that will be the case.

But there have been some shoddy things done, by both sides. And the last Democratic primaries haven't lasted this long, so they haven't gotten this bad, but I do expect a bit of holding back when you are attacking another member of your party. One you may need to support in the general.

There are always some dirty attacks, and I think Obama was held back by the very message he was running on, which made it more difficult for him to engage in hardball politics. Still, I don't think that the attacks rose to the level of the Republican primaries in 2000, where you had robo calls in South Carolina asking if voters views of McCain would change if people became aware that he had a black daughter (when in fact, he had adopted a young girl from Bangladesh). Now that was dirty. Thankfully, no one on our side of the aisle (at least from the campaigns themselves) stooped to anything like that.

Anyway, thankfully it is done, and it is time to start building up Obama instead of tearing down Clinton.

 

[Shogun]

Wuh? I heard he didn't have one.

well, then it looks like you are getting your political facts from the same place yu get your employment law insight.

 

[Jeepers]

Her name is Hillary. Do you call Barack "Bar"? ....

Yes ...
thousand pardons if you're offended Jill...

 

[Care4all]

Err, what? Hillary and the Dems pussyfooted around him?

He gets trashed more here from Hillary supporters than he does from McCain supporters.

yes they did pussyfoot around him.

The republicans will bring out all of his misstatements or what they consider downright lies about his family and his roots beginning with his Selma comment on why he was conceived i believe?, to his grand uncle in aussweitz sp, to his sticking by reverend wright for 20 years without "knowing" that this kind of racism call against all Whitey's to his reasons for not voting on key issues and taking a stance, to him being a non participating Muslim until he converted to christianity at 30....to his dealings and his denials of dealings with radicals like Ayres and Farakahn to his dealings with Reizko who is on trial right now, to his maneuverings to disqualify his competition thru lawyering...

They got piles and piles of stuff they will go after him for and the skin BETTER get thicker...and he better be ready to answer some questions about himself that they will try to use against him.

Many of these things the Republicans "call out" on Obama can also be used by us on McCain with his misstatements on sunni and shiia, to his saying iraq is safer than ever while he has an entorage of security in the green zone and his cheating on his first wife repeatedly to his downright ass kissing of Bush, just to pander the vote, to his iraqi stance....to the Keating 5....

gees, please God, let me just close my eyes and wake up when this election period is OVER....

I really can't stand the negativity and this is why the Obama camp, the Obamaites have made me angry....and they hurt me, yes, me personally by saying I was a racist for supporting Hillary, when in FACT I was supporting her because I thought she was the stronger, better, more experienced candidate for the position....Hillary being a female, really had nothing to do with it.... I am not so old that i think another female may not get her chance before I die of natural death, (G-d willing), 40 plus years from now.

Her being a female had nothing to do with my CHOICE of her as President.

IT DID have alot to do with how I felt females were being stepped on and ridiculed...geez, i saw several main stream media cover her white flowered casual shirt and ferragamo shoes.........there were skits of her being the wicked witch of the west, calling her a bitch on latenight...mimicing her shooting a rifle, etc etc etc etc etc etc etc

There was NO MEDIA covering what Obama was wearing, what type of sandals or Oxfords or wingtips that he was wearing...that was sooooooo demeaning it was pathetic....

Then you got Obama fans like Keith olbemann wishing Hillary's death of which he did apologize later....gees lousie...while you all take a statement that did not even refer to Obama about RFK and LIE that she thought or wished Obama would be killed?

it was also sexist of them to continually push the question of "why doesn't Hillary quit?", "Souldn't Hillary Quit", "She's a bitch for not quitting", would HAVE NEVER been done by the media as MUCH as it did for the last 5 months if Hillary were Gore, or Hillary were Edwards or if Hillary were Obama and they were the ones running neck in neck with the leader.

Alot happened, it won't go away overnight....Time heals all wounds, they say...and as mentioned, this is what it will take....

Care

 

[ReillyT]

IT DID have alot to do with how I felt females were being stepped on and ridiculed...geez, i saw several main stream media cover her white flowered casual shirt and ferragamo shoes.........there were skits of her being the wicked witch of the west, calling her a bitch on latenight...mimicing her shooting a rifle, etc etc etc etc etc etc etc

There was NO MEDIA covering what Obama was wearing, what type of sandals or Oxfords or wingtips that he was wearing...that was sooooooo demeaning it was pathetic....

Care

I don't think there was much sexism in the campaign, but this is something I have to give you. The media was sexist in a couple of ways. One was the focus on her hair and clothes, which is the kind of attention that no male candidate would get. Another was the constant allusion to "Hillary" instead of "Clinton." I didn't originally see this as sexist since it makes sense to distinguish Hillary from Bill, but my wife (who supports Obama) convinced me. Even at times when it was clear that it was Hillary that was being referred to, "Hillary" was used instead of Clinton, which I think lessened her as a candidate a bit. It informalized her where (I believe) formality indicates respect. I don't think this can be attributed to Obama, but I think the media does deserve the wrap in this respect.

 

[Jeepers]

LOL.. who is Sir Edmond Hillary Rodham Clinton again...

 

[MsWikia]

Hillary's speech last night was one of the worst speeches made during this primary. Her tone was aggressive and snobbish. She only recognized states that she won, she continued to divide with the "my supporters" vs. "his supporters" type of statements, she did not recognize that the primary race is a delegate count race in which Obama "whipped" her 2,156 to 1,923. She fails to realize that other candidates have won the popular vote and still lost, this isn't a first i.e. Gore vs. Bush; However, I still have not seen any valid source that says she beat him in the popular vote, only her camp/supporters are declaring that.

Plus as Torro pointed out in an earlier post, if Obama does pick Hillary it will contradict his campaign of Change, of a new Washington by having someone on his ticket who is from the 90’s and well accustomed to the old politics.

 

[Care4all]

Hillary's speech last night was one of the worst speeches made during this primary. Her tone was aggressive and snobbish. She only recognized states that she won, she continued to divide with the "my supporters" vs. "his supporters" type of statements, she did not recognize that the primary race is a delegate count race in which Obama "whipped" her 2,156 to 1,923. She fails to realize that other candidates have won the popular vote and still lost, this isn't a first i.e. Gore vs. Bush; However, I still have not seen any valid source that says she beat him in the popular vote, only her camp/supporters are declaring that.

Plus as Torro pointed out in an earlier post, if Obama does pick Hillary it will contradict his campaign of Change, of a new Washington by having someone on his ticket who is from the 90’s and well accustomed to the old politics.

your opinion on last night's speech is nonconsequencial...

he did not whoop her by ANY MEANS,

he's the ONLY candidate in our history of primary candidates that did NOT WIN the popular vote of the primary

and the only candidate in our history to not have enough delegates to beat his opponent untill ALL OF THE PRIMARY elections were over....and superdelegates had to make the final decision.

He's starting out his candidacy run weak and behind the 8 ball of any other Democratic nominee.

care