Hey Romney.. Do the Right Thing for us!

[JakeStarkey]

In regards to: Some Advice to Mitt Romney if He Wins in November

Romney will not listen to the far right, once he wins. He will reach to the center to govern. If the far right rises against him, he will crush them as he did his enemies of the various boards of directors.

Either way with this election, the far right's day is over.

 

[dblack]

You're asking some really broad questions. There are lots of resources out there on the concepts of constitutionally limited government, and libertarian principles - I'm not really up for reproducing them here. The Libertarian Party platform and the generally ideology they promote, is a reasonably accurate representation of what I'm talking about. You could start there I suppose.

You're the one who brought them up, but you can't defend your opinions?

Defend against what? You didn't 'attack' them, so I'm not really sure what you're getting at. You asked what 'limited government' and 'liberty' mean. If you really don't know, I was suggesting that you do some reading. The concepts are well established in political literature.

 

[Oldguy]

Simply put, federal government provides "negative" rights.....often in the form of "Government shall make no law.....".

Philosophically, government provides no rights. They are given by our "Creator," by the Declaration of Independence.

Essentially saying that government is there for a specific reason and they are not to engage in things such as forcing religion on people

When has that happened?

or denying people free speech.

Free speech is not absolute (see: Yelling fire in a crowded theater"

In any case, what free speech rights have been lost?

When the federal government starts to engage in "positive" rights (setting aside the general statement of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness)

When and how did that happen?

....the right to health care, the right to retire, the right to clean water....etc. They are now engaged in setting standards and regulating something.

Is that un-Constitutional? Is that beyond the pale of OUR government if we want it to do that?

So when we talk about "loss" of right....often it is the loss of protection from the government

Who, or what, is "the government?"

.....or, in other words, the intrusion of government into our lives.

Does government intrude into our lives without the Will of The People? Evidence, please.

And, do you include state, county and local government in that, or just the federal government?

The real problem is that you may not know you've lost those negative rights until way after they are gone.

What "negative" rights have I lost?

Probably the most prominent loss of rights or liberty is in the form of the loss of personal property going to taxes. This takes away from being able to make economic choices.

I still have my property, in spite of paying taxes on it. It's mine and the mortgage holder's. What have I lost and what choices do I not have?

.

As an aside...the city I live in retroactively made and ordinance where you can't finish your basement unless you have window openings of a certain size (for egress). That applys to homes that were built 30 years prior.....thus hurting peoples opportunity to enjoy the home they purchased. Of course, what really happens is that about 90% of homes in the area have finished basements that were done without permits. So the very codes you hope will protect you are bypassed.

Huh?

 

[Oldguy]

In regards to: Some Advice to Mitt Romney if He Wins in November

Romney will not listen to the far right, once he wins. He will reach to the center to govern. If the far right rises against him, he will crush them as he did his enemies of the various boards of directors.

Either way with this election, the far right's day is over.

What in God's name makes you think that?

 

[JakeStarkey]

Oldguy is getting his ass kicked.

 

[Oldguy]

If you really don't know, I was suggesting that you do some reading. The concepts are well established in political literature.

I really don't know what YOUR definitions are.

Explain them to me, please.

 

[Oldguy]

Oldguy is getting his ass kicked.

I am? How? I seem to be asking questions which others can't, or won't, answer and that's getting my "ass kicked?"

Maybe in your Never-Never Land, but not mine.

 

[dblack]

If you really don't know, I was suggesting that you do some reading. The concepts are well established in political literature.

I really don't know what YOUR definitions are.

Explain them to me, please.

I don't have my own definitions of these terms. I'm willing to use the commonly accepted definitions. Got a dictionary? Wikipedia?

In any case, if you want more specifics on my perspective I pointed you to the Libertarian Party. They pretty accurately represent my views. There's no point in me sitting here and typing out a lengthy treatise on a topic that is already well covered elsewhere, especially when I'm pretty sure you know exactly what I'm talking about anyway.

 

[JakeStarkey]

You ask questions, don't listen to the answers, and give silly answers to others' questions.

You live in Never Never land. Yeah, Scalia, Alito, and Thomas are not ideologues. Take your lies elsewhere.

Oldguy is getting his ass kicked.

I am? How? I seem to be asking questions which others can't, or won't, answer and that's getting my "ass kicked?"

Maybe in your Never-Never Land, but not mine.

 

[Sinjorri]

Constitutionally limited government. Pro-liberty values - I want a government whose principal aim is it to protect the liberty of its citizens.

Those are nice platitudes and a fair collection of buzz-word's, but just what the hell do you mean by "Constitutionally limited government," and "Pro-liberty values?"

And, what makes you think the government we have now isn't dedicated to protecting the liberty of it's citizens? In fact, what ARE those liberties you seem to think we may have lost or are threatened?

I think once healthcare was ruled a tax, this will go the way of the seat belt. Let me explain, i told people the seat belt will not stop, they said listen we trust the politicans to know better than us. Than the seat belt law went to the back seats, now people who didnt know the law got nailed with those fines.

The same will happen with healthcare,

Politicians: NOw that we got haelthcare thru, we feel u need life insurance. Now that we have u paying for life insurance, we feel u should buy a hybrid. Now that you bought a hybrid we feel you should only have one kind of toilet, one kind of mattress, one kind of paint on you house, one kind of computer.


Had this been killed at the root, health care would have become something less vile. And before u ask less vile, i mean not FORCING you to pay for it.

People trot out the car insurance and thats only half the battle. You need requirements to buy car insurance, you can own a car and not have car insurance, you can have a car and car insurance, but if you cant affiord the car insurance, you dont get a fine and jail time, you drop the car insurance and dont use the car on the roads.

 

[Oldguy]

I don't have my own definitions of these terms. I'm willing to use the commonly accepted definitions. Got a dictionary? Wikipedia?

In any case, if you want more specifics on my perspective I pointed you to the Libertarian Party. They pretty accurately represent my views. There's no point in me sitting here and typing out a lengthy treatise on a topic that is already well covered elsewhere, especially when I'm pretty sure you know exactly what I'm talking about anyway.

LOL You don't have any definitions of your own? LOL In other words....you're a Parrot...right?

Gimme a break, dude. You got nuthin' but vernacular and rhetoric.

 

[Oldguy]

You ask questions, don't listen to the answers, and give silly answers to others' questions.

You live in Never Never land. Yeah, Scalia, Alito, and Thomas are not ideologues. Take your lies elsewhere.

Oldguy is getting his ass kicked.

I am? How? I seem to be asking questions which others can't, or won't, answer and that's getting my "ass kicked?"

Maybe in your Never-Never Land, but not mine.

Huh?

What the hell do Alito, Scalia and Thomas have to do with anything?

You're babbling incoherently.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Nah, I wanted to see what it was like to change the narrative.

Wow, did it bring the thread to halt.

I don't think Biden is going to let Ryan do what I just did, tomorrow night.

You ask questions, don't listen to the answers, and give silly answers to others' questions.

You live in Never Never land. Yeah, Scalia, Alito, and Thomas are not ideologues. Take your lies elsewhere.

I am? How? I seem to be asking questions which others can't, or won't, answer and that's getting my "ass kicked?"

Maybe in your Never-Never Land, but not mine.

Huh?

What the hell do Alito, Scalia and Thomas have to do with anything?

You're babbling incoherently.

 

[copsnrobbers]

In regards to: Some Advice to Mitt Romney if He Wins in November

Romney will not listen to the far right, once he wins. He will reach to the center to govern. If the far right rises against him, he will crush them as he did his enemies of the various boards of directors.

Either way with this election, the far right's day is over.

Good.. But we're fighting like hell to be rid of the far left right now.

 

[dblack]

In regards to: Some Advice to Mitt Romney if He Wins in November

Romney will not listen to the far right, once he wins. He will reach to the center to govern. If the far right rises against him, he will crush them as he did his enemies of the various boards of directors.

Either way with this election, the far right's day is over.

Good.. But we're fighting like hell to be rid of the far left right now.

I don't see how it can be characterized that way. We've got two centrist authoritarians fighting over who will be running things. Romney is no more 'far-right' than Obama is 'far-left'.

 

[JakeStarkey]

That is why we kiss up to the Far Right now with, metaphorically our fingers crossed behind our back for the day after the election.

Romney, metaphorically, is going to do to the Far Right what Hitler did the socialist leadership of the SA.

Won't be any blood, but it is not going to be pretty, either.

In regards to: Some Advice to Mitt Romney if He Wins in November

Romney will not listen to the far right, once he wins. He will reach to the center to govern. If the far right rises against him, he will crush them as he did his enemies of the various boards of directors.

Either way with this election, the far right's day is over.

Good.. But we're fighting like hell to be rid of the far left right now.