Have you drugged your kid today?

[geauxtohell]

Does the concept of operating under another licensure via standing orders escape you teach?

Again. Psychologists can't even write for drugs under a psychiatrist's or another physician's license. Psychologists are trained in counseling and have no formal training in pharmacology or medical management of psychiatric disorders.

They are not the mental health equivalent of a nurse practitioner or a physicians assistant. It's a separate profession.

One would think you'd only need venture out into your own hometown to realize all those psych shingles hanging are affiliates

No they aren't. Psychologists don't have to practice under another license. Perhaps you are confused, because they often work in concert with a psychiatrist. However, they don't have too.

bt i digress, obviously the thread is in need of suppoprting views .....

The ADHD Industry - ADD - Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder - Ritalin - Psychiatric Labeling

Doctors, pharmaceutical companies, psychologists, psychiatrists, neurologists, pediatricians, family practitioners, tutors, and schools all own a piece of this industry. Once a major American industry exists, it just keeps on growing.

Let's stop right there. Surely you can do better than a blatantly biased webpage that refers to ADHD as an "industry"?

With the industry driving the market, the goal is no longer to fix the problem, but to continue to treat the symptoms.

That's the goal with most psych disorders. Have you ever heard of someone being cured of schizophrenia or bipolar disorder? No. It's not that the desire isn't there, it's just that the capability isn't there.

People tend to not understand that about psychiatry. They seem to think psych disorders are like a simple infection that can be fixed with the right medications. That is not the case. Lest you be too hard on psychiatrists, diabetes and a whole slew of other pathologies also can't be cured. They can only be managed.

At least with ADHD, there is a chance that the child will outgrow it.

This process generates money for those in the industry. If you fix the problems creating the symptoms, all of the revenue-producing drugs and services would go away. There would be no need for them.

I agree to an extent. When do we outlaw television, video games, and all the other things that condition our children to be in a state of hyperarousal?

with me so far teach?

Of course. You really haven't dropped anything novel (or that I haven't seen before).

The DSM-IV is the official "bible" of psychiatry. Every year the list of "mental illnesses" and "disorders" expands.

As is the case with every field of medicine. Why is this even surprising?

BTW, the DSM-IV is about to be replaced by the DSM-V.

In every case a package of symptoms are labeled as a "disorder" or "illness". Often, basic physiological situations, such as "drug addiction" or "drug withdrawal" are reclassified as "mental illnesses", or routine problems with life and/or the mind are labeled as "mental illnesses", such as "depression", "anxiety" and "attentional disorders". In all cases, the psychiatrists assume that the causes of all the "diseases" they invent

Psychiatrists invented substance abuse? That's just shocking!

And absurd. This is just duplicitous speech. It's not that psychiatrists have invented new diseases, it's that they are interested in treating parts of the human condition that have always existed. The line between personality and disorder has always been a tough debate in psychiatry. However, if someone who is suffering from a mental illness that is bothering them or their loved ones can be treated for it, regardless of whether you deem it as real or not, why the fuck do you care?

If you hate psychiatry, then don't utilize it.

are biological, and treatable with drugs and electric shock. This is false, but a major part of their "official party line" or "orthodoxy". The members of the committee who put the DSM together actually "vote" on what should and shouldn't be in the book! Homosexuality used to be in the book until too many people complained about this. "Mental diseases" can go "in" and "out" of style depending on how the committee feels.

It is important for them to get as many "illnesses" into the book as possible, because once in the book, insurance companies base claim payments to doctors and hospitals on the book. If it isn't in the DSM, the rest of the psychiatric related communit doesn't view it as "official".

Wait a minute. New versions (or at the least "revisions") to the DSM only occur every 25 years or so. The DSM IV was published in 1980. You just claimed that diseases were "invented" every year for billing purposes. Now you state that it has to be in the book for psychiatrists to get paid.

So which is it?

Do you even know what you are talking about?

Find out for yourself what a sham the DSM is, comprised of faulty observations, strong biopharmaceutical biases, and a complex nomenclature.

that's how the industry ticks, all fine and well you say?

No it's not. While it's true that things have been added and removed from the DSM (like homosexuality or PTSD) based on the changing nature of society, it's patently absurd to allege that an entire field of medicine is, in actuality, a giant money making conspiracy.

let's look at the results after that generation i spoke of>

Ritalin Proven More Potent Than Cocaine - Nearly 10 Million Kids Drugged

Jeff Rense? Are you fucking kidding me? Is the illuminati behind the whole thing?

Whose next? Tom Cruise?

Thirty years ago the World Health Organization (WHO) concluded that Ritalin was pharmacologically similar to cocaine

It's pharmacologically similar to methamphetamine. Methamphetamine and cocaine act in similar (but not the same) way in the brain. So of course it can be abused. So what? Morphine, vicoden, oxycotin, lortab etc are pharmacologically similar to heroin. Noting the pharmacological similarities to a street drug doesn't make a legal drug bad anymore than a legal drug sold on the street is "good".

in the pattern of abuse it fostered and cited it as a Schedule II drug - the most addictive in medical use. The Department of Justice also cited Ritalin as a Schedule II drug under the Controlled Substances Act, and the Drug Enforcement Agency (DEA) warned that "Ritalin substitutes for cocaine and d-amphetamine in a number of behavioral paradigms

Yeah. Call me when "Ritalin Houses" replace "Crack Houses".

Not that it's relevant. The ability to abuse a substance doesn't negate it's medical usefulness. We still use cocaine as an anesthetic.

Volkow's findings, published in the Journal of Neuroscience and reported in the Journal of the American Medical Association, may act as a wake-up call to parents, educators and lawmakers who have yet to address the question of whether ADHD is a real physical, medical or neurological disease that can be scientifically confirmed or is even confirmable. Because the ADHD diagnosis is the No. 1 reason for drugging school-age children, and Volkow's research reconfirms that Ritalin isn't just kid stuff, parents may want to re-evaluate their child's treatment. The numbers alone are a telling sign of where the push to medicate is going.

According to the DEA, the number of prescriptions written for Ritalin since 1991 has increased by a factor of five (2.2 million) and about 80 percent of the 11 million prescriptions written for Ritalin are to "treat" ADHD. This means that nearly 9 million children have been prescribed the cocainelike "medication."

Another often tossed about talking point about psych illnesses. There aren't even quantitative tests to diagnose the most basic and overt of psychiatric disorders like schizophrenia. That doesn't mean it is non-existent. This sounds like the typical $cientology bullshit mumbo jumbo.

The proof is in the lives that have been changed by managing the condition.

Furthermore, according to a study published last February in the Journal of the American Medical Association, "Trends in the Prescribing of Psychotropic Medications to Preschoolers," psychotropic medications have tripled in preschoolers ages 2 to 4 during a five-year period . More disturbing, say critics, given Volkow's recent revelations, is thatduring the last 15 years the use of Ritalin increased by 311 percent for those ages 15 to 19 and 170 percent for those ages 5 to 14.

The most recent figures available reveal that in 1998 there were approximately 46 million children in kindergarten through grade 12. Twenty percent - one of every five children in school - have been doped with the mind-altering drug.

"Kindergarten through grade 12" is a pretty wide spread, don't you think? Though, I suppose it makes the issue more "tear-jerky" to toss in the notion of mass quantities of kindergartners being given Ritalin, even if it's not exactly factual.

This can be good news only for investors in the Swiss-based pharmaceutical company Novartis, which makes Ritalin. For instance, if the number of children taking the drug increased fivefold, so did the drug company's resultant profits and (presumably) stock value. In a June 28, 1999, article, "Doping Kids," Insight estimated that Novartis generated an increase in its stock-market value of $1,236 per child prescribed Ritalin. Based on these evaluations, the drug company would have enjoyed an increased stock-market value of approximately $10 billion or more since 1991.

Ah, the ever popular "big pharma conspiracy" canard. BTW, after ten years companies lose their exclusivity patent and drugs go generic. That is the case with methylphenidate.

In fact, the number of children being prescribed the cocainelike drug is rising at such a rate that, while good for investors, if ADHD were based on science and were a communicable disease,

Oh, so now the standard is that a disease had to be "communicable". Shall I list the diseases that are not communicable? I suppose we should strike oncology next.

the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention would consider it a major medical epidemic among America's youth. In the meantime, prescriptions continue to increase even as researchers continue to focus on the effect of psychotropic drugs such as Ritalin rather than on how scientifically to verify or validate the diagnosis. And critics of this mass drugging have become convinced that is no accident.

Well, in conclusion, the opinion piece was somewhat entertaining, but about as factual as any other opinion piece.

 

[xotoxi]

She is right, kids ARE over medicated just because they don't fit inside the teachers 'nice little square box', and because mommy and daddy put them on the video games so they wouldn't have to actually interact with their child.

That's not quite the way it is in every case in which a kid receives medication.

 

[random3434]

She is right, kids ARE over medicated just because they don't fit inside the teachers 'nice little square box', and because mommy and daddy put them on the video games so they wouldn't have to actually interact with their child.

That's not quite the way it is in every case in which a kid receives medication.

Yes, I know, some kids really need meds to help control the true medical condition they may have.

But......there are also some teachers and parents out there that being hyper=ADD, or some 'bad behaviors'( they may have) that they need to be on meds instead of actually taking time and using behavior therapy.

 

[chanel]

Exactly. And all psychiatric meds should be used with a combination approach. But that ain't happening.

 

[sparky]

---Quote (Originally by sparky)---
Does the concept of operating under another licensure via standing orders escape you teach?
---End Quote---
Again. Psychologists can't even write for drugs under a psychiatrist's or another physician's license. Psychologists are trained in counseling and have no formal training in pharmacology or medical management of psychiatric disorders.

They are not the mental health equivalent of a nurse practitioner or a physicians assistant. It's a separate profession.




I could pursue a bad joke about Teaching and Correctional Officers here, but would rather address the point.

standing orders means one can operate under another’s licensure, which is the rubber stamp relationship voucher shared of the two professions. We see the very same concept in the paralegal, paramedic , as well as apprenticeship arenas

---Quote---
One would think you'd only need venture out into your own hometown to realize all those psych shingles hanging are affiliates ---End Quote---
No they aren't. Psychologists don't have to practice under another license. Perhaps you are confused, because they often work in concert with a psychiatrist. However, they don't have too.

They do when they want happy pills teach

---Quote---
bt i digress, obviously the thread is in need of suppoprting views .....

The ADHD Industry - ADD - Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder - Ritalin - Psychiatric Labeling (The ADHD Industry - ADD - Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder - Ritalin - Psychiatric Labeling)

Doctors, pharmaceutical companies, psychologists, psychiatrists, neurologists, pediatricians, family practitioners, tutors, and schools all own a piece of this industry. Once a major American industry exists, it just keeps on growing.
---End Quote---
Let's stop right there. Surely you can do better than a blatantly biased webpage that refers to ADHD as an "industry"?

Biased via a Doctor teach? Overall, HC is about 1/6th of our economy in America, pharmaceuticals comprising more cost, as well as ‘scripts per capita than any developed country on this rock.

In fact, capitalist medicine differs from the socialist model quite a bit in the respect that the medical community here is lobbied , along with junkets for the gross sales providers.

Why do you think your doc’s office always has free samples? In fact, the entire scenario is so prevelant it led to the antibiotic paradox, along with the professions inside joke ‘Omoxicillin detects the presence of a child’ But , should you question our pharma addiction further, sources (and examples like the school system’s penchant to pursue it) are not hard to find


---Quote---
With the industry driving the market, the goal is no longer to fix the problem, but to continue to treat the symptoms.
---End Quote---
That's the goal with most psych disorders. Have you ever heard of someone being cured of schizophrenia or bipolar disorder? No. It's not that the desire isn't there, it's just that the capability isn't there.

People tend to not understand that about psychiatry. They seem to think psych disorders are like a simple infection that can be fixed with the right medications. That is not the case. Lest you be too hard on psychiatrists, diabetes and a whole slew of other pathologies also can't be cured. They can only be managed.

At least with ADHD, there is a chance that the child will outgrow it.


To Psych , or not to Psych would be the Q teach.

Of course in profession raft with legal hostilities, it’s better to side with treatment, instead of lack of it , even if said treatment is based on mere whisps of rationale

---Quote---
This process generates money for those in the industry. If you fix the problems creating the symptoms, all of the revenue-producing drugs and services would go away. There would be no need for them.
---End Quote---
I agree to an extent. When do we outlaw television, video games, and all the other things that condition our children to be in a state of hyperarousal?

I will not argue the difference of something internally taken altering the body chemistry of a child vs. external influences here teach

---Quote---
with me so far teach?
---End Quote---
Of course. You really haven't dropped anything novel (or that I haven't seen before).

Nor have you , and one would think an insider on the cutting edge , eh?



---Quote---
The DSM-IV is the official "bible" of psychiatry. Every year the list of "mental illnesses" and "disorders" expands.
---End Quote---
As is the case with every field of medicine. Why is this even surprising?

BTW, the DSM-IV is about to be replaced by the DSM-V.


---Quote---
In every case a package of symptoms are labeled as a "disorder" or "illness". Often, basic physiological situations, such as "drug addiction" or "drug withdrawal" are reclassified as "mental illnesses", or routine problems with life and/or the mind are labeled as "mental illnesses", such as "depression", "anxiety" and "attentional disorders". In all cases, the psychiatrists assume that the causes of all the "diseases" they invent ---End Quote--- Psychiatrists invented substance abuse? That's just shocking!

And absurd. This is just duplicitous speech. It's not that psychiatrists have invented new diseases, it's that they are interested in treating parts of the human condition that have always existed. The line between personality and disorder has always been a tough debate in psychiatry. However, if someone who is suffering from a mental illness that is bothering them or their loved ones can be treated for it, regardless of whether you deem it as real or not, why the fuck do you care?

If you hate psychiatry, then don't utilize it.


The expansion of psychiatric diagnosis inclusive of frivolous disorders can no longer hide behind the guise of a new science since Sigmund Freud . In fact, psychiatric hegemony manufactures illness to address the very chemicals it doles out , which is relevant today via many adults addicted to Ritalin a generation ago






---Quote---
are biological, and treatable with drugs and electric shock. This is false, but a major part of their "official party line" or "orthodoxy". The members of the committee who put the DSM together actually "vote" on what should and shouldn't be in the book! Homosexuality used to be in the book until too many people complained about this. "Mental diseases" can go "in" and "out" of style depending on how the committee feels.

It is important for them to get as many "illnesses" into the book as possible, because once in the book, insurance companies base claim payments to doctors and hospitals on the book. If it isn't in the DSM, the rest of the psychiatric related communit doesn't view it as "official".
---End Quote---
Wait a minute. New versions (or at the least "revisions") to the DSM only occur every 25 years or so. The DSM IV was published in 1980. You just claimed that diseases were "invented" every year for billing purposes. Now you state that it has to be in the book for psychiatrists to get paid.

So which is it?

Do you even know what you are talking about?

The article states a cycle of 5 years

---Quote---
Find out for yourself what a sham the DSM is, comprised of faulty observations, strong biopharmaceutical biases, and a complex nomenclature.

that's how the industry ticks, all fine and well you say?
---End Quote---
No it's not. While it's true that things have been added and removed from the DSM (like homosexuality or PTSD) based on the changing nature of society, it's patently absurd to allege that an entire field of medicine is, in actuality, a giant money making conspiracy.

There’s a conspiracy to hide capitalism’s self enlightened interests?
Perhaps Terral could opine….

---Quote---
let's look at the results after that generation i spoke of>

Ritalin Proven More Potent Than Cocaine - Nearly 10 Million Kids Drugged (Ritalin Proven More Potent Than Cocaine - Nearly 10 Million Kids Drugged)
---End Quote---
Jeff Rense? Are you fucking kidding me? Is the illuminati behind the whole thing?

Whose next? Tom Cruise?


---Quote---
Thirty years ago the World Health Organization (WHO) concluded that Ritalin was pharmacologically similar to cocaine ---End Quote--- It's pharmacologically similar to methamphetamine. Methamphetamine and cocaine act in similar (but not the same) way in the brain. So of course it can be abused. So what? Morphine, vicoden, oxycotin, lortab etc are pharmacologically similar to heroin. Noting the pharmacological similarities to a street drug doesn't make a legal drug bad anymore than a legal drug sold on the street is "good".


---Quote---
in the pattern of abuse it fostered and cited it as a Schedule II drug - the most addictive in medical use. The Department of Justice also cited Ritalin as a Schedule II drug under the Controlled Substances Act, and the Drug Enforcement Agency (DEA) warned that "Ritalin substitutes for cocaine and d-amphetamine in a number of behavioral paradigms ---End Quote--- Yeah. Call me when "Ritalin Houses" replace "Crack Houses".

Not that it's relevant. The ability to abuse a substance doesn't negate it's medical usefulness. We still use cocaine as an anesthetic.


---Quote---
Volkow's findings, published in the Journal of Neuroscience and reported in the Journal of the American Medical Association, may act as a wake-up call to parents, educators and lawmakers who have yet to address the question of whether ADHD is a real physical, medical or neurological disease that can be scientifically confirmed or is even confirmable. Because the ADHD diagnosis is the No. 1 reason for drugging school-age children, and Volkow's research reconfirms that Ritalin isn't just kid stuff, parents may want to re-evaluate their child's treatment. The numbers alone are a telling sign of where the push to medicate is going.

According to the DEA, the number of prescriptions written for Ritalin since 1991 has increased by a factor of five (2.2 million) and about 80 percent of the 11 million prescriptions written for Ritalin are to "treat" ADHD. This means that nearly 9 million children have been prescribed the cocainelike "medication."
---End Quote---
Another often tossed about talking point about psych illnesses. There aren't even quantitative tests to diagnose the most basic and overt of psychiatric disorders like schizophrenia. That doesn't mean it is non-existent. This sounds like the typical $cientology bullshit mumbo jumbo.

The proof is in the lives that have been changed by managing the condition.


---Quote---
Furthermore, according to a study published last February in the Journal of the American Medical Association, "Trends in the Prescribing of Psychotropic Medications to Preschoolers," psychotropic medications have tripled in preschoolers ages 2 to 4 during a five-year period . More disturbing, say critics, given Volkow's recent revelations, is thatduring the last 15 years the use of Ritalin increased by 311 percent for those ages 15 to 19 and 170 percent for those ages 5 to 14.

The most recent figures available reveal that in 1998 there were approximately 46 million children in kindergarten through grade 12. Twenty percent - one of every five children in school - have been doped with the mind-altering drug.
---End Quote---
"Kindergarten through grade 12" is a pretty wide spread, don't you think? Though, I suppose it makes the issue more "tear-jerky" to toss in the notion of mass quantities of kindergartners being given Ritalin, even if it's not exactly factual.


---Quote---
This can be good news only for investors in the Swiss-based pharmaceutical company Novartis, which makes Ritalin. For instance, if the number of children taking the drug increased fivefold, so did the drug company's resultant profits and (presumably) stock value. In a June 28, 1999, article, "Doping Kids," Insight estimated that Novartis generated an increase in its stock-market value of $1,236 per child prescribed Ritalin. Based on these evaluations, the drug company would have enjoyed an increased stock-market value of approximately $10 billion or more since 1991.
---End Quote---
Ah, the ever popular "big pharma conspiracy" canard. BTW, after ten years companies lose their exclusivity patent and drugs go generic. That is the case with methylphenidate.


---Quote---
In fact, the number of children being prescribed the cocainelike drug is rising at such a rate that, while good for investors, if ADHD were based on science and were a communicable disease, ---End Quote---
Oh, so now the standard is that a disease had to be "communicable". Shall I list the diseases that are not communicable? I suppose we should strike oncology next.


---Quote---
the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention would consider it a major medical epidemic among America's youth. In the meantime, prescriptions continue to increase even as researchers continue to focus on the effect of psychotropic drugs such as Ritalin rather than on how scientifically to verify or validate the diagnosis. And critics of this mass drugging have become convinced that is no accident.
---End Quote---
Well, in conclusion, the opinion piece was somewhat entertaining, but about as factual as any other opinion piece.

Killing the messenger is such a boorish endeavor teach, especially when one is confronted with providing a rebuttal to a solid source , like the WHO

One would think an educational professional such as yourself would require definitive and detailed responses in a book report from any given youth

Yet here you are, posting within the cornucopia of internet knowledge, if not from an educational facilities teachers lounge, perhaps you’ll find the time when the little pukes are drooling on themselves in Ritalin stupor, eh?


do carry on then.....

 

[JamesInFlorida]

Kids are one way too many medications these days. I was talking to someone a month or two ago, and they told me how her and her husband give all 4 or 5 kids (I forget the number) medication to go to sleep each night. Otherwise it would be too difficult to get them to bed. My reaction: .

 

[xotoxi]

She is right, kids ARE over medicated just because they don't fit inside the teachers 'nice little square box', and because mommy and daddy put them on the video games so they wouldn't have to actually interact with their child.

That's not quite the way it is in every case in which a kid receives medication.

Yes, I know, some kids really need meds to help control the true medical condition they may have.

But......there are also some teachers and parents out there that being hyper=ADD, or some 'bad behaviors'( they may have) that they need to be on meds instead of actually taking time and using behavior therapy.

And then there are some kids who respond incredibly well to medication and are now able to enjoy life and be creative and learn rather then just constantly moving and getting into trouble.

If a kid really has ADHD, behavioral therapy will not be effective and they will suffer throughout their life as they will be labeled a trouble-maker and will not be able to reach their full potential.

 

[Ballentine]

SURPRISE, Ariz. -- The longest red light in the world would not give you enough time to read all the bumper stickers on Tarah Ausburn's Toyota Prius hybrid.

"I just like the ability to take a controversial topic and sum it up in one clever line. I'm an English teacher; that's what I do," Ausburn told CBS 5 News.

But this English teacher found herself in the principal's office after she said some parents at Imagine Prep High School in Surprise started complaining about a bumper sticker on Ausburn's car that asks, "Have you drugged your kid today?"

"It's kind of a criticism of us tending to over-medicate hyperactive kids who might not need those medications," said Ausburn, who said she has been a teacher for seven years.

Ausburn said she is fighting to get her job back, claiming that her First Amendment rights were violated.

Does she have a case?

I don't know lets take a look.

Amendment I

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.


[edit] Okay, she does have a case now that I reviewed it.

 

[random3434]

That's not quite the way it is in every case in which a kid receives medication.

Yes, I know, some kids really need meds to help control the true medical condition they may have.

But......there are also some teachers and parents out there that being hyper=ADD, or some 'bad behaviors'( they may have) that they need to be on meds instead of actually taking time and using behavior therapy.

And then there are some kids who respond incredibly well to medication and are now able to enjoy life and be creative and learn rather then just constantly moving and getting into trouble.

If a kid really has ADHD, behavioral therapy will not be effective and they will suffer throughout their life as they will be labeled a trouble-maker and will not be able to reach their full potential.

Yes, that's why I bolded the "some"

Trust me, I know what I'm talking about. I've seen behaviors change just by behavior modification. It DOES work.

I've also seen behaviors change when a child was put on meds.

For some, yes it's needed, for others, no, it's not.

 

[geauxtohell]

Exactly. And all psychiatric meds should be used with a combination approach. But that ain't happening.

I agree.

 

[uscitizen]

Kind of reminds me of some of the right wing postings complaining of what some liberal actor said.

 

[sparky]

Kids are one way too many medications these days. I was talking to someone a month or two ago, and they told me how her and her husband give all 4 or 5 kids (I forget the number) medication to go to sleep each night. Otherwise it would be too difficult to get them to bed. My reaction: .

They come by it honestly though, James>

Being socially enginered to believe all one's woes can be chemically mitigated living in the pharmacabal's petri dish

While pursuing the hypocritical petulance of the war on drugs at that....

 

[JamesInFlorida]

Kids are one way too many medications these days. I was talking to someone a month or two ago, and they told me how her and her husband give all 4 or 5 kids (I forget the number) medication to go to sleep each night. Otherwise it would be too difficult to get them to bed. My reaction: .

They come by it honestly though, James>

Being socially enginered to believe all one's woes can be chemically mitigated living in the pharmacabal's petri dish

While pursuing the hypocritical petulance of the war on drugs at that....

I honestly don't know, maybe one kid actually needs it-then they give it to all of the others? Either way legal or not-children are being prescribed too much medication, in my opinion. It's an easy way, for parents to control their kids, just like sitting them down in front of the tv all day, instead of actually watching them.

 

[sparky]

well agreed , at least to the extent of not 'fixing' what isn't broken James