Hate and Rage-- What's the difference?

[Dhara]

Just my opinion here, but I think rage is healthy entitlement. Think of a baby unable to express himself in words, what does he do? He cries, and his face gets beet red.

When did we think that it's NEVER ok to be angry?

Is hate and rage the same emotion as anger? Is it on a continuum?

In my opinion, reclaiming basic emotions like rage keep them from becoming monstrous.

 

[Dhara]

IMO, it is completely natural to get angry, to feel rage. Consider kids who say "I hate you" when they're angry. Are they telling the truth? Sure, that is what they feel in that moment.

 

[The Great Goose]

I rage eventually.

 

[Compost]

Rage is anger. Hate is dislike.

 

[Ravi]

I seriously doubt the infant crying with a red face is experiencing rage.

 

[Dogmaphobe]

Hey -- you're in luck. You look like a candidate for rage yoga.

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[Dhara]

Rage is anger. Hate is dislike.

Some psychologists claim that rage relates to primal violation.

 

[Dhara]

I seriously doubt the infant crying with a red face is experiencing rage.

That depends on what the baby is going through, and the baby can't tell us. A well care for infant crying may not have to rage. A child whose parents don't respond to the child's needs or respond inconsistently may have rage. The inability to express it's needs.

 

[Dhara]

Rage is closely related to fight or flight. It's a necessary emotion that is very old and allows us to run from the tiger or stay and fight for our lives.

Rage ignored and denied is dangerous when the adult is dissociated. Harm may come to oneself and others.

 

[Dhara]

This is an interesting view of it:

Steven Stosny's excellent book Treating Attachment Abuse (1995), offers a chemical explanation of how anger—in the moment at least—can act as a sort of "psychological salve." One of the hormones thebrain secretes during anger arousal is norepinephrine, experienced by the organism as an analgesic.

In effect, whether individuals are confronted with physical or psychological pain (or thethreat of such pain), the internal activation of the anger response will precipitate the release of a chemical expressly designed to numb it.

Paradoxical as it may seem, anger—even though it destroys any true peace of mind or sense of well-being—can yet help us to soothe ourselves. For our anger potently serves to invalidate whoever or whatever led us to feel invalidated. In adamantly disconfirming the legitimacy of the menacing external force, we self-righteously proclaim the superiority of our own viewpoint. Thus is our critical need for emotional/mental security restored.
What Your Anger May Be Hiding

 

[Compost]

Rage is anger. Hate is dislike.

Some psychologists claim that rage relates to primal violation.

Primal violation?

 

[Compost]

Rage is closely related to fight or flight. It's a necessary emotion that is very old and allows us to run from the tiger or stay and fight for our lives.

Rage ignored and denied is dangerous when the adult is dissociated. Harm may come to oneself and others.

I always thought fear triggered fight or flight. If I am confronted by a tiger, I don't believe rage will help me decide whether to punch the tiger or run from the tiger. The danger that is a tiger doesn't make me angry, it makes me look to protect my safety.

 

[Dhara]

Rage is anger. Hate is dislike.

Some psychologists claim that rage relates to primal violation.

Primal violation?

I wonder if circumcision may be experienced as primal violation. I'm thinking of an infant's inability to speak and make his or her needs known.

Yes. Even a newborn may cry out of rage if she wakes up hungry and isn't fed right away.
Is it normal that my baby seems angry? | BabyCenter

 

[Compost]

Rage is anger. Hate is dislike.

Some psychologists claim that rage relates to primal violation.

Primal violation?

I wonder if circumcision may be experienced as primal violation. I'm thinking of an infant's inability to speak and make his or her needs known.

Yes. Even a newborn may cry out of rage if she wakes up hungry and isn't fed right away.
Is it normal that my baby seems angry? | BabyCenter

So "primal violation" is reacting negatively to something physically unpleasant?

 

[Dhara]

Rage is anger. Hate is dislike.

Some psychologists claim that rage relates to primal violation.

Primal violation?

I wonder if circumcision may be experienced as primal violation. I'm thinking of an infant's inability to speak and make his or her needs known.

Yes. Even a newborn may cry out of rage if she wakes up hungry and isn't fed right away.
Is it normal that my baby seems angry? | BabyCenter

So "primal violation" is reacting negatively to something physically unpleasant?

Could be, or could be some other kind of abuse.

 

[Dhara]

Rage is closely related to fight or flight. It's a necessary emotion that is very old and allows us to run from the tiger or stay and fight for our lives.

Rage ignored and denied is dangerous when the adult is dissociated. Harm may come to oneself and others.

I always thought fear triggered fight or flight. If I am confronted by a tiger, I don't believe rage will help me decide whether to punch the tiger or run from the tiger. The danger that is a tiger doesn't make me angry, it makes me look to protect my safety.

Fear does trigger rage often. The tiger doesn't make you "angry" but a process of survival that many would call "kill or be killed" rage goes on when you're violated in some way and you need the adrenaline to fight someone or something off.

 

[Compost]

Rage is anger. Hate is dislike.

Some psychologists claim that rage relates to primal violation.

Primal violation?

I wonder if circumcision may be experienced as primal violation. I'm thinking of an infant's inability to speak and make his or her needs known.

Yes. Even a newborn may cry out of rage if she wakes up hungry and isn't fed right away.
Is it normal that my baby seems angry? | BabyCenter

So "primal violation" is reacting negatively to something physically unpleasant?

Could be, or could be some other kind of abuse.

OK. Could be or could be... You said some psychologists claim that rage relates to primal violation. Do you have a link from one of these psychologists to share, or can you expand on the point a bit?

 

[Compost]

Rage is closely related to fight or flight. It's a necessary emotion that is very old and allows us to run from the tiger or stay and fight for our lives.

Rage ignored and denied is dangerous when the adult is dissociated. Harm may come to oneself and others.

I always thought fear triggered fight or flight. If I am confronted by a tiger, I don't believe rage will help me decide whether to punch the tiger or run from the tiger. The danger that is a tiger doesn't make me angry, it makes me look to protect my safety.

Fear does trigger rage often. The tiger doesn't make you "angry" but a process of survival that many would call "kill or be killed" rage goes on when you're violated in some way and you need the adrenaline to fight someone or something off.

That doesn't make sense to me. When you are dealing with a tiger who is acting on instinct, you don't feel rage against it, at least- a rational response would not be rage. Rage as a motivator makes sense- maybe- if later, you want revenge against the tiger for threatening you. But that doesn't equate rage with adrenaline, a bodily reaction which doesn't have emotion.

 

[Dhara]

Some psychologists claim that rage relates to primal violation.

Primal violation?

I wonder if circumcision may be experienced as primal violation. I'm thinking of an infant's inability to speak and make his or her needs known.

Yes. Even a newborn may cry out of rage if she wakes up hungry and isn't fed right away.
Is it normal that my baby seems angry? | BabyCenter

So "primal violation" is reacting negatively to something physically unpleasant?

Could be, or could be some other kind of abuse.

OK. Could be or could be... You said some psychologists claim that rage relates to primal violation. Do you have a link from one of these psychologists to share, or can you expand on the point a bit?

Let me see if I can expand on it. My psychologist says rage relates to violation. It's a feeling that something completely intolerable is going on in the present, or in the case of traumatized people, has gone on in the past, and is being triggered now. He says it's quite different from anger, or annoyance. It's more primal or basic,coming from the most ancient or "reptilian" part of the brain.

It's often connected to fear, it's in fight or flight. Say, someone is coming at you and wants to kill you, you can't run, or freeze, so you have rage and you fight back. You fight for your life.

IF that basic entitlement, (of survival), is suppressed then a person may dissociate or disown their rage, and that's when it becomes a danger to self and others.

Does that make any sense?

 

[Tilly]

Rage is closely related to fight or flight. It's a necessary emotion that is very old and allows us to run from the tiger or stay and fight for our lives.

Rage ignored and denied is dangerous when the adult is dissociated. Harm may come to oneself and others.

I always thought fear triggered fight or flight. If I am confronted by a tiger, I don't believe rage will help me decide whether to punch the tiger or run from the tiger. The danger that is a tiger doesn't make me angry, it makes me look to protect my safety.

From the article in Dharas link.
(And rage itself seems mostly a more potent, or desperate, form of anger created to fend off an even more serious threat to one's ego or sense of personal safety--whether that threat be mental, emotional or physical.)