Has Trickle Down Economics Failed?

[cutter]

Obamas plan of trickle down poverty seems to be right on course with thousands entering poverty every month. The Goal is to see those millionaires and billionaires on food stamps. Might need another 4yrs to accomplish that.

 

[Google]

As you all know, I firmly believe it did. I liken it to another ideology based on optimism... Communism.

Trickle Down says "give the rich tax breaks and as they make more money, they will trickle it down to the working and Middle Class in the form of higher wages" basically making the idea of a Union to keep an employer honest as obsolete.

Communism says to share wealth equally with all members of society.

They are both flawed in the same way... they don't take into account one thing... Greed.

Communists don't take into the account the greed that people in power can have... therefore, Most Communist Countries tend to be Governmental Dictatorships that dupe the general Public into thinking they are getting their fair share, but those in power are almost always skimming for themselves and giving the general population less than their fair share.

Reaganomics does pretty much the same thing, except that it's not governmental greed that is the problem... it's Corporate, Trade and Banking Greed. Over the past 30 years(or post-Reagan), we've seen a downhill slide in the lives of the Average American. While we've seen Great money flowing into the upper echelon of our society... so in fact, they aren't trickling down like they did when Reagan first won the election on this simple, mostly sound idea.

What the hell is the point of this thread? Is there a president in office espousing the economic virtues of Reagan?

Are you so disillusioned at what your president has done that you really have to rehash this argument?

The question is has the economic policies of the 111th Congress and President Obama failed?

This has got to be the most pointless attempt to rationalize the failure of the Democrat Party and Obama I've seen thus far.

 

[Google]

Yawn...what a bunch of crap. Look around you sunshine. what is killing job creation is outsourcing and demanding employees do more(work longer hours, add job assignments and generally pick up the slack of laid off employees) for the same amount of money(and sometimes less).

Greed is Good? OK... I realize I'm talking to a money worshiper that probably calls himself a Christian.

I must be talking to an idiot that thinks they're smart. Leave the Christians out of it, I haven't been to Church in years. The first folks who came to this continent were greedy. They used that greed to build a country, they wanted more than what they had, people always want more. I don't worship money, I've always worked paycheck to paycheck. You sound like a UnionMember with a severe case of OBAMANOSIS! Wake up and GET THE CURE.
Dusty the Dog
P. S. Thank God all Dogs Go To Heaven

Ok... I apologize for the blanket assumption that you were a Christian(it seems to be a prerequisite to be a Conservative these days). Not that there's anything wrong with being a Christian. I am one myself. I just do my best to not judge others..sometimes I fail(obviously).

I sound like a Union Member? Ummm....what does that have to do with anything? What skin is it off your nose if someone wants to get paid well and have benefits? Oh, I see... maybe you think that because others don't have that fortune, no one should. Well, if that's the case I don't know what to say to you. Perhaps instead you should wonder why most workers Aren't paid all that well and have to pay $12k/year to keep their families insured.

Perhaps you should wonder why it's OK for the people at the top to be "greedy", but it's not OK for working class people to be treated fairly(and no, just being employed is not the equivalent of "fair").

Furthermore, perhaps you should wonder about those pesky entitlements. How one side says Social Security is broke, but the other side says there's 2.6T dollars in the coffers(In treasury notes, but it's there). If treasury Notes are good enough for the rest of the world, why isn't it good enough for us? I mean, don't get me wrong... I'm pissed that they robbed the fund and replaced it with T-bills too... but hey... what can ya do?

You see, I don't trust the banking industry. I don't want them to have access to a program that I've been paying into since I was 14(I am now 46). I think the only reason that there are calls for privatization is so the Banking and investment industry can make a profit off of it, gamble with it, and potentially lose it. Not to mention that if they do lose it...they'd get another bailout and we'd be fucked...just like most of those people that got foreclosed on with the last Banking debacle.

Lastly... people came to this country for many reasons. Some of which were economic. But many of them were religious folk who wanted to worship God the way they believed he should be worshiped.

What a condescending post. In one sentence you denigrate Christians and conservatives, as if being either is some deplorable sin.

Then you demonstrate such an utter lack of understanding of economic issues, as if the OP didn't do enough. To say there is $2.6 trillion in the social security trust funds--in Treasury Bills--is either indigenous or plain ignorant.

Can you name one of the hundreds of pieces of legislation passed by the Democrat controlled Congress in Obama's first two years in office has had any positive effect? Is there anything this president will take credit for?

The buck never stops in this administration.

 

[Sallow]

Big Money, eh, Dim? And what will you do with the big, big money?

Inspiration! Lovely Music!

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1XFCnWWPlHE]A Clockwork Orange - Alex attacks Georgie & Dim - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Steelplate]

As you all know, I firmly believe it did. I liken it to another ideology based on optimism... Communism.

Trickle Down says "give the rich tax breaks and as they make more money, they will trickle it down to the working and Middle Class in the form of higher wages" basically making the idea of a Union to keep an employer honest as obsolete.

Communism says to share wealth equally with all members of society.

They are both flawed in the same way... they don't take into account one thing... Greed.

Communists don't take into the account the greed that people in power can have... therefore, Most Communist Countries tend to be Governmental Dictatorships that dupe the general Public into thinking they are getting their fair share, but those in power are almost always skimming for themselves and giving the general population less than their fair share.

Reaganomics does pretty much the same thing, except that it's not governmental greed that is the problem... it's Corporate, Trade and Banking Greed. Over the past 30 years(or post-Reagan), we've seen a downhill slide in the lives of the Average American. While we've seen Great money flowing into the upper echelon of our society... so in fact, they aren't trickling down like they did when Reagan first won the election on this simple, mostly sound idea.

What the hell is the point of this thread? Is there a president in office espousing the economic virtues of Reagan?

Are you so disillusioned at what your president has done that you really have to rehash this argument?

The question is has the economic policies of the 111th Congress and President Obama failed?

This has got to be the most pointless attempt to rationalize the failure of the Democrat Party and Obama I've seen thus far.

One man.... hell even one party is not responsible for all of this. I'm not rationalizing either the Dems or Obama. I am saying 30 years of Trickle down economics...a system that is firmly in place and has been since Reagan has outlived it's usefulness. This whole "privatization" ideology is just a re-hash of the same economic policies that have put us where we are. The policies that encourage Companies and Banking to go for the fast buck instead of steady growth....mostly at the expense of labor, who keeps both production going and buys most of the products and services that business provides. This started happening over a decade ago. People were struggling, sales of goods and services were down... so what did we do? Instead of realizing that the workforce is falling behind and need a boost, we simply lowered interest rates and made credit easier to get so that people can still keep buying and Banks get a huge windfall on the backs of people trying to make ends meet AND buy those "luxuries" that keep our economy rolling.

It was all a sham, and we fell for it hook line and sinker. Now look at us. Now that the easy credit has gone away, we aren't buying as much... unemployment is high(for us), Production is down. I am telling you as I sit here living and breathing... if you build it, they will come. That is, if you hire people at a decent wage....even at a short term loss... they will want to spend their earnings on stuff. Us Americans are hard wired to Capitalism and Consumerism. If they have money in their pockets it will do wonders for our economy.

The whole point is that labor and business aren't exclusive of one another...they are in a symbiotic relationship where one needs the other. That is, until business cheated and took their production abroad. Now we have Business with way too much power and influence, a government that is obligated to them for paying for their campaigns and a whole lot of people who bust their asses everyday just to put food on the table and keep a roof over their heads wondering where the American Dream went.

 

[Steelplate]

I must be talking to an idiot that thinks they're smart. Leave the Christians out of it, I haven't been to Church in years. The first folks who came to this continent were greedy. They used that greed to build a country, they wanted more than what they had, people always want more. I don't worship money, I've always worked paycheck to paycheck. You sound like a UnionMember with a severe case of OBAMANOSIS! Wake up and GET THE CURE.
Dusty the Dog
P. S. Thank God all Dogs Go To Heaven

Ok... I apologize for the blanket assumption that you were a Christian(it seems to be a prerequisite to be a Conservative these days). Not that there's anything wrong with being a Christian. I am one myself. I just do my best to not judge others..sometimes I fail(obviously).

I sound like a Union Member? Ummm....what does that have to do with anything? What skin is it off your nose if someone wants to get paid well and have benefits? Oh, I see... maybe you think that because others don't have that fortune, no one should. Well, if that's the case I don't know what to say to you. Perhaps instead you should wonder why most workers Aren't paid all that well and have to pay $12k/year to keep their families insured.

Perhaps you should wonder why it's OK for the people at the top to be "greedy", but it's not OK for working class people to be treated fairly(and no, just being employed is not the equivalent of "fair").

Furthermore, perhaps you should wonder about those pesky entitlements. How one side says Social Security is broke, but the other side says there's 2.6T dollars in the coffers(In treasury notes, but it's there). If treasury Notes are good enough for the rest of the world, why isn't it good enough for us? I mean, don't get me wrong... I'm pissed that they robbed the fund and replaced it with T-bills too... but hey... what can ya do?

You see, I don't trust the banking industry. I don't want them to have access to a program that I've been paying into since I was 14(I am now 46). I think the only reason that there are calls for privatization is so the Banking and investment industry can make a profit off of it, gamble with it, and potentially lose it. Not to mention that if they do lose it...they'd get another bailout and we'd be fucked...just like most of those people that got foreclosed on with the last Banking debacle.

Lastly... people came to this country for many reasons. Some of which were economic. But many of them were religious folk who wanted to worship God the way they believed he should be worshiped.

What a condescending post. In one sentence you denigrate Christians and conservatives, as if being either is some deplorable sin.

Then you demonstrate such an utter lack of understanding of economic issues, as if the OP didn't do enough. To say there is $2.6 trillion in the social security trust funds--in Treasury Bills--is either indigenous or plain ignorant.

Can you name one of the hundreds of pieces of legislation passed by the Democrat controlled Congress in Obama's first two years in office has had any positive effect? Is there anything this president will take credit for?

The buck never stops in this administration.

Not at all... I just refuse to call gays an Abomination, people who have abortions muderers and poor people tics on the ass of society...that's judgmental...and that is many Conservatives' talking points.

 

[Google]

As you all know, I firmly believe it did. I liken it to another ideology based on optimism... Communism.

Trickle Down says "give the rich tax breaks and as they make more money, they will trickle it down to the working and Middle Class in the form of higher wages" basically making the idea of a Union to keep an employer honest as obsolete.

Communism says to share wealth equally with all members of society.

They are both flawed in the same way... they don't take into account one thing... Greed.

Communists don't take into the account the greed that people in power can have... therefore, Most Communist Countries tend to be Governmental Dictatorships that dupe the general Public into thinking they are getting their fair share, but those in power are almost always skimming for themselves and giving the general population less than their fair share.

Reaganomics does pretty much the same thing, except that it's not governmental greed that is the problem... it's Corporate, Trade and Banking Greed. Over the past 30 years(or post-Reagan), we've seen a downhill slide in the lives of the Average American. While we've seen Great money flowing into the upper echelon of our society... so in fact, they aren't trickling down like they did when Reagan first won the election on this simple, mostly sound idea.

What the hell is the point of this thread? Is there a president in office espousing the economic virtues of Reagan?

Are you so disillusioned at what your president has done that you really have to rehash this argument?

The question is has the economic policies of the 111th Congress and President Obama failed?

This has got to be the most pointless attempt to rationalize the failure of the Democrat Party and Obama I've seen thus far.

One man.... hell even one party is not responsible for all of this. I'm not rationalizing either the Dems or Obama. I am saying 30 years of Trickle down economics...a system that is firmly in place and has been since Reagan has outlived it's usefulness. This whole "privatization" ideology is just a re-hash of the same economic policies that have put us where we are. The policies that encourage Companies and Banking to go for the fast buck instead of steady growth....mostly at the expense of labor, who keeps both production going and buys most of the products and services that business provides. This started happening over a decade ago. People were struggling, sales of goods and services were down... so what did we do? Instead of realizing that the workforce is falling behind and need a boost, we simply lowered interest rates and made credit easier to get so that people can still keep buying and Banks get a huge windfall on the backs of people trying to make ends meet AND buy those "luxuries" that keep our economy rolling.

It was all a sham, and we fell for it hook line and sinker. Now look at us. Now that the easy credit has gone away, we aren't buying as much... unemployment is high(for us), Production is down. I am telling you as I sit here living and breathing... if you build it, they will come. That is, if you hire people at a decent wage....even at a short term loss... they will want to spend their earnings on stuff. Us Americans are hard wired to Capitalism and Consumerism. If they have money in their pockets it will do wonders for our economy.

The whole point is that labor and business aren't exclusive of one another...they are in a symbiotic relationship where one needs the other. That is, until business cheated and took their production abroad. Now we have Business with way too much power and influence, a government that is obligated to them for paying for their campaigns and a whole lot of people who bust their asses everyday just to put food on the table and keep a roof over their heads wondering where the American Dream went.

What the hell are you talking about. If what you say is true and the last 30 years have been an embrace of trickle down economics, then it had an incredible success until...what?

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MGT_cSi7Rs]Shocking Video Unearthed Democrats in their own words Covering up the Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac Scam that caused our Economic Crisis - YouTube[/ame]

Let me hear your response to this video. Privatization led to this mess??? YOU ARE AN IDIOT.

 

[Google]

Ok... I apologize for the blanket assumption that you were a Christian(it seems to be a prerequisite to be a Conservative these days). Not that there's anything wrong with being a Christian. I am one myself. I just do my best to not judge others..sometimes I fail(obviously).

I sound like a Union Member? Ummm....what does that have to do with anything? What skin is it off your nose if someone wants to get paid well and have benefits? Oh, I see... maybe you think that because others don't have that fortune, no one should. Well, if that's the case I don't know what to say to you. Perhaps instead you should wonder why most workers Aren't paid all that well and have to pay $12k/year to keep their families insured.

Perhaps you should wonder why it's OK for the people at the top to be "greedy", but it's not OK for working class people to be treated fairly(and no, just being employed is not the equivalent of "fair").

Furthermore, perhaps you should wonder about those pesky entitlements. How one side says Social Security is broke, but the other side says there's 2.6T dollars in the coffers(In treasury notes, but it's there). If treasury Notes are good enough for the rest of the world, why isn't it good enough for us? I mean, don't get me wrong... I'm pissed that they robbed the fund and replaced it with T-bills too... but hey... what can ya do?

You see, I don't trust the banking industry. I don't want them to have access to a program that I've been paying into since I was 14(I am now 46). I think the only reason that there are calls for privatization is so the Banking and investment industry can make a profit off of it, gamble with it, and potentially lose it. Not to mention that if they do lose it...they'd get another bailout and we'd be fucked...just like most of those people that got foreclosed on with the last Banking debacle.

Lastly... people came to this country for many reasons. Some of which were economic. But many of them were religious folk who wanted to worship God the way they believed he should be worshiped.

What a condescending post. In one sentence you denigrate Christians and conservatives, as if being either is some deplorable sin.

Then you demonstrate such an utter lack of understanding of economic issues, as if the OP didn't do enough. To say there is $2.6 trillion in the social security trust funds--in Treasury Bills--is either indigenous or plain ignorant.

Can you name one of the hundreds of pieces of legislation passed by the Democrat controlled Congress in Obama's first two years in office has had any positive effect? Is there anything this president will take credit for?

The buck never stops in this administration.

Not at all... I just refuse to call gays an Abomination, people who have abortions muderers and poor people tics on the ass of society...that's judgmental...and that is many Conservatives' talking points.

I refuse to allow homosexuals shape the curriculum of elementary schools. I refuse to allow people that have zero respect for humanity, for Christ's sake leftists tell us we are a cancer on this planet, dictate to me how to live my life.

Anyone that dares speak aloud a conservative view point will be shouted down and ridiculed.

You are a hypocrite. Your posts seethe with judgement, but apparently you are too shallow to see.

 

[Steelplate]

What the hell is the point of this thread? Is there a president in office espousing the economic virtues of Reagan?

Are you so disillusioned at what your president has done that you really have to rehash this argument?

The question is has the economic policies of the 111th Congress and President Obama failed?

This has got to be the most pointless attempt to rationalize the failure of the Democrat Party and Obama I've seen thus far.

One man.... hell even one party is not responsible for all of this. I'm not rationalizing either the Dems or Obama. I am saying 30 years of Trickle down economics...a system that is firmly in place and has been since Reagan has outlived it's usefulness. This whole "privatization" ideology is just a re-hash of the same economic policies that have put us where we are. The policies that encourage Companies and Banking to go for the fast buck instead of steady growth....mostly at the expense of labor, who keeps both production going and buys most of the products and services that business provides. This started happening over a decade ago. People were struggling, sales of goods and services were down... so what did we do? Instead of realizing that the workforce is falling behind and need a boost, we simply lowered interest rates and made credit easier to get so that people can still keep buying and Banks get a huge windfall on the backs of people trying to make ends meet AND buy those "luxuries" that keep our economy rolling.

It was all a sham, and we fell for it hook line and sinker. Now look at us. Now that the easy credit has gone away, we aren't buying as much... unemployment is high(for us), Production is down. I am telling you as I sit here living and breathing... if you build it, they will come. That is, if you hire people at a decent wage....even at a short term loss... they will want to spend their earnings on stuff. Us Americans are hard wired to Capitalism and Consumerism. If they have money in their pockets it will do wonders for our economy.

The whole point is that labor and business aren't exclusive of one another...they are in a symbiotic relationship where one needs the other. That is, until business cheated and took their production abroad. Now we have Business with way too much power and influence, a government that is obligated to them for paying for their campaigns and a whole lot of people who bust their asses everyday just to put food on the table and keep a roof over their heads wondering where the American Dream went.

What the hell are you talking about. If what you say is true and the last 30 years have been an embrace of trickle down economics, then it had an incredible success until...what?

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MGT_cSi7Rs]Shocking Video Unearthed Democrats in their own words Covering up the Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac Scam that caused our Economic Crisis - YouTube[/ame]

Let me hear your response to this video. Privatization led to this mess??? YOU ARE AN IDIOT.

Didn't bother to watch your video. It had incredible success for who? Oh... that's right, the only people that "matter" in your precious tea party propagandized mind... the wealthy. I won't sit here and say that Fannie Mae and Freddy Mac is guiltless in this... I will say that the repeal of Glass Steagal had much more to do with it.

You can type in big fonts all you want... all it does is paint you as the irrational lunatic you seem to be.

 

[Steelplate]

What a condescending post. In one sentence you denigrate Christians and conservatives, as if being either is some deplorable sin.

Then you demonstrate such an utter lack of understanding of economic issues, as if the OP didn't do enough. To say there is $2.6 trillion in the social security trust funds--in Treasury Bills--is either indigenous or plain ignorant.

Can you name one of the hundreds of pieces of legislation passed by the Democrat controlled Congress in Obama's first two years in office has had any positive effect? Is there anything this president will take credit for?

The buck never stops in this administration.

Not at all... I just refuse to call gays an Abomination, people who have abortions muderers and poor people tics on the ass of society...that's judgmental...and that is many Conservatives' talking points.

I refuse to allow homosexuals shape the curriculum of elementary schools. I refuse to allow people that have zero respect for humanity, for Christ's sake leftists tell us we are a cancer on this planet, dictate to me how to live my life.

Anyone that dares speak aloud a conservative view point will be shouted down and ridiculed.

You are a hypocrite. Your posts seethe with judgement, but apparently you are too shallow to see.

I never called anyone a cancer. Show me one post that I did anything like that. I think your policies are stupid... but hey...stupidity isn't against the law.

BTW, now who's being hypocritical? Anyone who speaks anything that nutjobs like you consider "librul", needs to be shouted down and ridiculed. Look at oh... I'd bet 80% of the posts on this message board... don't play the "poor, persecuted me" card with me, because I ain't buying it.

 

[Google]

Didn't bother to watch your video. It had incredible success for who? Oh... that's right, the only people that "matter" in your precious tea party propagandized mind... the wealthy. I won't sit here and say that Fannie Mae and Freddy Mac is guiltless in this... I will say that the repeal of Glass Steagal had much more to do with it.

You can type in big fonts all you want... all it does is paint you as the irrational lunatic you seem to be.

The repeal of Glass Steagal had more to do with the economic collapse than Fannie Mae and Freddy Mac!?!?

It is now beyond doubt that you are clueless.

 

[Steelplate]

Didn't bother to watch your video. It had incredible success for who? Oh... that's right, the only people that "matter" in your precious tea party propagandized mind... the wealthy. I won't sit here and say that Fannie Mae and Freddy Mac is guiltless in this... I will say that the repeal of Glass Steagal had much more to do with it.

You can type in big fonts all you want... all it does is paint you as the irrational lunatic you seem to be.

The repeal of Glass Steagal had more to do with the economic collapse than Fannie Mae and Freddy Mac!?!?

It is now beyond doubt that you are clueless.

Go watch FoxNews a while and go back into your comfort zone... You know... the land where everything little people do is wrong and everything that big business and banking does is right. go play your fiddle while Rome burns, Nero.

 

[Steelplate]

Analysts trace banking crisis to repeal of act - Top Stories - Ohio

Here's an article that explains it pretty well... Like I said, Fannie and Freddie have their part in it too, but just because they are "gubmint" programs, does not take the blame away from the deregulation that caused it.

 

[Google]

Didn't bother to watch your video. It had incredible success for who? Oh... that's right, the only people that "matter" in your precious tea party propagandized mind... the wealthy. I won't sit here and say that Fannie Mae and Freddy Mac is guiltless in this... I will say that the repeal of Glass Steagal had much more to do with it.

You can type in big fonts all you want... all it does is paint you as the irrational lunatic you seem to be.

The repeal of Glass Steagal had more to do with the economic collapse than Fannie Mae and Freddy Mac!?!?

It is now beyond doubt that you are clueless.

Go watch FoxNews a while and go back into your comfort zone... You know... the land where everything little people do is wrong and everything that big business and banking does is right. go play your fiddle while Rome burns, Nero.

Insightful. Very deep.

 

[Steelplate]

Yeah... like calling me clueless because I don't play into right wing propaganda is oh so insightful.

 

[Immanuel]

I have to say that I don't believe it has failed any more than any other economic policy. The thing is that no one policy works all the time. There are so many variables in an economy that any policy needs to be monitored and modified at all times.

Will "Trickle Down" economics work right now? I don't think so. Hell, how much lower do TD'ers think taxes should go? In the meantime, President Obama seems to believe that "Flood the Basement" economics work, and I don't see that flooding the basement has done a damned bit of good either.

Both models may work given certain circumstance, but placing one's thoughts on one particular model at all times is foolish at best.

Immie

 

[sparky]

Tinkle down is also termed supply side economics

greed , the usual culprit, was allowed to insiduously creep in over a generations time

now the disparity is esculating exponentially

soon, it'll be impossible to blame the welfare queens for it all

and Steelplate, i find your reference of lazze fare capitalism coming full circle to appear like crony communism rather astude

perspective is everything, and usually blows partisan heads up

go you

~S~

 

[sparky]

Analysts trace banking crisis to repeal of act - Top Stories - Ohio

Here's an article that explains it pretty well... Like I said, Fannie and Freddie have their part in it too, but just because they are "gubmint" programs, does not take the blame away from the deregulation that caused it.

Now Now Steelplate, we're not suppose to delve into specifics like Glass Steagal, or whatever legslation may have been catalyst.

Oh i know, i've posted it 1000 times , nobody even cares to wiki it, just blow chunks about the dems or reps, for gawd's sake , we can't reveal the man behind the curtain duoood
tell you what, you're a blues man, try and pick up the tune 1-4-5 1-4-5 1-4-5.....
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JH90gNBkWoQ&feature=player_detailpage]b.b. king - recession blues - YouTube[/ame]

~S~

 

[DontBeStupid]

53.33% of you people think trickle down has worked??

Even thought there is zero evidence supporting it?

Wow!

Zero evidence? Have you looked at the rise in GDP and jobs created over the past 30 years?

The sun rose every day too. Should we thank trickle down for that?

 

[uscitizen]

Trickle down economica owrked exactaly as it's romoters exoected it to work.
It is just that most were sold and believed it was destined to do more.

So I guess it succeeded for it's promoters and failed our country.