Has The Surge Worked?

Discussion in 'Middle East - General' started by rayboyusmc, Jan 10, 2008.

  1. rayboyusmc
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    rayboyusmc Senior Member

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    I don't see near as much in the news on Iraq we saw six or so months ago. Does this mean the surge has worked?

    Why does this year has the highest number of casualties for our troops?

    What's the story here? Did we make the benchmarks? What are the measurements we use to define success or failure?

    It amazes me how the biggest issue of our time seems to move to page 7.

    And why do we need to send in all the Marines to Afghanistan?
     
  2. CSM
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    CSM Senior Member

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    I have no doubt that because you are new to this board that you are trying to engage in conversation...in truth, all of these subjects have been discussed at one time or another.

    Guess what? Not one person who engaged in those discussions changed their position (that I could tell) and it always ended up divided along party lines. So lets cut to the chase and why don't you tell us what party you affiliate with and we can play the usual talking points in our head...save a lot of time that way.

    From what little you have posted I am willing to bet that you are a Democrat, dislike Bush, think the war is wrong and the US is evil. Am I right? Second option is that you will claim to be an independent.
     
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  3. mattskramer
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    mattskramer Senior Member

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    What is the percentage of Democrats that criticize the war? What is the percentage of Republicans that criticize the war and what is the percentage of independents that criticize the war?

    I guess that the statistics support your conclusion that his poster is a Democrat, but I would not be so confident.
     
  4. dawks2020
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    dawks2020 Rookie

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    The easiest way to answer the question regarding the surge is this:

    Has the surge led to the war ending any sooner?

    Has the surge led to a nearer date of US troop withdraw?

    Has the surge led to greater unity among the three factions in Iraq?

    Answer these questions for yourselves. I look at things long term and they are the long term problems we have currently been fighting in Iraq.

    Can we ever cause greater unity among the three factions in Iraq?

    That is the question I simply cannot ever see our troops solving. Other may see it differently. I just don't see the problem as a lack of troops, rather a lack of unity among the Iraqi people.

    Regarding the Dems: I see them as hypocrites, they have the control in congress, yet the involvement has increased since then. So democrats oppose the war yet vote to increase troop involvement. I can't believe the liberals haven't gotten after their party more.
     
  5. rayboyusmc
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    rayboyusmc Senior Member

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    "From what little you have posted I am willing to bet that you are a Democrat, dislike Bush, think the war is wrong and the US is evil. Am I right? Second option is that you will claim to be an independent."

    I am a moderate progressive.

    I know Bush is one of the most incompentent persons we have had in the Presidency in our lifetime. The war is a total waste except for Carlyle and those who profit from war. Iraq was no threat. Afghanistan was where we should have persevered. If these buttwads who don't listent to their senior military (General Shinseki) had paid any attention, we would be in control in Afghanistan and not sunk in a pile crap in Iraq.

    As to your last remark, that I think the US is evil, please remove your brain housing group from your anal orifice and get a glimpse of the sun.:eusa_wall:

    I respect that fact that you were a CSM and have your opinions. I put my time in the Corps, retired as a LtCol, and have my opinions. After 20 years, they are just a wee bit different than the day I retired. Much similar to General Zinni today and General Butler in the past.. I love this counrty and as such will stand up and say when I think a small group of gutless bastards are leading US astray and killing our best young people.

    If you think you can't disagree with what "some" elected officials are doing and still be a real patriot, you don't know what patriotism is about. I find it hard to accept that the Dick still has a "blind" trust in Haliburton and will reap the $$$$$$$$$$$$$ from this war, or that Daddy Bush will make millions from his part of the Carlyle Group.

    LBJ, Nixon, and Kissassger used US in Vietnam, and the NeoCons are using US today.

    The fact that you have given up on trying to offer your side of the picture to others may be a sign of "defeat".

    You can call them talking points or you can call them facts. I guess it depends on what you bias your opinion on.

    As to the Democratic party being in control. They really aren't. They are, however, a bunch of spineless wussies right now. Even if they can't overide his veto or start an impeachment, they don't have the balls or balletes to at least take a stand in public and call him the liar he is.

    Check out "cognitive dissonance". It is endemic on the right today.

    But this country will still work out its differences and once more honor things like the Geneva convention, FISA, the Constitution, and the idea that torture is wrong for everyone or not wrong at all.

    Have a great day. Gotta go back to work.:eusa_think:
     
  6. CSM
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    CSM Senior Member

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    Nice talking to you, sir.
     
  7. rayboyusmc
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    rayboyusmc Senior Member

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    "I happen to believe that sooner or later, common sense will prevail and the US citizenry will put a stop to the extremists (from any party) from running rampant."

    I hope so also, but more and more am beginning to believe it will take something really dramatic to wake up a lot of those who are sleep walking through life.

    When they made the movie, The Running Man, back in the 70s I think, I thought it was a nice fantasy. Today with all the virtual reality crap and mind numbing bullsh!t on TV coupled with the so called "news media" empty sound bites, I think we are already there.

    I have made this proposal before and still believe it. If we took all those who have a political opinion in the US of A, we would pretty much end up with a bell shaped curve or normal population. About 67% of US would be one standard deviation to the right or left of the center. The harder core right and left make up about 27%.

    The real extremes on left and right are only 4+% and yet these are the people who make the most noise and seem to screw it all up. These are the folks who I believe are running/ruining the Repbulican party right now.

    Sometime soon that 67% has got to get its sh!t together and tell the extremes to fuk off.

    Hopefully it will happen without a revolution.

    Hell, they are still flying the CH-46. I can always re-up and help fly the bastards to some remote island drop them there: from about 5000 feet.
     
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  8. Gunny
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    Gunny Gold Member

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    What does the "surge" have to do with Afghanistan?

    There's thread in the War on Terrorism forum that details 18 provinces that have been turned over to Iraq, Anbar being the lastest. Sound like failure?

    The extra Marines in Afghanistan are in anticipation of a spring offensive by the Taliban.
     
  9. Psychoblues
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    Psychoblues Senior Member

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    Only from an American political view. And I hold that view in contempt of American ideals.
     
  10. CSM
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    CSM Senior Member

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    I agree. Of course, the braying from the extremes gets the media attention. "Man bites dog" is always a better headline than "Nothing bad happened today".
     

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