Harry Hopkins....Soviet Spy

Discussion in 'History' started by PoliticalChic, Feb 15, 2014.

  1. PoliticalChic
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    Wow! I seem to have hit a nerve in a post about Franklin Roosevelt's co-President, Harry Hopkins!

    My new pal, Smugly Backside,...something like that...... was enraged, just because, in showing that FDR was held in thrall by Stalin....and Hopkins was actually an agent of Stalin's.


    So Smugly wrote this:

    "Harry Hopkins was a true patriot who labored through the period in question sick with cancer but tirelessly for America and the World. He actually worked himself to death for America. You and your sniveling yapping back-stabbing ilk are not fit to lick his boots."

    As I am not really that good at boot-licking, I suppose I should remediate Smugly, and show that Hopkins was a Soviet spy, an agent of the psychopath, Joseph Stalin.
    Let's investigate the charge.






    It's very difficult to get feeling for Harry Hopkins, he manages to do well what really good spies do: remain unnoticed. But there is scholarship on Hopkins....and you can draw your own conclusions.




    1. First...who was Hopkins?
    Life magazine ran a spread on Hopkins on September 22, 1941, calling his a one-man cabinet to Roosevelt. In fact, he lived at the White House, in the Lincoln Bedroom, from May 1940 to December 1943. LIFE - Google Books, p. 93.

    Background? A social worker who flattered his way into Roosevelt's confidence.

    a. "As boss of the Lend-Lease program, his control of the destiny of empire is second only to Mr. Roosevelt's own....In the kind of personalized one-man government that war has made of the administration of Franklin D. Roosevelt, that man has the greatest influence who has easiest access to the Chief-of-State's ear." Ibid.

    2. Harry Hopkins,- FDR's alter ego, co-president, or Rasputin, "...the closest and most influential adviser to President Franklin D. Roosevelt during World War II, was a Soviet agent." and “the most important of all Soviet wartime agents in the United States.”
    The Treachery Of Harry Hopkins






    3. "The leading evidence that Hopkins was a spy for Joseph Stalin is presented by Herbert Romerstein and Eric Breindel in their 2000 book, "The Venona Secrets: Exposing Soviet Espionage and America's Traitor."

    a. Their evidence is, first, that Soviet KGB defector, Oleg Gordievsky, said that Hopkins was in regular communication with top Soviet covert operative, Iskhak Akhmerov, in New York City. This was more than just a "back channel" for communication between Roosevelt and Stalin because Hopkins had existing back channels at the Soviet embassy that he used, and Akhmerov's identity as an operative was not supposed to be known to the U.S. government.

    b.Second, the Venona project decrypts of Soviet communications with its spies, which came to light only in the 1990s, reveal a report on a Washington discussion between Roosevelt and Winston Churchill by an "agent 19." Only Harry Hopkins among suspected Soviet agents would have been privy to that conversation.

    c. Third, former Communist Whittaker Chambers testified to Congress in 1948 about the formation of Communist "study groups" within the U.S. government from which espionage agents were recruited. One of those groups, led by Lee Pressman, was established within the Department of Agriculture in late 1933, and Hopkins was a member of that group.

    d. Fourth, his policies were strongly pro-Soviet, particularly in his work as head of the Lend-Lease program."
    http://www.dcdave.com/article5/110211.htm

    As time went by, and Roosevelt became more and more ill, he relied on Hopkins to make the policy decisions: each and every effort of Hopkins were designed for Stalin's benefit.


    Almost as though Stalin was whispering in Hopkins' ear....

    Coincidence?







    4. "Now, corroborating and entirely independent evidence of Hopkins’ likely treason has come to light in the pages of an obscure book by Emanuel M. Josephson. The title is "The Strange Death of Franklin D. Roosevelt," and while it does have a very intriguing chapter on FDR’s demise, the main subject of the book is better captured by the subtitle, A History of the Roosevelt-Delano Dynasty, America’s Royal Family.
    The following passage is on pp. 145-146:

    a. 'In later years, Murray Garsson, the munitions manufacturer who was convicted for bribery and irregularities in connection with war contracts, reported that Harry Hopkins had been very helpful to him in securing and handling those contracts. In return for his help, Hopkins had demanded and received liberal payment for his influence. Garsson regularly paid Hopkins’s numerous losses on bets on the horse races. But one form of payment demanded by Hopkins stood out as most odd, Garsson said.

    b. Garsson maintained quarters at the Wardman Park Hotel in Washington in connection with his war contracts. But he spent his weekends in New York with his family. Harry Hopkins demanded of Garsson that he permit him and his friends to use the quarters during the weekends, and that he defray the cost of refreshments and entertainment. Garsson permitted Hopkins and his guests to charge their expenses to his account.

    c. In looking over his bills, Garsson noted the names of the persons who had signed the tabs charged to him. Among Harry Hopkins’s associates who had signed tabs were Carl Aldo Marzani and the whole array of the members of what was later proved to be the Hal Ware (Communist) cell that operated in the Government. Garsson stated that he did not become aware of the fact that he was acting as involuntary host to Hopkins’s Communist cell until after Marzani had been convicted and sent to jail for perjury in swearing in his State Department application that he was not, and never had been, a member of the Communist Party.

    5. Josephson, who was hardly an admirer of Roosevelt and his New Deal, lacks references for his allegations, but many factors militate in favor of their basic accuracy. The strongest of these is that they dovetail perfectly with the other Soviet-agent charges against Hopkins and, coming much earlier, they could not have been influenced by them. In combination, the charges are much stronger than any one of them is alone. http://www.dcdave.com/article5/110211.htm

    How am I doing so far?


    Doesn't seem to me to fit with "Harry Hopkins was a true patriot who labored through the period in question sick with cancer but tirelessly for America...."
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  2. PoliticalChic
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    Harold Ware founded this group. Ware was a Communist Party (CP) official working for the federal government in Washington, D.C.. By 1934, the group had grown to some 75 members, divided into cells. Members initially joined Marxist study groups and then into activities on behalf of the Party. They shared a belief that Marxist ideologies were the correct way to approach the problems of the ongoing Great Depression. Whittaker Chambers also stated that Ware could have been acting "pursuant to orders from the Central Committee of the Communist Party of the United States."
    Ware Group - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Harold Maskell "Hal" Ware (1889-1935) was an American Marxist regarded as one of the Communist Party's top experts on agriculture.
    Whittaker Chambers alleged that during the early 1930s he was a member of the so-called "Ware Group," a covert group of operatives within the United States government which aided Soviet intelligence agents.
    Chambers further wrote that "by 1938, the Soviet espionage apparatus in Washington had penetrated the US State Department, the US Treasury Department, the Bureau of Standards and the Aberdeen Proving Ground in Maryland.[28] These individuals "supplied the Soviet espionage apparatus with secret or confidential information, usually in the form of official United States Government documents for microfilming," Chambers stated.
    Chambers further wrote that "by 1938, the Soviet espionage apparatus in Washington had penetrated the US State Department, the US Treasury Department, the Bureau of Standards and the Aberdeen Proving Ground in Maryland.[28] These individuals "supplied the Soviet espionage apparatus with secret or confidential information, usually in the form of official United States Government documents for microfilming," Chambers stated.
    Harold Ware - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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  3. Camp
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    Camp VIP Member

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    Gosh, how could anyone agrue with your position when you have a major source like "The Home Page of DC Dave" to back up what otherwise appears to be ridiculous nonsense? Surely, with DC Dave backing you up your case is made.
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  4. PoliticalChic
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    PoliticalChic Gold Member

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    Once again, the most stupid of posters attempt to challenge the messenger when they realize that they can't challenge the message.


    In short.....which item can you counter?
    Are any untrue?

    None, huh?


    Oh...wait...you're the dunce who denied that he posted that calling Obama the messiah was a 'right wing ploy'....until I presented your post saying so, and I gave a dozen sources of Leftists and Liberals praising Obama as such.


    In short, it's ironic you suggesting that the source isn't credible.....when you have been proven not to be credible......

    Funny, huh?
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  5. Camp
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    You gave a dozen distorted out of context anectdotal examples of people who viewed Obama with spiritual feelings. I think only two of them mentioned messiah and some were purposefully sarcastic. After listing your cut and paste avalanche you did as you usualy do, you declared victory. Who cares?
    Now defend the use of THE HOMEPAGE OF DC DAVE as a legitimate source for use in a debate about FDR, STALIN AND WWII.
  6. CrusaderFrank
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    Hopkins was a tireless worker...for Stalin and Communism.

    That's why the Left loves and defends him
  7. PoliticalChic
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    PoliticalChic Gold Member

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    "...distorted out of context anectdotal examples..."


    You lying pile of garbage.....


    I gave you a dozen.....here's some more:


    1. 12/17/13 "On CNN’s Piers Morgan Live Tuesday, in a brief discussion about President Obama, Barbara Walters actually said, “We thought that he was going to be - I shouldn't say this at Christmastime, but - the next messiah”

    Read more: Barbara Walters on Obama: ?We Thought He Was Going To Be The Next Messiah? | NewsBusters


    2. And this brings us to Barack Obama’s liberal support during the campaign, which was decidedly different from the regular media bias that conservatives often complain about. “I haven’t seen a politician get this kind of walk-on-water coverage since Colin Powell a dozen years ago flirted with making a run for the White House,” said Washington Post media critic Howard Kurtz on Meet the Press in February 2007, a day after Obama announced his candidacy. “I mean, it is amazing . . . a guy with all of two years’ experience in the United States Senate getting coverage that ranges from positive to glowing to even gushing.”

    a. Samantha Fennell, formerly an associate publisher of Elle, wrote on the magazine’s website a month later: “When I attended my second “Obama Live” fund-raiser last week at New York City’s Grand Hyatt, . . . I was on my feet as Senator Obama entered the room. Fate had blessed me in this moment. . . . In a moment of divine intervention, he saw me,…”

    b. Evan Thomas, a Newsweek editor, on the show Hardball with Chris Matthews last June: …”Obama is standing above the country, above the world. He’s sort of God.”



    3. The deifications and hagiologies were particularly overt in the remarks of prominent black figures. Filmmaker Spike Lee, predicting an Obama victory, implicitly compared the candidate with Christ: “You’ll have to measure time by ‘Before Obama’ and ‘After Obama.’ . . .

    a. Jesse Jackson, Jr. called Obama’s securing the Democratic nomination “so extraordinary that another chapter could be added to the Bible to chronicle its significance.”

    b. Louis Farrakhan went one better, according to the website WorldNetDaily: “Barack has captured the youth. . . . That’s a sign. When the Messiah speaks, the youth will hear, and the Messiah is absolutely speaking.”

    c. The website ObamaMessiah.blogspot.com has diligently chronicled many more instances of such talk, which seems positively cringe-making in 2010.

    d. To this day, BarackObama.com displays at the top of its homepage the following words (attributed to Obama, though nobody seems to have been able to pinpoint the speech): “I’M ASKING YOU TO BELIEVE.


    [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=De_1aIrkfXI]Barbara Walters On Obama: 'We Thought He Was Going To Be The Next Messiah' - YouTube[/ame]






    Apologize, you moron!

    I demand nothing less than penitential prostration!
  8. PoliticalChic
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    PoliticalChic Gold Member

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    What....you don't like the facts from DC Dave???

    Well.....how about refuting any of 'em?



    And take a crack at this:

    6. "Hopkins apparently served his Soviet masters almost to the end of his days. The following passage is from pp. 118-119 of 'Stalin’s Secret Agents: The Subversion of Roosevelt’s Government,' by M. Stanton Evans and Herbert Romerstein (2012):

    a. Hopkins’s pro-Soviet leanings would be on further display in the Yalta records, where his handwritten comments are available for viewing. Though seriously ill at the time of the meeting, he continued to ply his influence with FDR, who himself was mortally sick and susceptible to suggestion in ways that we can only guess at.

    After FDR had made innumerable concessions to Stalin, there occurred a deadlock on the issue of “reparations.” At this point, Hopkins passed a note to Roosevelt that summed up the American attitude at Yalta. “Mr. President,” this said, “the Russians have given in so much at this conference I don’t think we should let them down. Let the British disagree if they want—and continue their disagreement at Moscow [in subsequent diplomatic meetings]” (Emphasis added by Evans and Romerstein).


    b. One may search the Yalta records at length and have trouble finding an issue of substance on which the Soviets had “given in” to FDR—the entire thrust of the conference, as Roosevelt loyalist [Robert] Sherwood acknowledged, being in the reverse direction. http://www.dcdave.com/article5/110211.htm



    Hey.....Smugly.....where are ya'?
    "Harry Hopkins was a true patriot who labored through the period in question sick with cancer but tirelessly for America ...."

    Seems not.


    How ya' like that, boyyyeeeee??
  9. whitehall
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    whitehall Gold Member Supporting Member

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    Don't forget the Soviet Union was an ally during WW2. Stalin was a robust leader and FDR was a frail shell of a president who may have had a few minor strokes that the democrat party and the media kept secret. Hopkins had a strange relationship with FDR and probably thought he was doing the right thing when he confided in Stalin. Truman's relationship with Russia turned on a dime after the war but he was stuck with the well entrenched communist party. It's amazing how the media managed to support FDR's relationship with Stalin and the new anti-communist attitude of the democrat party that created HUAC. When the Truman administration was found to be a conglomeration of spies, inept leadership and and nut cases the media managed to blame a republican senator and call it McCarthyism.
  10. Camp
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    That's my story and I'm sticking to it. If you don't understand "taking out of context", "distortion", "anecdotal" and "sarcasim" that is your problem.
  11. Bfgrn
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  12. PoliticalChic
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    PoliticalChic Gold Member

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    You've been identified as a liar, an now you've doubled down on that reputation.

    Neither unexpected, nor a problem.

    Live with it.
  13. PoliticalChic
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    PoliticalChic Gold Member

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    BoringFriendlessGuy.....whenever the conversation gets around to calling someone a "moron" or such, you needn't leap to embrace the appellation.
  14. PoliticalChic
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    Who do they love most,....Alger Hiss, Harry Hopkins.....

    ...or the traitor who offered to work with the Soviet Union against the President of the United States....that guy Ted 'killer' Kennedy?
  15. Bfgrn
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    Hopkins was misidentified as a spy by a former KGB agent who defected and was promoting a book. The agent "suspected" Hopkins was a spy based on a lecture he had heard 20 years before his defection by an agent who was making recollections over 20 years after WWII had ended. Oleg Gordievsky, the defecting agent, had no direct or empirical knowledge of Hopkin's or what the Verona documents designated as "Agent 19". He was a small child during WWII. The reference to Agent 19 which appeared in the declassified (1995) documents led to further claims that Hopkins was a spy.
    Later indisputable evidence surfaced that cleared Hopkins and identified Laurence Duggan as "Agent 19.
    These facts do not fit well with the conspiracy theory that Hopkins, the trusted aid to FDR, was a commie spy.
    Interestingly, Gen. George C. Marshall commented that Hopkins would never be recognized for the invaluable service he provided the nation during WWII.
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  17. PoliticalChic
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    Let's put aside for the moment that you have revealed yourself to be a liar, and one who denies clear evidence to the contrary of his beliefs.....

    ....and deal with this current post.

    Bloviation from a simpleton like you vs. actual scholarly research......

    ...gee.....which to belive?

    Harry Hopkins,- FDR's alter ego, co-president, or Rasputin, "...the closest and most influential adviser to President Franklin D. Roosevelt during World War II, was a Soviet agent." and “the most important of all Soviet wartime agents in the United States.”
    The Treachery Of Harry Hopkins

    and...

    Herbert Romerstein and Eric Breindel in their 2000 book, "The Venona Secrets: Exposing Soviet Espionage and America's Traitor."


    and....

    Venona project decrypts of Soviet communications with its spies, which came to light only in the 1990s, reveal a report on a Washington discussion between Roosevelt and Winston Churchill by an "agent 19." Only Harry Hopkins among suspected Soviet agents would have been privy to that conversation.


    and...

    Venona project decrypts of Soviet communications with its spies, which came to light only in the 1990s, reveal a report on a Washington discussion between Roosevelt and Winston Churchill by an "agent 19." Only Harry Hopkins among suspected Soviet agents would have been privy to that conversation.


    and....


    ...Murray Garsson noted the names of the persons who had signed the tabs charged to him. Among Harry Hopkins’s associates who had signed tabs were Carl Aldo Marzani and the whole array of the members of what was later proved to be the Hal Ware (Communist) cell that operated in the Government.


    and....

    "Hopkins apparently served his Soviet masters almost to the end of his days. The following passage is from pp. 118-119 of 'Stalin’s Secret Agents: The Subversion of Roosevelt’s Government,' by M. Stanton Evans and Herbert Romerstein, showing Hopkins pro-Stalin intervention at Yalta....




    And.....the most dispositive evidence that you are totally and irrevocably incorrect: BoringFriendlessGuy agrees with you.


    And, of course, this from Smugly Backside.....
    "Harry Hopkins was a true patriot who labored through the period in question sick with cancer but tirelessly for America......"

    NOT.
  18. PoliticalChic
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    7. Isn't it interesting that you and the cadre of chumps believe all of the Liberal propaganda, in the face of mountains of evidence.


    There is a fascinating book about the KGB, "The Sword and the Shield: The Mitrokhin Archive and the Secret History of the KGB," by Christopher Andrew and, Vasili Mitrokhin

    ......I've read it....have you?


    Mitrokhin's documents showed that Hopkins had warned the Soviet ambassador that the FBI had learned through a bug it had placed in the home of Steve Nelson, a Soviet illegal agent, that Nelson was getting money from the embassy. He met (KGB head in USA) Ahkmerov from time to time, giving him information to send to Moscow and receiving secret messages from Stalin....Ray Wannall, former FBI assistant director for counter-intelligence, says he always suspected that Hopkins was a Soviet agent and that this is proof of his treachery.
    seed-flame: 16 Venona Secrets, etc.



    Here's the deal: if you are finally convinced of Hopkins' duplicity......you can run away and hide.
    That's the pro forma of Liberals when they are embarrassed.
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2014
  19. Camp
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    Scholarly research?
    The Treachery of Harry Hopkins??? Are you talking about a friggin book review by pundits Reed Irvin and Cliff Kincaid? Please tell me there is a book or something besides a book review being used as a scholarly source.
    You used a couple of books by Herb Romerstein, an investigator for the House on UnAmerican Activities back in the Joe McCarthy days and Eric Breindel, a former executive for News Corp. and conservative pundit.
    Be as nasty as you wish. I just happen to respect reliable sources and think bull shit ones suck and are only good for misinforming folks. You seem to enjoy misinforming folks. It is what it is.
  20. JakeStarkey
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    Harry Hopkins....Soviet Spy deserves an answer, which is "nope."

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