Greetings from israel/germany

[Kalam]

There's been an attempted genocide of Muslims in Russia's Caucasian provinces, especially Chechnya, for years. It's died down considerably. Russia has realized that Muslims will not be attacked without reprisal; I hope that the heroic actions of the mujahideen there have sent a message to other potentially genocidal states.

BS, the stories are the Russian Skin heads are growing faster than any other groups. Not fueled by their hatred of Jews (since few Jews are left), rather fueled by their 25% and every growing Muslim population.

What does this have to do with the conflict in Chechnya?

 

[Kalam]

I hope that the heroic actions of the mujahideen there have sent a message to other potentially genocidal states.

Hope for the Best.

Prepare for the Worst.....

That's the right attitude.

 

[Samson]

There's been an attempted genocide of Muslims in Russia's Caucasian provinces, especially Chechnya, for years. It's died down considerably. Russia has realized that Muslims will not be attacked without reprisal; I hope that the heroic actions of the mujahideen there have sent a message to other potentially genocidal states.

BS, the stories are the Russian Skin heads are growing faster than any other groups. Not fueled by their hatred of Jews (since few Jews are left), rather fueled by their 25% and every growing Muslim population.

I doubt that Russian Skinheads are so discriminating that they'd hesitate to consider the broader implications of stomping a Jew to death vs beating a Muslim to death.

By the way, WELCOME TO THE BOARD, Winston!!!!

 

[Samson]

If the Germans keep the Holocaust within their borders, we won't care. Same how we did nothing with Rwanda and are currently ignoring the Congo and Sudan!

I disagree.

If Germans began loading Muslims into Railcars, we would insist they ship them to ports, where we would import them for humanitarian causes, and to staff the night shifts at 7 Elevens throughout the nation.

 

[Winston Smith]

Are there other European Countries that have a past of Jewish Holocaust but don't have "the courage to deal with the past and learn from it?"

I think he was making a point of point to the Turks, who barbarically slaughtered the Aremanians and now deny it like the pricks they are!

actually, i wasn't referring to the turks, but to other countries in europe, who's citizenry was no less antisemitic than the nazis, but use the nazi occupation as an excuse to not deal with their coopeation with the nazis (ukraine, poland, austria - take your pick...). but you do have a point regarding the armenian genocide...

 

[The Rabbi]

Interesting that a Jew would move from Israel to Germany.

Frankly, I'd have found somewhere with a history of being a little more hospitable.

samson,
i was took part in two youth exchange programs when i was younger, so i learned to look beyond the historical context (though not ignoring it). Besides, in my experience, germany is the only european country thathad had the courage to deal with past and learn from it.

Are there other European Countries that have a past of Jewish Holocaust but don't have "the courage to deal with the past and learn from it?"

Poland.
Lithuania
White Russia
Ukraine
Croatia
France
Estonia

All of them complicit in the Nazi Holocaust. Not one of them the least bit apologetic.

 

[AquaAthena]

Welcome Winston. A *kewl* place you have joined. [I'm a whole three weeks new here myself..lol] So far, I have met some very nice ppl who have made my decision to join, a correct one. An eclectic group for sure..lol.

 

[Samson]

samson,
i was took part in two youth exchange programs when i was younger, so i learned to look beyond the historical context (though not ignoring it). Besides, in my experience, germany is the only european country thathad had the courage to deal with past and learn from it.

Are there other European Countries that have a past of Jewish Holocaust but don't have "the courage to deal with the past and learn from it?"

Poland.
Lithuania
White Russia
Ukraine
Croatia
France
Estonia

All of them complicit in the Nazi Holocaust. Not one of them the least bit apologetic.

Do you really expect an apology from White Russia?

 

[Terry]

Interesting that a Jew would move from Israel to Germany.

Frankly, I'd have found somewhere with a history of being a little more hospitable.

samson,
i was took part in two youth exchange programs when i was younger, so i learned to look beyond
the historical context (though not ignoring it). Besides, in my experience, germany is the only european country thathad had the courage to deal with past and learn from it.

@terry

ich lebe zur zeit in münchen. Warst du schon mal da?

I lived in Frankfurt and I have family that lives in Lauf. Only stopped to visit Munich a few times. My favorite place I visited in Germany was Garmisch. Mother is full German born and raised, moved to the states with my father she met, then I was born.

 

[Winston Smith]

Are there other European Countries that have a past of Jewish Holocaust but don't have "the courage to deal with the past and learn from it?"

Poland.
Lithuania
White Russia
Ukraine
Croatia
France
Estonia

All of them complicit in the Nazi Holocaust. Not one of them the least bit apologetic.

Do you really expect an apology from White Russia?

i don't think anybody "expects" an apology from any of those countries. but maybe the fact that they have chosen to ignore their past (because its so easy to put it all on the germans) is the reason antisemitism runs rampant inside their borders to this day. if you don't ignore your past, you can't really learn from it...

@terry -

never even heard of Lauf....probably a small village, right? garmisch is still one of the hotspots around here...especially during ski season...

 

[Jos]

It's chutzpa to ask people to apologize for something that happened before they were born to people who where born after the event

 

[xotoxi]

I will always welcome another Deutschebag to the forum!

I am xotoxi.

 

[Winston Smith]

It's chutzpa to ask people to apologize for something that happened before they were born to people who where born after the event

i don't expect any person to apologize for what happened during ww2, but governments DO have a responsibility to the actions of their predecessors, don't you agree? you know, i actually don't give a damn even if the governments apologize or not. but the fact is that most of the european govenments have actively ignored their antisemitic past instead of trying to deal with it. a great example for that is the decision to build a hotel on the site of the babi yar massacre (ukarine).

 

[Terry]

Poland.
Lithuania
White Russia
Ukraine
Croatia
France
Estonia

All of them complicit in the Nazi Holocaust. Not one of them the least bit apologetic.

Do you really expect an apology from White Russia?

i don't think anybody "expects" an apology from any of those countries. but maybe the fact that they have chosen to ignore their past (because its so easy to put it all on the germans) is the reason antisemitism runs rampant inside their borders to this day. if you don't ignore your past, you can't really learn from it...

@terry -

never even heard of Lauf....probably a small village, right? garmisch is still one of the hotspots around here...especially during ski season...

Yes right out side of Nürnberg

 

[Samson]

Poland.
Lithuania
White Russia
Ukraine
Croatia
France
Estonia

All of them complicit in the Nazi Holocaust. Not one of them the least bit apologetic.

Do you really expect an apology from White Russia?

i don't think anybody "expects" an apology from any of those countries. but maybe the fact that they have chosen to ignore their past (because its so easy to put it all on the germans) is the reason antisemitism runs rampant inside their borders to this day. if you don't ignore your past, you can't really learn from it......

I just used White Russia because it appeared to be the most absurd "country" on Rabbi's List of Unrepentant Holocaust Deniers. The fact is that it simply doesn't exist.

The same arguement can be made for the remainder of the list. The names have changed, but their governments today resemble nothing like what they were over 70 years ago.

I am curious: What could they do, today, to not ignore their past?

(Rather than answer here, it might attract more discussion if you started another thread). If you prefer, then I'll do it.

 

[GHook93]

It's chutzpa to ask people to apologize for something that happened before they were born to people who where born after the event

Que? Didn't we make an apology to the Native Americans?

Didn't the Australians just make an apology to the Aborigines

 

[The Rabbi]

Do you really expect an apology from White Russia?

i don't think anybody "expects" an apology from any of those countries. but maybe the fact that they have chosen to ignore their past (because its so easy to put it all on the germans) is the reason antisemitism runs rampant inside their borders to this day. if you don't ignore your past, you can't really learn from it......

I just used White Russia because it appeared to be the most absurd "country" on Rabbi's List of Unrepentant Holocaust Deniers. The fact is that it simply doesn't exist.

The same arguement can be made for the remainder of the list. The names have changed, but their governments today resemble nothing like what they were over 70 years ago.

I am curious: What could they do, today, to not ignore their past?

(Rather than answer here, it might attract more discussion if you started another thread). If you prefer, then I'll do it.

Doesnt exist, eh? Would be news to them:
Belarus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Pretending that these are successor states and governments is merely a dodge.
What could they do? In Poland's case they could open up claims for reparations of property confiscated by the Poles/Nazis. They could sponsor more scholarship of the issue. They could debate and issue apologies for the actions of their fathers and grandfathers.
What did the Germans do? Whatever they did, it worked.

 

[Hugidwyn]

It is interesting that after the so-called "Muslim genocide" population of Chechnya, according to the Census 2002 population has increased.

According to the 1989 census in the Chechen-Ingush population of 1,270,000 people, including the Chechens - 734000, Ingush - 164000, Russian - 372000

After separation into two administrative areas and exit and destruction of all Russian, arithmetic is simple, the Chechens were 734000.

According to the 2002 census in Chechnya live 1,088,816 people, or population increase amounted to 354,816 persons.

 

[Kalam]

It is interesting that after the so-called "Muslim genocide" population of Chechnya, according to the Census 2002 population has increased.

According to the 1989 census in the Chechen-Ingush population of 1,270,000 people, including the Chechens - 734000, Ingush - 164000, Russian - 372000

After separation into two administrative areas and exit and destruction of all Russian, arithmetic is simple, the Chechens were 734000.

According to the 2002 census in Chechnya live 1,088,816 people, or population increase amounted to 354,816 persons.

Your FSB thugs and their apostate minions have killed up to 100,000 innocents in Chechnya over the course of the two wars. These aren't accidental casualties, they're the result of "cleansing" operations in villages and bombing campaigns against civilian targets. Were it not for the ferocity of the mujahideen, we both know that those figures would be much higher.

You destroyed any chance you had of reaching a peaceful resolution when you murdered Mashkadov.