Green Technology: What WILL Happen

[IndependntLogic]

MY PREDICTIONS: GREEN TECHNOLOGY: Technology always comes in three phases: At first it is VERY expensive and NOT very efficient. Then, after it has been around a while, it becomes more efficient and affordable by the upper-middle-class or wealthier. Finally, it becomes extremely efficient and affordable by virtually everyone. What do cars, TV’s, computers, cell phone all have in common? They were all considered fads or “schemes” by those who had a financial interest in seeing them fail, and the older people who were more comfortable with the “old way” of doing things before they were around. This is the case with “Green Technology” – especially when it comes to cars. All the technology for it is already around. However, there has never before been a product or technology that would so adversely affect so many powerful industries. This is reflected in the negative spin and attacks on green technology by FOX News, which is owned in large part, by Saudi Prince Alwaleed bin Talal. Additionally, American and British Oil interests have bought the patents on green technology for decades, simply to make sure they weren’t developed. If the technology were something that could be hoarded by ownership of resources, they would have allowed the commercialization of clean tech long ago. But how do you hoard the sun? So once the Green Products are released on a commercially viable scale, they will simply be reverse-engineered and reproduced, driving the cost down even further. The country that develops this technology first, will enjoy the single greatest boost to any economy in the world but only for five to ten years at most. However, the leaders in this technology will enjoy financial wealth at a rate proportionate to the decline of wealth in the Middle East. The Japanese are likely to be the first mass-marketers of a variety of these products. They have no major oil companies and their auto manufacturers are already preparing for what is to come, while American and British media are doing their best to convince their audiences that, although we can fly a man to the moon, we can’t figure out a way to build a car that runs on something other than gas. Heating homes and other energy needs will also be addressed by non-fossil fuels within a generation. Remember the first time you saw a solar calculator? This technology will continue to improve until a panel the size of a coffee table, will be sufficient to heat the home it is mounted on. This will apply to virtually every area of clean technology and by 2050, the use of fossil fuel cars etc… will no longer be a necessity at all but rather an option for those who still love their old gas-powered cars, even though the new ones will blow their doors off and handle better.

 

[whitehall]

As long as green technology is consumer driven it will evolve at a logical pace consistent with development and affordability. If the left wing politicians get involved and taxpayer funds are authorized based on political agenda or political payoffs all bets are off.

 

[Douger]

It works quite well in my neighborhood.

 

[IndependntLogic]

As long as green technology is consumer driven it will evolve at a logical pace consistent with development and affordability. If the left wing politicians get involved and taxpayer funds are authorized based on political agenda or political payoffs all bets are off.

That's reasonable. So are you against oil subsidies and tax breaks? I'm not assuming, I'm jsut curious.

 

[RGR]

It works quite well in my neighborhood.

Same here. Makes me wonder what all the fuss is about sometimes.

 

[percysunshine]

'Shit Happens' is one of the laws of thermodynamics.

And there is no such thing as a free lunch.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Let me guess, you think the sun will rise in the morning too.

that is not a prediction, it is a description of observed trends.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

http://www.usmessageboard.com/5340746-post1.html

 

[percysunshine]

Let me guess, you think the sun will rise in the morning too.

that is not a prediction, it is a description of observed trends.

Why are you afraid of predicting that the sun will rise tomorrow?

Seems like a safe bet.

 

[IndependntLogic]

'Shit Happens' is one of the laws of thermodynamics.

And there is no such thing as a free lunch.

Well that's um, very uh, nice. And uh, A house divided against itself will fall!

http://www.usmessageboard.com/5340746-post1.html

Do you understand this thread is about technology?

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Let me guess, you think the sun will rise in the morning too.

that is not a prediction, it is a description of observed trends.

Why are you afraid of predicting that the sun will rise tomorrow?

Seems like a safe bet.

With Mother nature all bets are off.

 

[whitehall]

As long as green technology is consumer driven it will evolve at a logical pace consistent with development and affordability. If the left wing politicians get involved and taxpayer funds are authorized based on political agenda or political payoffs all bets are off.

That's reasonable. So are you against oil subsidies and tax breaks? I'm not assuming, I'm jsut curious.

The freaking world runs on oil. Commodity prices depend on oil. We need oil to heat our homes in the winter. Why wouldn't I support subsidies that keep the energy flowing?

 

[percysunshine]

Let me guess, you think the sun will rise in the morning too.

that is not a prediction, it is a description of observed trends.

Why are you afraid of predicting that the sun will rise tomorrow?

Seems like a safe bet.

With Mother nature all bets are off.

Well, shit happens, but for the past 5 billion years, that shit has never happened.

 

[IndependntLogic]

As long as green technology is consumer driven it will evolve at a logical pace consistent with development and affordability. If the left wing politicians get involved and taxpayer funds are authorized based on political agenda or political payoffs all bets are off.

That's reasonable. So are you against oil subsidies and tax breaks? I'm not assuming, I'm jsut curious.

The freaking world runs on oil. Commodity prices depend on oil. We need oil to heat our homes in the winter. Why wouldn't I support subsidies that keep the energy flowing?

So you're all for taxpayer money being given to profitable, private companies. Ah. A statist!

So this post had nothing to do with politics at all. It's simply about energy. But based on your response, it's obvious you feel the MSNBC and CNN are the "Liberal Media" and FOX is the only fair station, and that you do not vote Dem.
It's interesting to observe how many people have so thoroughly indoctrinated into believing that a technology that could only help the environment and also bankrupt the Middle East (or at least strike a severe blow), must be a bad thing because of the political spin and positioning that has been masterfully attached to it.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Why are you afraid of predicting that the sun will rise tomorrow?

Seems like a safe bet.

With Mother nature all bets are off.

Well, shit happens, but for the past 5 billion years, that shit has never happened.

Yep shit happens but you may never wake up to know if the sun rises or not.

 

[flacaltenn]

MY PREDICTIONS: GREEN TECHNOLOGY: Technology always comes in three phases: At first it is VERY expensive and NOT very efficient. Then, after it has been around a while, it becomes more efficient and affordable by the upper-middle-class or wealthier. Finally, it becomes extremely efficient and affordable by virtually everyone. What do cars, TV’s, computers, cell phone all have in common? They were all considered fads or “schemes” by those who had a financial interest in seeing them fail, and the older people who were more comfortable with the “old way” of doing things before they were around. This is the case with “Green Technology” – especially when it comes to cars. All the technology for it is already around. However, there has never before been a product or technology that would so adversely affect so many powerful industries. This is reflected in the negative spin and attacks on green technology by FOX News, which is owned in large part, by Saudi Prince Alwaleed bin Talal. Additionally, American and British Oil interests have bought the patents on green technology for decades, simply to make sure they weren’t developed. If the technology were something that could be hoarded by ownership of resources, they would have allowed the commercialization of clean tech long ago. But how do you hoard the sun? So once the Green Products are released on a commercially viable scale, they will simply be reverse-engineered and reproduced, driving the cost down even further. The country that develops this technology first, will enjoy the single greatest boost to any economy in the world but only for five to ten years at most. However, the leaders in this technology will enjoy financial wealth at a rate proportionate to the decline of wealth in the Middle East. The Japanese are likely to be the first mass-marketers of a variety of these products. They have no major oil companies and their auto manufacturers are already preparing for what is to come, while American and British media are doing their best to convince their audiences that, although we can fly a man to the moon, we can’t figure out a way to build a car that runs on something other than gas. Heating homes and other energy needs will also be addressed by non-fossil fuels within a generation. Remember the first time you saw a solar calculator? This technology will continue to improve until a panel the size of a coffee table, will be sufficient to heat the home it is mounted on. This will apply to virtually every area of clean technology and by 2050, the use of fossil fuel cars etc… will no longer be a necessity at all but rather an option for those who still love their old gas-powered cars, even though the new ones will blow their doors off and handle better.

Certainly -- you're joking about the part where we have to wait for price to come down some more. The Solar panel industry is over 30 years old. CARTER put PV panels on the White House. Being an electronics designer, I can tell you -- the tech is mature and there is NOT a huge breakthru to be had. Actually, the DOE told us DECADES ago that we could make better solar panels if we used GA-AS instead of silicon, but it's kind of a hard sell to mine TONS of arsenic for such a green product..

The promise of fuel cells is virtually destroyed by the hype of hydrogen in -- water vapor out as MOST commercial fuel cells now run on nat gas (a fossil fuel). Same for all the other charades of GREEN energy. The Sierra (which played a role in foisting giant dams on the public for hydro) now wants desparately to tear the dams down. That's a great idea actually if your rebuilt enough nuclear capacity.

Wind and solar are so intermittent and opportunistic that they are a NIGHTMARE to add to the grid system. They will never account for more than 20% of any major grid. I'll give you the 20%, but today you are paying not only for the wind turbine, but for the nat gas peaker generator to back it up when the winds don't blow...

Take your crystal ball and spend your OWN MONEY to place the bets. I've placed mine myself....

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Let me guess, you think the sun will rise in the morning too.

that is not a prediction, it is a description of observed trends.

Why are you afraid of predicting that the sun will rise tomorrow?

Seems like a safe bet.

That was my point, calling the BS in the OP a prediction is like betting on the sunrise.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Why are you afraid of predicting that the sun will rise tomorrow?

Seems like a safe bet.

With Mother nature all bets are off.

Well, shit happens, but for the past 5 billion years, that shit has never happened.

Don't tell that to the dinosaurs.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

With Mother nature all bets are off.

Well, shit happens, but for the past 5 billion years, that shit has never happened.

Don't tell that to the dinosaurs.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iNkt-ZRyiZM]Chiffon Margerine - It's Not Nice to Fool Mother Nature - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Middleoftheroad]

MY PREDICTIONS: GREEN TECHNOLOGY: Technology always comes in three phases: At first it is VERY expensive and NOT very efficient. Then, after it has been around a while, it becomes more efficient and affordable by the upper-middle-class or wealthier. Finally, it becomes extremely efficient and affordable by virtually everyone. What do cars, TV’s, computers, cell phone all have in common? They were all considered fads or “schemes” by those who had a financial interest in seeing them fail, and the older people who were more comfortable with the “old way” of doing things before they were around. This is the case with “Green Technology” – especially when it comes to cars. All the technology for it is already around. However, there has never before been a product or technology that would so adversely affect so many powerful industries. This is reflected in the negative spin and attacks on green technology by FOX News, which is owned in large part, by Saudi Prince Alwaleed bin Talal. Additionally, American and British Oil interests have bought the patents on green technology for decades, simply to make sure they weren’t developed. If the technology were something that could be hoarded by ownership of resources, they would have allowed the commercialization of clean tech long ago. But how do you hoard the sun? So once the Green Products are released on a commercially viable scale, they will simply be reverse-engineered and reproduced, driving the cost down even further. The country that develops this technology first, will enjoy the single greatest boost to any economy in the world but only for five to ten years at most. However, the leaders in this technology will enjoy financial wealth at a rate proportionate to the decline of wealth in the Middle East. The Japanese are likely to be the first mass-marketers of a variety of these products. They have no major oil companies and their auto manufacturers are already preparing for what is to come, while American and British media are doing their best to convince their audiences that, although we can fly a man to the moon, we can’t figure out a way to build a car that runs on something other than gas. Heating homes and other energy needs will also be addressed by non-fossil fuels within a generation. Remember the first time you saw a solar calculator? This technology will continue to improve until a panel the size of a coffee table, will be sufficient to heat the home it is mounted on. This will apply to virtually every area of clean technology and by 2050, the use of fossil fuel cars etc… will no longer be a necessity at all but rather an option for those who still love their old gas-powered cars, even though the new ones will blow their doors off and handle better.

Certainly -- you're joking about the part where we have to wait for price to come down some more. The Solar panel industry is over 30 years old. CARTER put PV panels on the White House. Being an electronics designer, I can tell you -- the tech is mature and there is NOT a huge breakthru to be had. Actually, the DOE told us DECADES ago that we could make better solar panels if we used GA-AS instead of silicon, but it's kind of a hard sell to mine TONS of arsenic for such a green product..

The promise of fuel cells is virtually destroyed by the hype of hydrogen in -- water vapor out as MOST commercial fuel cells now run on nat gas (a fossil fuel). Same for all the other charades of GREEN energy. The Sierra (which played a role in foisting giant dams on the public for hydro) now wants desparately to tear the dams down. That's a great idea actually if your rebuilt enough nuclear capacity.

Wind and solar are so intermittent and opportunistic that they are a NIGHTMARE to add to the grid system. They will never account for more than 20% of any major grid. I'll give you the 20%, but today you are paying not only for the wind turbine, but for the nat gas peaker generator to back it up when the winds don't blow...

Take your crystal ball and spend your OWN MONEY to place the bets. I've placed mine myself....

What are you basing this all off of? Its a mature technology? Last year it reached its lowest price ever. Was last year the magic number that it reached its lowest mark? Do you have any proof of that? No? didn't think so.
The food industry is the oldest industry in the world, since, ya know, we've always had to eat. Yet food constantly gets cheaper and cheaper. Weird huh? Computers? Same thing. Constantly cheaper. Each and every year.

And oh yea. They are not as big of a problem to add to the grid as you think. Especially when you consider that solar hits its peak at peak hours. Ya know, the hottest part of the day is usually when the sun is shining the most. Another of those weird coincidences. Also studies have already shown that it is possible to run 90% on wind and solar alone. That 20% number is a joke as many areas already run on much more then this. Palm springs, California, runs on wind energy alone approximately 300 days a year. But 20% would be 73 days a year. How is that possible? I guess its not. Palm Springs isn't real I guess right?

Edit: Also, you know what else requires those peak natural gas plants? Natural gas. Thats why when real studies show the price of Natural gas electricity they use combination prices.