Green Energy wont work - Who are you kidding?

[Old Rocks]

Dirty energy is last century's energy.

Tell that to the Russians and Chinese. Putin went so far as to drop ALL green initiatives saying "Russia will not pursue ANY energy that is not carbon or nuclear based. The chinese just built the Three Gorges Dam that has flooded hundreds of square miles of land and destroyed many dozen villages.

Nitol: Russia's Emerging Solar Power Star - BusinessWeek

Dmitry Kotenko admits that when he and a group of friends decided to found their own business in 1998, they had no idea what exactly the new business would do. They knew only that they wanted their business to be New, Innovative, and Technological. Hence the name: Nitol.

Ten years later, Nitol has not only a techie-sounding name but also a dynamic business to match. Now called Nitol Solar, the company is Russia's largest producer of polysilicon, the basic raw material used to make solar panels that turn sunlight into electricity. Nitol stands out as an all-too-rare commodity in Russia: a technologically savvy company that has grown in the space of a few years from tiny startup to billion-dollar success story. It's a model that Russia's leaders say they are eager to promote as the country casts around for new ways to achieve economic competitiveness in the 21st century.

Lately, nothing seems to have captured the imagination of politicians more forcefully than alternative energy. In an interview with CNBC host and BusinessWeek columnist Maria Bartiromo on June 4, President Dmitry Medvedev emphasized the importance for Russia of "cutting-edge technologies," especially in "green economy, energy saving, and energy efficiency." It's a theme both he and Prime Minister Vladimir Putin increasingly have emphasized in recent months.

 

[homeontherange]

Tell that to the Russians and Chinese. Putin went so far as to drop ALL green initiatives saying "Russia will not pursue ANY energy that is not carbon or nuclear based. The chinese just built the Three Gorges Dam that has flooded hundreds of square miles of land and destroyed many dozen villages.

WUXI, China — President Obama wants to make the United States “the world’s leading exporter of renewable energy,” but in his seven months in office, it is China that has stepped on the gas in an effort to become the dominant player in green energy — especially in solar power, and even in the United States.

Uh-huh.

Cheap trinkets from China at Wal-Mart are the death of the American worker, but goofy windmills from China are the savior of the planet.

You leftloons and your blatant double standards sure are a hoot.

Is that why so many people drive Toyotas and Hondas? Which employ a LOT of American workers?

 

[Old Rocks]

Tell that to the Russians and Chinese. Putin went so far as to drop ALL green initiatives saying "Russia will not pursue ANY energy that is not carbon or nuclear based. The chinese just built the Three Gorges Dam that has flooded hundreds of square miles of land and destroyed many dozen villages.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/25/business/energy-environment/25solar.html?_r=1

WUXI, China — President Obama wants to make the United States “the world’s leading exporter of renewable energy,” but in his seven months in office, it is China that has stepped on the gas in an effort to become the dominant player in green energy — especially in solar power, and even in the United States.

Uh-huh.

Cheap trinkets from China at Wal-Mart are the death of the American worker, but goofy windmills from China are the savior of the planet.

You leftloons and your blatant double standards sure are a hoot.

Still working at being stupid, I see. 25 Gw installed, and more being installed every day. China is already a major player in alternative energy, and will be a major force in this field.

 

[homeontherange]

WUXI, China — President Obama wants to make the United States “the world’s leading exporter of renewable energy,” but in his seven months in office, it is China that has stepped on the gas in an effort to become the dominant player in green energy — especially in solar power, and even in the United States.

Uh-huh.

Cheap trinkets from China at Wal-Mart are the death of the American worker, but goofy windmills from China are the savior of the planet.

You leftloons and your blatant double standards sure are a hoot.

Still working at being stupid, I see. 25 Gw installed, and more being installed every day. China is already a major player in alternative energy, and will be a major force in this field.

Why don't the big energy companies use their subsidies to fund sustainable energy? Why did they let themselves fall behind countries like China?

 

[homeontherange]

Uh-huh.

Cheap trinkets from China at Wal-Mart are the death of the American worker, but goofy windmills from China are the savior of the planet.

You leftloons and your blatant double standards sure are a hoot.

Still working at being stupid, I see. 25 Gw installed, and more being installed every day. China is already a major player in alternative energy, and will be a major force in this field.

Why don't the big energy companies use their subsidies to fund sustainable energy? Why did they let themselves fall behind countries like China?

Not that these energy companies are American, by any means.

 

[homeontherange]

I mean, BP is hardly American. Neither is Royal Dutch Shell. And so many more.

 

[homeontherange]

I see no one has any real answers here. Why don't we focus our attention on the real problem, which is the Federal Reserve.

 

[SFC Ollie]

Wind is competative enough

Wind Energy Outlook for North America Pike Research

In 2008, United States wind power generation capacity passed the 25 gigawatt mark by adding over 8 gigawatts from the year before, which represented the largest individual gain of any country in the world. This growth rate of 50% exceeded that of the year before, indicating that the market is still relatively young and has room to grow, despite the economic slowdown. The market for wind turbines will continue to grow through 2015 driven by new generation additions as well as replacements of smaller, older turbines with new, larger, more efficient turbines. In 2007, generation capacity from renewable sources made up only 4% of the world’s electricity sources, but 16% of new electricity generation capacity additions were from renewables with wind power making up more than 80% of these gains by renewables

Once again:

For two years, the city of Durango, Colo., bought electricity for all its government buildings from wind farms. The City Council ended that program this year, reverting to electricity derived from coal-burning plants and saving the cash-strapped city about $45,000.

Going green can cost too much green - USATODAY.com

 

[Big Fitz]

WUXI, China — President Obama wants to make the United States “the world’s leading exporter of renewable energy,” but in his seven months in office, it is China that has stepped on the gas in an effort to become the dominant player in green energy — especially in solar power, and even in the United States.

Uh-huh.

Cheap trinkets from China at Wal-Mart are the death of the American worker, but goofy windmills from China are the savior of the planet.

You leftloons and your blatant double standards sure are a hoot.

Is that why so many people drive Toyotas and Hondas? Which employ a LOT of American workers?

Those are Japanese cars.

 

[Big Fitz]

Uh-huh.

Cheap trinkets from China at Wal-Mart are the death of the American worker, but goofy windmills from China are the savior of the planet.

You leftloons and your blatant double standards sure are a hoot.

Still working at being stupid, I see. 25 Gw installed, and more being installed every day. China is already a major player in alternative energy, and will be a major force in this field.

Why don't the big energy companies use their subsidies to fund sustainable energy? Why did they let themselves fall behind countries like China?

Because China has a state energy concern and can do lots of things private companies can't due to the fact they can use tax monies to suppliment their activities.

And as for these great whopping subsidies we give oil companies. we also tax them like crazy, charge them rent for drilling, and fees for operating and then of course, look for every chance possible to fine them and take more profit away from them.

The average profit margin in oil is less than 10%. A Mutual fund is 80% an profit margin. Even Bill Gates gets a paltry 25%. But oil is essential for all modern life on this planet... the others not so much but they're hated far less.

 

[topspin]

wind and solar cost are coming down. Niether is close to being competetive. Saw a show last night where some snake oil solar panel salesman shiested some old lady out of 18k for solar panes. He tells her it'll displace 90% of her electricity when 30% is the reality.
It takes most people decades to pay off with subsidies.
I'm not agaisnt the green fundies, but I doubt the output for the tax payer money will be 1/10 what it would be for conventional energy sources.

 

[Douger]

Well. I built my own tower and installed the rig myself. I put out 600-800kwh per month +-.
The whole rig ran about $7000.

 

[Old Rocks]

Uh-huh.

Cheap trinkets from China at Wal-Mart are the death of the American worker, but goofy windmills from China are the savior of the planet.

You leftloons and your blatant double standards sure are a hoot.

Is that why so many people drive Toyotas and Hondas? Which employ a LOT of American workers?

Those are Japanese cars.

Look at the individual parts on your Ford and GM. Note how many are made in other nations. In fact, I saw a post that claimed there was one Toyota model that had more American made parts than most GM and Ford models. Didn't check it out, but would not be surprised were that actually the case.

 

[Old Rocks]

You can build a 1 kw windmill for about $200. You can have a 5 kw solar system for $10,000. Of course, you have to do the installation work yourself. But given the claim of so many on this board to exceptional intellectual powers, that should not be a problem for them.

 

[Old Rocks]

Home Power Magazine: Solar | Wind | Water | Design | Build

 

[manu1959]

Vanda since you seem to be in love with oil.... go take a swim in the gulf maybe that will change your opinion1 I would at least LIKE to have the choice to plug in my vehicle.

plug it into an electric grid fed by oil.....

 

[CurveLight]

I have been reading some of the posts on other threads and I still dont see anyone who can support the Green position with facts. We need to drill for oil. Do you really think we are going to cut down energy use in this country? or plug in a car every night?

There is a single solar tower in Spain that powers 10,000 homes. The use of fossil fuels has been long overrated because oil companies have been buying out and shutting down several alt-sources for everything from cars to homes. Wake up.

 

[topspin]

I have been reading some of the posts on other threads and I still dont see anyone who can support the Green position with facts. We need to drill for oil. Do you really think we are going to cut down energy use in this country? or plug in a car every night?

There is a single solar tower in Spain that powers 10,000 homes. The use of fossil fuels has been long overrated because oil companies have been buying out and shutting down several alt-sources for everything from cars to homes. Wake up.

thanks for the comedy

 

[SFC Ollie]

I have been reading some of the posts on other threads and I still dont see anyone who can support the Green position with facts. We need to drill for oil. Do you really think we are going to cut down energy use in this country? or plug in a car every night?

There is a single solar tower in Spain that powers 10,000 homes. The use of fossil fuels has been long overrated because oil companies have been buying out and shutting down several alt-sources for everything from cars to homes. Wake up.

thanks for the comedy

How many of those towers would we need to build in , oh , let's say NYC?

 

[CurveLight]

There is a single solar tower in Spain that powers 10,000 homes. The use of fossil fuels has been long overrated because oil companies have been buying out and shutting down several alt-sources for everything from cars to homes. Wake up.

thanks for the comedy

How many of those towers would we need to build in , oh , let's say NYC?

I have no idea how many it would take and right now that is a moot question.
This is going to require you to step out of the tradition bipolar logic of black and white. You don't need to convert everything at once. If you can use the current green technology where it is usable that would reduce the overall consumption of fossil fuels. What would that do? Eventually reduce their prices. The Petrodollar has been the rudder most overlooked and it is responsible for many issues from oil companies shutting down production on alt energy sources to the reason we are occupying iraq and afghanistan.