Greece Closes Banks, Stocks Plummet

[hipeter924]

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/30/business/international/daily-stock-market-activity.html

PARIS — Global markets shuddered on Monday after Greece closed its banks amid fears that the country was headed toward default.

Stocks slumped modestly on Wall Street, after markets in Europe were buffeted by worries that the Greek debt crisis would prove contagious and Chinese investors endured another topsy-turvy session.

By early afternoon in New York, the Dow Jones industrial average was down 1.1 percent, the Standard & Poor’s 500 was down 1.4 percent, and the Nasdaq average had fallen 1.2 percent.

The Euro Stoxx 50 index, comprising the eurozone’s big blue chip companies, closed 4.2 percent lower, after being down about 5 percent at the opening. The FTSE 100 index in London fell 2 percent.

In Greece, banks and markets will be closed for the week, after Prime Minister Alexis Tsipras interrupted last-ditch debt negotiations early Saturday with the announcement that he was calling a referendum for July 5 on whether to accept the tough terms offered by international creditors.

Looks like Greece is going to default.

Though the terms are too extreme for its government to accept aka they are being forced to privatize everything and raise taxes with an ideological gun to their head: European Commission - PRESS RELEASES - Press release - Information from the European Commission on the latest draft proposals in the context of negotiations with Greece

 

[Manonthestreet]

I hope they hold the line......shove it right up merkals ass

 

[B. Kidd]

Greece is full of deadbeats.
Good thing we don't have many deadbeats here........

 

[hipeter924]

I hope they hold the line......shove it right up merkals ass

They should have in '09 and defaulted back then, as it would have been way less debt for them to pay off.

But they were naive enough to believe that the IMF/World Bank would save Greece, even though they messed up big in Argentina - which has so much in debt after following IMF/World Bank policy that it defaults frequently.

 

[Manonthestreet]

Part off their problem is they refrained from oil drilling and mining because of green propaganda

 

[Darkwind]

Interesting list.

The only reduction in governments spending is defense.

Typical, and it won't save them

They, like the USA, don't have an income problem. They have a spending problem.

 

[Delta4Embassy]

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/30/business/international/daily-stock-market-activity.html

PARIS — Global markets shuddered on Monday after Greece closed its banks amid fears that the country was headed toward default.

Stocks slumped modestly on Wall Street, after markets in Europe were buffeted by worries that the Greek debt crisis would prove contagious and Chinese investors endured another topsy-turvy session.

By early afternoon in New York, the Dow Jones industrial average was down 1.1 percent, the Standard & Poor’s 500 was down 1.4 percent, and the Nasdaq average had fallen 1.2 percent.

The Euro Stoxx 50 index, comprising the eurozone’s big blue chip companies, closed 4.2 percent lower, after being down about 5 percent at the opening. The FTSE 100 index in London fell 2 percent.

In Greece, banks and markets will be closed for the week, after Prime Minister Alexis Tsipras interrupted last-ditch debt negotiations early Saturday with the announcement that he was calling a referendum for July 5 on whether to accept the tough terms offered by international creditors.

Looks like Greece is going to default.

Though the terms are too extreme for its government to accept aka they are being forced to privatize everything and raise taxes with an ideological gun to their head: European Commission - PRESS RELEASES - Press release - Information from the European Commission on the latest draft proposals in the context of negotiations with Greece
View attachment 43445

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Again? What are they, the Mexico of 2015? Didn't we disconnect their financial computers from the rest of the world the last time?

As a somewhat related sidenote, anyone else think "Mr. Robot" was a really really bad idea?

 

[B. Kidd]

Interesting list.

The only reduction in governments spending is defense.

Typical, and it won't save them

They, like the USA, don't have an income problem. They have a spending problem.

Greece already paid back the IMF 17 billion. They only owe them 20 billion more.

 

[Darkwind]

Interesting list.

The only reduction in governments spending is defense.

Typical, and it won't save them

They, like the USA, don't have an income problem. They have a spending problem.

Greece already paid back the IMF 17 billion. They only owe them 20 billion more.

Which has what to do with what I said?

If Greece cut 30 or 40% of their budget, they'd get out of the red and into the black within a year, and in the green inside of three.

 

[hipeter924]

Greece is full of deadbeats.
Good thing we don't have many deadbeats here........

You haven't heard of the US National debt then.

Also Greece is where it is because it got poor advice.

The start of that bad advice was following the BS that if they accepted hundreds of billions in debt, they could get out of debt by following the condition of accepting said debt/bailout.

It is like this:
a) Guy goes into bank, as he needs money to keep his business afloat.
b) He is given an option by the bank, default on the loans and go bankrupt, or accept another loan.
c) So he accepts the loan, but the conditions are that he sells off part of his business, raises fees, and cuts wages.
d) He agrees, but things start to go wrong:
- His major competition bought up the other part of the business.
- The higher fees have made his business un-competitive.
- The lower wages have led to a low retaining rate, and the best staff have left.
e) His debt is increasing rather than decreasing, and he can't afford the loan repayments.
f) Bank gives him a deal, either sell off more of the company, raise fees and cut wages, or go into default and go bankrupt.

Sound familiar? Because that is basically what happened to Greece as a country.

 

[B. Kidd]

Greece is full of deadbeats.
Good thing we don't have many deadbeats here........

You haven't heard of the US National debt then.

Also Greece is where it is because it got poor advice.

The start of that bad advice was following the BS that if they accepted hundreds of billions in debt, they could get out of debt by following the condition of accepting said debt/bailout.

It is like this:
a) Guy goes into bank, as he needs money to keep his business afloat.
b) He is given an option by the bank, default on the loans and go bankrupt, or accept another loan.
c) So he accepts the loan, but the conditions are that he sells off part of his business, raises fees, and cuts wages.
d) He agrees, but things start to go wrong:
- His major competition bought up the other part of the business.
- The higher fees have made his business un-competitive.
- The lower wages have led to a low retaining rate, and the best staff have left.
e) His debt is increasing rather than decreasing, and he can't afford the loan repayments.
f) Bank gives him a deal, either sell off more of the company, raise fees and cut wages, or go into default and go bankrupt.

Sound familiar? Because that is basically what happened to Greece as a country.

Your sarcasm detector is not working today.

 

[hipeter924]

Greece is full of deadbeats.
Good thing we don't have many deadbeats here........

You haven't heard of the US National debt then.

Also Greece is where it is because it got poor advice.

The start of that bad advice was following the BS that if they accepted hundreds of billions in debt, they could get out of debt by following the condition of accepting said debt/bailout.

It is like this:
a) Guy goes into bank, as he needs money to keep his business afloat.
b) He is given an option by the bank, default on the loans and go bankrupt, or accept another loan.
c) So he accepts the loan, but the conditions are that he sells off part of his business, raises fees, and cuts wages.
d) He agrees, but things start to go wrong:
- His major competition bought up the other part of the business.
- The higher fees have made his business un-competitive.
- The lower wages have led to a low retaining rate, and the best staff have left.
e) His debt is increasing rather than decreasing, and he can't afford the loan repayments.
f) Bank gives him a deal, either sell off more of the company, raise fees and cut wages, or go into default and go bankrupt.

Sound familiar? Because that is basically what happened to Greece as a country.

Your sarcasm detector is not working today.

Okay, I am preaching to the choir then.

 

[hipeter924]

Interesting list.

The only reduction in governments spending is defense.

Typical, and it won't save them

They, like the USA, don't have an income problem. They have a spending problem.

Greece already paid back the IMF 17 billion. They only owe them 20 billion more.

Which has what to do with what I said?

If Greece cut 30 or 40% of their budget, they'd get out of the red and into the black within a year, and in the green inside of three.

That is what they have been doing since '09, and it didn't work.

 

[Silent Warrior]

It's a good thing they have those mean old bankers to blame. Otherwise they would have to address the failed political policies that actually caused the problems. They didn't get bad advice, they failed to follow good advice that they got. In hipeter94's scenario the business owner actually got good advice – file bankruptcy and close the company that you are incapable of running. But of course another loan would let him keep it open and pretend he knows what he is doing. Of course the bank is to blame for trying to protect their current loans to the business when they should have eaten an obvious loss. However, they are not to blame for the business's failure since it had already failed and they allowed it to hang on a little longer. The big loser in this example is the bank, not the incompetent business man who can probably file bankruptcy and walk away.

 

[HenryBHough]

Greece to Europe:

Try going Greek. Once you try it you'll never go back..........

 

[Manonthestreet]

It is, its called fraud....just like your housing market was built on...giving money to people who cant pay it back.....

 

[hipeter924]

It's a good thing they have those mean old bankers to blame. Otherwise they would have to address the failed political policies that actually caused the problems. They didn't get bad advice, they failed to follow good advice that they got. In hipeter94's scenario the business owner actually got good advice – file bankruptcy and close the company that you are incapable of running. But of course another loan would let him keep it open and pretend he knows what he is doing. Of course the bank is to blame for trying to protect their current loans to the business when they should have eaten an obvious loss. However, they are not to blame for the business's failure since it had already failed and they allowed it to hang on a little longer. The big loser in this example is the bank, not the incompetent business man who can probably file bankruptcy and walk away.

Yeah, about that: Stiglitz Greece s Creditors Have Criminal Responsibility

A few years ago, when Greece was still at the start of its slide into an economic depression, the Nobel prize-winning economist Joseph Stiglitz remembers discussing the crisis with Greek officials. What they wanted was a stimulus package to boost growth and create jobs, and Stiglitz, who had just produced an influential report for the United Nations on how to deal with the global financial crisis, agreed that this would be the best way forward. Instead, Greece’s foreign creditors imposed a strict program of austerity. The Greek economy has shrunk by about 25% since 2010. The cost-cutting was an enormous mistake, Stiglitz says, and it’s time for the creditors to admit it.

“They have criminal responsibility,” he says of the so-called troika of financial institutions that bailed out the Greek economy in 2010, namely the International Monetary Fund, the European Commission and the European Central Bank. “It’s a kind of criminal responsibility for causing a major recession,” Stiglitz tells TIME in a phone interview.

Along with a growing number of the world’s most influential economists, Stiglitz has begun to urge the troika to forgive Greece’s debt – estimated to be worth close to $300 billion in bailouts – and to offer the stimulus money that two successive Greek governments have been requesting.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

 

[hipeter924]

 

[Manonthestreet]

Not to mention Chinese market has been pretty close to freefall for couple of weeks