Goldman Sachs: Steel tariffs a likely prelude to NAFTA exit

[shockedcanadian]

Uh oh, looks like I won't be the only one screwed in Canada very soon...

Goldman Sachs: Steel tariffs a likely prelude to NAFTA exit

Investment firm Goldman Sachs said Friday that President Trump's decision to impose tariffs on steel and aluminum imports likely signals that the administration will eventually pull the U.S. out of the North American Free Trade Agreement.

Trump announced tariffs of 25 percent on steel imports and 10 percent on aluminum imports on Thursday, and justified them as a way to protect U.S. national security.

 

[william the wie]

Great minds are in synch. Check out my Tariffs thread. Canada and Mexico are the biggest steel exporters to the US and this move will hurt their economies bigly.

 

[shockedcanadian]

Great minds are in synch. Check out my Tariffs thread. Canada and Mexico are the biggest steel exporters to the US and this move will hurt their economies bigly.

I want the record to show, as early as 2007 I believe, I communicated with the Canadian government and told them that our centralized, socialist system was going to backfire, and I named multiple operatives I knew of who worked at IBM. They know who I am and they know what I know. Rather than changing or letting me go about my life, they crushed me. From Europe to America, hundreds of stakeholders now know specifics, specifics they wouldn't have known without abuses against my family and I.

This was going to happen one way or another, Trump is experienced and sharp and surrounded by people who know what they are talking about, they aren't going to be fooled. America is the Big Dog, they have options, a world of options.

Yes, Canada is going to get hammered. They will either give away the farm in NAFTA negotiations, or they will have the deal ripped up. All the scare tactics and fear mongering will go away once the economy continues to succeed and jobs come back.

I was a loyal soldier for a long time, and unfortunately I did my part and then some. Noone dares reign in our lying, abusive, self serving security apparatus at the RCMP and their provincial surrogates, so we get what we deserve, one way or another.

I've been threatened by Canadians, called a traitor, told I'm a POS for wishing people to lose their jobs. Not one of these fools questions the security apparatus tactics or the treatment that crushed my dreams illegally and without Due Process. I don't wish harm on regular Canadians, I want justice for those fools who lead us to this point.

 

[william the wie]

This policy is a twofer for Trump since it should help blue collar workers in blue states and cause some of the unions to endorse Republicans in the mid-terms. Steel on the left coast is much cheaper to bring in by the sea than over the rockies and those Tariffs are targeted at the left coast domestically. The cost of living will go up on the left coast the second the tariffs go into effect.

 

[task0778]

Great minds are in synch. Check out my Tariffs thread. Canada and Mexico are the biggest steel exporters to the US and this move will hurt their economies bigly.

Isn't going to do our economy any favors either. Why? Consider this:

As the R Street Institute think tank reminds us, "According to 2015 U.S. Census data, steel mills employ about 140,000 Americans, while steel-consuming industries, including automakers and other manufacturers who rely on imported steel, employ more than 5 million. It is estimated that nearly 200,000 jobs and $4 billion in wages were lost during the 18 months during 2002 and 2003 that President George W. Bush imposed tariffs on imported steel ..."

R Street disagrees with White House decision to levy tariffs on steel and aluminum imports | R Street

When you impose a tariff it is essentially a new tax on US consumers who will have to pay more for the products made by the taxed imports, in this case steel and aluminum. And then there's the cost of the coming retaliation, and make no mistake that the rest of the world isn't going to take it in the shorts and do nothing about it.

" Cato Institute Fellow Dan Ikenson, writing at Forbes, notes for instance that Europeans might "target citrus from Florida, tobacco from Kentucky, textiles from North Carolina, or dairy from Wisconsin in order to arouse strategic U.S. opposition to the steel and aluminum restrictions."

Beijing is already looking at imposing trade penalties on U.S. sales of sorghum there, and may soon also target our sales of soy, too. Meanwhile, India, emboldened by the U.S. turn toward protectionism, might use Trump's moves as a reason to protect its own wheat and rice sectors from U.S. imports. "

Sorry, Mr. President: Your Trade Protectionism Will Cost The U.S. Dearly | Stock News & Stock Market Analysis - IBD


It may be that the status quo is unfair for America as far as int'l trade is concerned. So, negotiate something better, whatever it might be. But this action by Trump is a bad move, the minuses considerably outweigh the pluses.

 

[william the wie]

That is a list of unproven assumptions

Mexican and Canadian subsidized steel will get 20% more subsidies so that the Mexican and Canadian governments don't go bye immediately and the US taxpayer won't see any problems until the Canadian and Mexican governments do go bye.

 

[bodecea]

I'm sure Mexico and Canada can find other eager customers. For their other products too.

 

[shockedcanadian]

I'm sure Mexico and Canada can find other eager customers. For their other products too.

Yes, as with our oil, we will get .20 on the dollar selling to some shytehole country.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

I'm sure Mexico and Canada can find other eager customers. For their other products too.

Why haven't they found those other eager customers already?

 

[task0778]

That is a list of unproven assumptions

Mexican and Canadian subsidized steel will get 20% more subsidies so that the Mexican and Canadian governments don't go bye immediately and the US taxpayer won't see any problems until the Canadian and Mexican governments do go bye.

Not much impact from these and other tariffs on US taxpayers, but there will be on US consumers. It's hard to argue with the FACT that when you impose a tariff on something you are actually adding the cost of the tariff onto the price. Which the consumer pays or doesn't buy the product at all. We all will be paying more for anything that requires steel or aluminum in the final product. Some say that impact will be minimal, others disagree. Some say the impact on jobs in the steel and aluminum consuming industries will outweigh any jobs gained in the steel and aluminum creating industries, since their numbers are vastly greater; so it's kinda silly to say that the US is creating more jobs when overall the opposite is true. And it's hard to argue with history, as my post #5 above shows.

And then there's the cost of the pushback, inevitably other countries will retaliate and then what? What'll the cost of that be?

 

[william the wie]

I was about to reference one of my posts on a separate thread but the short answer is effectively all steel and aluminum non-US companies with existing sites in the US worldwide are tooling up their US let the states bid for my plants and equipment to expand their US investment. They also went through the roof on the overseas markets. So, as long as you are not in one of the winning bid areas you will get lower cost aluminum and steel at no cost to you. Living in FL I am assured no one will bid to get something that will cut down on tourism or agricultural revenues.