Debate Now God’s biblical instructions on the does & don’ts

Discussion in 'Debate Now - Structured Discussion Forum' started by watchingfromafar, Jan 8, 2018.

  1. watchingfromafar
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    watchingfromafar VIP Member

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    I believe the verses used are basically the same in all the various versions of the Holy bible.
    But I did not post this as a definitive thing. I am sure I got some of it wrong and it is for this reason I posted it here.
    If you have any suggestions on the content, bad or good or additions I should add; please say so

    you can even curse at me if it makes you feel better :)-
     
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  2. watchingfromafar
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    watchingfromafar VIP Member

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    Are you saying that there are more demands from God to them that they also failed to follow?

    If so, list them & I will in turn include them
    :)-
     
  3. Indeependent
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    Indeependent Platinum Member Gold Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    Well, here's where I either educate you, as is my intent, or I crush you and you start pulling your lack of knowledge of The Prophets out your well trained, cherry picked Christian verses.

    The Jews during the 1st and 2nd Temples, and afterwards, scrupulously adhered to all 613 Demands and 55,000 details.
    What the Prophets explicitly told them to correct was their attitude, and this is, indeed, also laid out in The Torah.
    You would, of course, know this if you actually read, let's say, Isaiah or Jeremiah or Malachi or the many other Prophets.

    What you also weren't told in Sunday School was that the destruction of each Temple was foretold by The Prophets, including Isaiah or Jeremiah, almost 200 years before the actual destruction.
    Why?
    Because, unlike Jesus, God is not an asshole.
    In fact, not only were the Jews told to have a good attitude they were also told that at the End Of Days, God would take them back so that they could adhere to The Demands for Eternity.
    Yes, I know full well that your teachers never read these verses with you because that would fuck up the entire Jesus thing.
     
  4. Picaro
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    Picaro Gold Member

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    Rubbish. Not surprising, since most don't have any idea what 'Protestantism' is, but think they do. Since he's fond of Mathew 25, I would guess he/she is an evangelical 'Free Will and Free Church' type, much closer to the beliefs common to the evangelicals of the First Great Awakening, and Benjamin Franklin and his more conservative lifelong friends George Whitefield and Baptists close to him, 'Word Of Faith' types who steer away from denominationalism while still respecting some aspects of of the Congregationalists and the obligation to do good works and social activism through their churches. Which of course is a good thing for their communities and the country. I'm probably not 100% right but probably close enough.

    As for the pro-Palestinian slant of the site, that of course is just crazy. Just because much of the history of the religion is indeed about Jews Behaving Badly, this doesn't automatically 'everybody else' is right or means they deserve to be genocided,; it certainly doesn't make Islamists right about anything or validates their cult.
     
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    Last edited: Jan 28, 2018
  5. watchingfromafar
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    watchingfromafar VIP Member

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    I believe you are misunderstanding scripture. God forbids the murder of another so clearly the idea of genocide is out of the question. There is a verse that says thy shall be no more remembered but I believe this does not mean wiped out, it just means forgotten.

    Islam is a religion, not a cult. Its members are diverse composed of all the various ethnic groups on this planet.
    Judaism is singular whereas its members are from one blood line. They see themselves as separate from all others, even superior in many ways.
    At least this is how I see it; please correct me if I am wrong.

    On a side note, I have a confession to make. I am not a religious person. I do not go to a church and yet out of the blue, for no rime or reason I find myself caught up in the religious thing.

    Please, Picaro, tell me why?
     
  6. Picaro
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    Picaro Gold Member

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    I don't know how your point applies to mine; in any case, going to war is very much a part of the survival of Jewish tribes in their early history. Some think that their own history of bad behavior is some sort of justification for antisemitism and the like; I don't, nor do I consider Jewish bigotry and hate toward Christians remotely justifiable, either. Principles apply in both directions.

    In that vein, Palestinians and the Islamist states surrounding Israel have no valid complaints or beefs with the state of Israel, and certainly no moral grounds to be attempting to genocide them out of existence, which of course is their openly and constantly repeated goal.

    Nope, it's a cult, and a violent murderous one to boot. It has no theology, just a rip off of surrounding cultures' tenets, grossly distorted to appeal to the gangs of bandits and murdering thieves Mohammed wanted to recruit for raiding everybody in the region and beyond.

    Nope, it was a highly racist and ethnocentric theology, for sure, and its Orthodox followers most certainly fit that description to this day, for the most part; there are some Rabbis I respect, despite that, and have no problem with those who are open about it, just those who try and subvert our own culture and wreck it. Not all of them do. They are free to be as racist as insular as they please in every other respect. Nobody has to like anybody else.

    This Rabbi I respect,and this is one of the best interviews of an Orthodox Rabbi and his particular outlook I know of in English; it will clarify some Jewish views for some:

    Judaism, Culture and the Gentile World: A Conversation with Rabbi Mayer Schiller

    He doesn't seem to think much of faux 'liberal' Jews, and neither do I, for the same reasons I despise pretty much all Christian bashing garbage. Most conservative Jews are patriotic and serve the U.S. just fine, and don't devote themselves to wiping out christian influences and rights in the U.S. And keep in mind the vast majority of modern Jews are not Orthodox, so the former points are not nearly as big a deal as some would think. It's more of a cultural thing than a religious one for over 80% of them, even in Israel.

    Don't know why; I'm an agnostic myself; I have, however, studied history extensively, and the vast majority of the Christian hate and distorted lying is entirely unjustified. It's been a great boon to the West, while all the other alleged 'Great Religions' are proven dead ends and not really 'religions' in the case of Islam.

    Maybe a reading of Hegel's views on Christianity, as well as F.A. Hayek's observations about it in some of his articles and books would be helpful to you, if you can ignore the pseudo-intellectual peer group pressure and fashion victim rubbish long enough to look around a little.

    Neither the Old Testament nor the New Testament were written by idiots, they were very intelligent people who knew a lot about literary devices like allegory and anthropomorphism and logic and human nature and psychology, and the chiastic structures linking it all together behind the scenes is an intellectual marvel in and of itself. You can also forget the silly 'moral relativism' and 'moral equivalency' nonsense popular with those trying to destroy its influences; if you need a nice book on how they go about that read Antonio Gramsci's guidelines and learn to look for them in the criticisms used, most of which originate with Communists and right wing sociopaths as well. Neurotic sexual deviants and fetishists are another main group of bashers with agendas; they're as bad or worse ans any psychopath.

    Don't be misled by the massive amounts of Catholic bashing rubbish out there, either; most of it is a load of baseless crap put out by Protestants during and after the Reformation, and the same goes for morons babbling idiotic nonsense about 'The Inquisition', ' The Crusades', witch-burnings, etc., either. If they were even half true Europe would have a population of around 5: a Chinese tourist kiosk and three Japanese tourists. They're mostly ridiculous hyperbole.
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2018
  7. watchingfromafar
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    watchingfromafar VIP Member

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    You cannot justify one hideous act by pointing out another as a excuse. When an IDF sharpshooter picks out a child sitting at her desk in a school and shots her in the head; this is a war crime. When they repeatedly do this to dozens of children it comes close to genocide. What do you think the father would do as a response? I know what I would do.

    There was no "Israel" prior to 1947ad. It is the Israelis who are the invaders and these invaders will be driven out sooner or later but in the end they will goooo.

    All they have to do is wait it out. The population of Israeli's is flat or shrinking but growing it is not.

    Islam is not a cult.

    Zionism
    is-------
    a movement for (originally) the re-establishment and (now) the development and protection of a Jewish nation in what is now Israel. It was established as a political organization in 1897 under Theodor Herzl, and was later led by Chaim Weizmann.

    Again, there was never a place called "Israel" prior to 1947.

    (Gen 41:39 KJV) And Pharaoh said unto Joseph, Forasmuch as God hath showed thee all this, there is none so discreet and wise as thou art:

    (Gen 41:40 KJV) Thou shalt be over my house, and according unto thy word shall all my people be ruled: only in the throne will I be greater than thou.

    (Gen 41:42 KJV) And Pharaoh took off his ring from his hand, and put it upon Joseph's hand, and arrayed him in vestures of fine linen, and put a gold chain about his neck;

    Joseph who is now the de facto ruler over all of Egypt saves the Israelite's who are experiencing a great famine and moves them to Egypt and gives them power over all the agriculture lands. Clearly they were not slaves as some would have believed.

    (Gen 42:1 KJV) Now when Jacob saw that there was corn in Egypt, Jacob said unto his sons, why do ye look one upon another?

    (Gen 42:2 KJV) And he said, Behold, I have heard that there is corn in Egypt: get you down thither, and buy for us from thence;

    (Gen 42:5 KJV) And the sons of Israel came to buy corn among those that came: for the famine was in the land of Canaan.

    (Gen 42:25 KJV) Then Joseph commanded to fill their sacks with corn, and to restore every man's money into his sack, and to give them provision for the way:

    (Gen 45:20 KJV) Also regard not your stuff; for the good of all the land of Egypt is yours.

    See above, they abandon the land of Canaan and move to Egypt

    (Gen 45:21 KJV) And the children of Israel did so: and Joseph gave them wagons, according to the commandment of Pharaoh, and gave them provision for the way.

    (Gen 47:1 KJV) Then Joseph came and told Pharaoh, and said, My father [ISRAEL] and my brethren, and their flocks, and their herds, and all that they have, are come out of the land of Canaan; and, behold, they are in the land of Goshen.

    (Gen 47:3 KJV) And Pharaoh said unto his brethren, What is your occupation? And they said unto Pharaoh, Thy servants are shepherds, both we, and also our fathers.

    (Gen 47:5 KJV) And Pharaoh spake unto Joseph, saying, Thy father [ISRAEL] and thy brethren are come unto thee:

    (Gen 47:6 KJV) The land of Egypt is before thee; in the best of the land make thy father and brethren to dwell; in the land of Goshen let them dwell: and if thou knowest any men of activity among them, then make them rulers over my cattle.

    (Gen 47:11 KJV) And Joseph placed his father [ISRAEL] and his brethren, and gave them a possession in the land of Egypt, in the best of the land, in the land of Rameses, as Pharaoh had commanded.

    A Jewish leader (Joseph) ruled over Egypt, he and his fellow Jews for over 300 years.
     
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  8. Picaro
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    Picaro Gold Member

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    Ah, so you're just another antisemitic nut job; not being familiar with you as a poster is the only reason I was taking you seriously. No need to do so any more. lol
     
  9. watchingfromafar
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    watchingfromafar VIP Member

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    "antisemitic nut job"

    Is that all you have to say or contribute?

    I posted a long line of Biblical verses hoping for an adult's candid response and all I got in return is a three year old crying because the poor baby spilt his milk all over his gram crackers, making them gooie mushies.

    lesion learned, don't post and eat crackers at the same time.
    just a suggestion :)-
     
  10. watchingfromafar
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    watchingfromafar VIP Member

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    Picaro--------
    You cannot justify one hideous act by pointing out another as a excuse. When an IDF sharpshooter picks out a child sitting at her desk in a school and shots her in the head; this is a war crime. When they repeatedly do this to dozens of children it comes close to genocide. What do you think the father would do as a response? I know what I would do.

    No wait, my mistake; Picaro can justify anything cause he be da man
     

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