God as an engineer

onecut39

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Dec 3, 2008
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God as an engineer.

Here we sit on this chaotic orb spinning through space and going nowhere. Around us we see incredible variations and strange adaptations in the natural world.

It resembles nothing so much as chaos. Engineering teaches us that the best solution is simple, eloquent if you will. The earth shows no such simplicity and elegance of design.

But let us just take man. To many He is god’s crowning achievement, the apex of all the life forms on earth. Is it possible that this is a created being that was created by an all powerful omniscient god? Could we be the work of a superior, but ungodlike engineer? To put is simply. Could this flatulating, sweating, urinating defecating foul breathed creature be the result of, if not godlike intelligence, at least some sort of intelligence?

The above surely implies that we are not the apex of the perfect machine. The effects of the operating system, if not the system itself, leaves a lot to be desired. If today someone applied for a patent on the human body it would surely be denied solely due to the amount of pollution it creates.

Let us go on the mechanics of the operation.

We walk upright. This is an inherently unstable position making us top heavy and the simple act of keeping us upright requires a lot of computing power that would better be used for something else.

While we have two hands, arms legs etc. one of each pair is inferior. The whole idea of “handedness” reeks of engineering stupidity or incompetence. There appears to be no reason for this except for the hated idea of imperfect evolution and chance.

What engineer would produce a machine that is required to be shut down, useless, for a full third of it’s existence?

What engineer would produce a machine that is so easily damaged with parts that cannot be replaced?

Why are we placed at the mercy of so many of earth’s inhabitants, from the smallest virus to the largest predators? Whatever success we have had against both has had less to do with the original design and more to do with getting around that design.

Then there is the whole drama of reproduction. What on earth were they thinking? A reproductive system that is not only disruptive to our lives but actually endangers us, females in particular.

And lastly the final indignity, we cannot even breed true. The system of reproduction allows errors, many many errors, in the form of birth defects (millions of them) and mutations that are overwhelmingly to our detriment rather than to our advantage. For good or bad, and they are mostly bad, they are random; nothing planned about it. We are left depending on the roll of the dice.

Sound like engineering, even bad engineering, to you? If this is the best God can do then the phrase “God help us” is as futile as it is false
 
Well, so much for that idea. I though it would at least spur a couple of responses.
 
Its a mystery! You just have to have faith!
Or, maybe someone has misinterpreted the universe.
Or, maybe a lot of someones!
Don't let the term 'god' get to you.
 
It's strange, but all I see is perfection. Remember that Eden was God's plan. He gave us control over all other creatures. Women had one period a year. Birth was painless. Proper food plentiful, a firmemment to filter light. No thorns on the roses there.
Sweat keeps our structure cool, burp to remove excess gas. A method to remove waste. We spin without getting dizzy, we tilt for a reason. And because God understood gravity before Sir Issac figured it out, our moon is exactly where we needed it to be. I would have probably placed it a little farther to the west, and all sea live would have died. I'd plug up the offensive butthole and in a few weeks there would be exploding humans everywhere. Holy shit!

If there is chaos here it is because we produced it. Heaven is still non-chaotic, and earth will return to that status.
Cosmos means order, and the more we explore God's space, the more we realize that there is a design.
If we think we can do better, I am reminded of what God said to Job, "and where were you when I was creating the universe?"
If we see flaw in God's work it is because of our lack of understanding, not his.
 
A God we could encompass with our understanding could not exist.
If God exists, we and everything are an expression of and, thus, one with the creator.

If God does not exist, we have nothing to do about it.

Perfection and imperfection are creations of humans and their perceptual apparatus. Chaos is a term we created for something we believe we observe, like good and bad, up and down, etc.

If you want to know more about what life and the universe really are, forget what you've learned it is.
 
It's strange, but all I see is perfection. Remember that Eden was God's plan. He gave us control over all other creatures. Women had one period a year. Birth was painless. Proper food plentiful, a firmemment to filter light. No thorns on the roses there.
Sweat keeps our structure cool, burp to remove excess gas. A method to remove waste. We spin without getting dizzy, we tilt for a reason. And because God understood gravity before Sir Issac figured it out, our moon is exactly where we needed it to be. I would have probably placed it a little farther to the west, and all sea live would have died. I'd plug up the offensive butthole and in a few weeks there would be exploding humans everywhere. Holy shit!

If there is chaos here it is because we produced it. Heaven is still non-chaotic, and earth will return to that status.
Cosmos means order, and the more we explore God's space, the more we realize that there is a design.
If we think we can do better, I am reminded of what God said to Job, "and where were you when I was creating the universe?"
If we see flaw in God's work it is because of our lack of understanding, not his.

Got it! White is black up is down, inefficiency is efficient, chaos is order. Farting sweating crapping humanity is the best God could do.

Why didn't I think of that?
 
Just the fact that god put the valley of fun next to a sewer proves he wasn't much of an engineer.
 
What would you have done differently? Maybe we could shit out of one ear.........[/QUOTE

I ask you to defend only a couple of things.

1. "handedness" Why would god not make all appendages of equal ability?

2. Sleep. Why on earth would God demand his super creation spend a third of it's existence in a worthless coma?

3. Birth defects. Why would not god design an error free system of reproduction, especially when the overwhelming majority of these errors are detrimental?

Just address the above. Forget about the stinking polluting operating system.
 
1. Because they have seperate specific functions. Why didn't God give us better eye sight than an eagle? Or the speed of a Jaguar? They have all they need to survive, and so do we. And this design is very temporary. In the next phase we are not limited to earthly dimensions. While we are still trying our best to find out if there are more than 3 or 4 or 10 dimensions, the Bible already made it quite clear that there are at least 6. It's white whether we have discovered it to be white yet or not. God created the order in the universe. NASA acknowledged it.

2. Why eat? Why put gas in a car? Our earthy bodies require it. We rest. Horses rest. Orchids rest.
Once we shed our earthly bodies, neither fuel nor rest will be necessary, but both can be enjoyed if we care to.

3. Because there is much to be learned from the "imperfect". What do you consider perfect? Is it the same as what I consider perfect? My daughter babysat for a down syndrome child. He taught her joy for no reason, because that is what he had. Who is the loser there, the imperfect child? His parents? His babysitter? See, that child IS perfect in God's eyes. He sees that child's heart. We see his slanted eyes or his awkward gate.

We no longer live in Eden, where everything you seem to expect of God could be found. (Our fault, because nobody's perfect.)
He will restore us to perfection. (God's grace, because nobody's perfect.)
You expect a great deal from God. What have you done for him lately?
 
1. Because they have seperate specific functions. Why didn't God give us better eye sight than an eagle? Or the speed of a Jaguar? They have all they need to survive, and so do we. And this design is very temporary. In the next phase we are not limited to earthly dimensions. While we are still trying our best to find out if there are more than 3 or 4 or 10 dimensions, the Bible already made it quite clear that there are at least 6. It's white whether we have discovered it to be white yet or not. God created the order in the universe. NASA acknowledged it.

2. Why eat? Why put gas in a car? Our earthy bodies require it. We rest. Horses rest. Orchids rest.
Once we shed our earthly bodies, neither fuel nor rest will be necessary, but both can be enjoyed if we care to.

3. Because there is much to be learned from the "imperfect". What do you consider perfect? Is it the same as what I consider perfect? My daughter babysat for a down syndrome child. He taught her joy for no reason, because that is what he had. Who is the loser there, the imperfect child? His parents? His babysitter? See, that child IS perfect in God's eyes. He sees that child's heart. We see his slanted eyes or his awkward gate.

We no longer live in Eden, where everything you seem to expect of God could be found. (Our fault, because nobody's perfect.)
He will restore us to perfection. (God's grace, because nobody's perfect.)
You expect a great deal from God. What have you done for him lately?

First I expect nothing from God and I have never been disappointed

In your answer I see a lot of world class question dodging. Are you a politician? Excuses for imperfection. Answer the question with a question. Shift the premise.

Not a word in answer to the specific questions.

I would be a lot more impressed if you just plead ignorance.
 
That's too bad, because He expects a lot from you. To whom much is given, much is expected.
What question do you think I dodged?
appendages have different functions and happily are not all alike.
We sleep because our bodies need rest
God decides what is perfect in his eyes. We are not qualified to determine what is perfect and what is not.
What did I miss?
 
That's too bad, because He expects a lot from you. To whom much is given, much is expected.
What question do you think I dodged?
appendages have different functions and happily are not all alike.
We sleep because our bodies need rest
God decides what is perfect in his eyes. We are not qualified to determine what is perfect and what is not.
What did I miss?

Just everything. You have this inefficient sweaty, smelly, polluting body that is required to be inactive for a third of its life. Your appendages are not equal in ability, and your reproductive system is inefficient painful and untrustworthy.

But all of that is gods will. God may be a klutz but by god your stickin with him and your entire postings have simply been making excuses for His lack of engineering ability.

Then you top it all off by asserting we are not able to ascertain these obvious deficiencies.

I will conclude my participation in this thread with the only word that fully conveys my appreciation of your reasoning

DUH?
 
Try participating in understanding.
There was no pain in childbirth in Eden, before we ran amok.
This appendage thing you are stuck on? Try walking around on your hands all day and then tell us why feet are better suited for the job. Then type me a note on your keyboard with your toes and then come back and tell us how much better suited fingers are for the job.
Don't like God's gift of rest? Then stay awake! Let us know if you were right and God was wrong.
Continue to question God's capability, and then come back and show us YOUR design for the "perfect" specimen of man.
In fact, unveil your design right here so we can rid ourselves of this imperfect God, and follow you.
 
Try participating in understanding.
There was no pain in childbirth in Eden, before we ran amok.
This appendage thing you are stuck on? Try walking around on your hands all day and then tell us why feet are better suited for the job. Then type me a note on your keyboard with your toes and then come back and tell us how much better suited fingers are for the job.
Don't like God's gift of rest? Then stay awake! Let us know if you were right and God was wrong.
Continue to question God's capability, and then come back and show us YOUR design for the "perfect" specimen of man.
In fact, unveil your design right here so we can rid ourselves of this imperfect God, and follow you.

Double DUH!
 
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just a little brevity...
 

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