“My client didn’t do it. But even if my client did it, it isn’t a crime." - Rudy Giuliani, to FoxNews
Russian transaction?
Trump's lawyer/spokesman Rudolph W. Giuliani appeared on Fox News's and CNN's morning shows on Monday to downplay the idea that colluding with the Russians would have even been illegal and to argue against strawmen.
The most notable portion of the interviews was when Giuliani rekindled the idea that collusion isn't even a crime. Trump's defenders have occasionally noted that the word doesn't appear in the criminal code — which is true but misleading-- but Giuliani took it a step further: He basically suggested Trump would have had to pay for Russia to interfere on his behalf.
“I don't even know if that's a crime — colluding with Russians,” Giuliani said on CNN. “Hacking is the crime. The president didn't hack. He didn't pay for the hacking.”
GIULIANI argues ***collusion is not a crime***: "I don't even know if that's a crime -- colluding with Russians. Hacking is the crime. The president didn't hack! He didn't pay for the hacking." pic.twitter.com/QMenE1qzxx
— Aaron Rupar (@atrupar) July 30, 2018
He added on Fox: “I have been sitting here looking in the federal code trying to find collusion as a crime. Collusion is not a crime.”
In case you forgot, Trump himself has been arguing for more than a year not that collusion wasn't a crime, but that there simply was “no collusion.” Just like Trump's legal team has taken to arguing that a president can't legally be guilty of obstructing justice, it's now arguing that the other side of the investigation that has to do with Trump — the collusion side — is also a bogus standard. Or at least that seems to be where this is headed.
Giuliani also seemed to offer a very narrow denial of what happened with the Trump Tower meeting. While discussing Michael Cohen's allegation that Trump knew about the meeting, Giuliani focused his defense on arguing not necessarily that Trump didn't know about it — but that he wasn't physically at meetings at which information from Russians was discussed. And he did it on both shows.
“Even this Russia meeting -- I'm happy to tell [Robert Mueller] he wasn't there; he wasn't at the meeting,” Giuliani said while arguing that Mueller doesn't need to interview Trump.
GIULIANI: I'm happy to tell Mueller that Trump wasn't at the Trump Tower meeting.
CNN: How do you know he wasn't there?
GIULIANI: Because Cohen is a liar and Don Jr. says he wasn't there.
CNN: Don't they have a self-interest in saying that?
GIULIANI: Well, so does Cohen. pic.twitter.com/jBZSl9I1qm
— Aaron Rupar (@atrupar) July 30, 2018
Russian transaction?
Trump's lawyer/spokesman Rudolph W. Giuliani appeared on Fox News's and CNN's morning shows on Monday to downplay the idea that colluding with the Russians would have even been illegal and to argue against strawmen.
The most notable portion of the interviews was when Giuliani rekindled the idea that collusion isn't even a crime. Trump's defenders have occasionally noted that the word doesn't appear in the criminal code — which is true but misleading-- but Giuliani took it a step further: He basically suggested Trump would have had to pay for Russia to interfere on his behalf.
“I don't even know if that's a crime — colluding with Russians,” Giuliani said on CNN. “Hacking is the crime. The president didn't hack. He didn't pay for the hacking.”
GIULIANI argues ***collusion is not a crime***: "I don't even know if that's a crime -- colluding with Russians. Hacking is the crime. The president didn't hack! He didn't pay for the hacking." pic.twitter.com/QMenE1qzxx
— Aaron Rupar (@atrupar) July 30, 2018
He added on Fox: “I have been sitting here looking in the federal code trying to find collusion as a crime. Collusion is not a crime.”
In case you forgot, Trump himself has been arguing for more than a year not that collusion wasn't a crime, but that there simply was “no collusion.” Just like Trump's legal team has taken to arguing that a president can't legally be guilty of obstructing justice, it's now arguing that the other side of the investigation that has to do with Trump — the collusion side — is also a bogus standard. Or at least that seems to be where this is headed.
Giuliani also seemed to offer a very narrow denial of what happened with the Trump Tower meeting. While discussing Michael Cohen's allegation that Trump knew about the meeting, Giuliani focused his defense on arguing not necessarily that Trump didn't know about it — but that he wasn't physically at meetings at which information from Russians was discussed. And he did it on both shows.
“Even this Russia meeting -- I'm happy to tell [Robert Mueller] he wasn't there; he wasn't at the meeting,” Giuliani said while arguing that Mueller doesn't need to interview Trump.
GIULIANI: I'm happy to tell Mueller that Trump wasn't at the Trump Tower meeting.
CNN: How do you know he wasn't there?
GIULIANI: Because Cohen is a liar and Don Jr. says he wasn't there.
CNN: Don't they have a self-interest in saying that?
GIULIANI: Well, so does Cohen. pic.twitter.com/jBZSl9I1qm
— Aaron Rupar (@atrupar) July 30, 2018
