George Bush Makes Me Sick

[Max Power]

Bush Forgives Sandy Berger?

If President Bush is upset that former national security advisor Sandy Berger destroyed top secret terrorism documents in a bid to obstruct the 9/11 Commission investigation, he sure has a strange way of showing it.



In June, two months after Berger pled guilty to what some say is the most serious crime ever committed by a senior White House official - Bush invited him to the White House, where, according to the Associated Press, the disgraced former Clinton advisor was trotted out to voice support for CAFTA legislation.


Yesterday D.C. Magistrate Judge Deborah Robinson rejected a plea worked out for Berger by the Bush Justice Department, saying the $10,000 fine and 3-year security suspension arranged by Public Integrity Section chief Noel Hillman was way too lenient.

Robinson quintupled the fine and sentenced Berger to 100 hours of community service, saying that Hillman's recommendation didn't "sufficiently reflect the seriousness of the offense."

President Bush, however, apparently didn't agree. Two months after Mr. Hillman filed the ridiculously light plea bargain, Bush rewarded him with an appointment to the federal bench.

Good thing Judge Robinson's sentence left Mr. Berger's security suspension in place. Otherwise he might be on the short list for FEMA director.

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2005/9/9/132244.shtml

 

[insein]

That is bullshit. Berger should be doing 10 to 20 right now for his security breach. Sometimes Bush thinks too politically when dealing with Clinton people.

 

[ProudDem]

Bush makes me sick, too, but I think for different reasons than you state.

I have no idea what the hell Berger was doing in taking those documents. Do you think he was worried that there was some intelligence that would hurt Clinton, or himself?

 

[Avatar4321]

I have no idea what the hell Berger was doing in taking those documents. Do you think he was worried that there was some intelligence that would hurt Clinton, or himself?

duh... Fact is, if the Clinton administration did its job, 911 probably wouldn't have happened.

 

[Max Power]

This convinces me of two things.

1. Partisan politics is bullshit. Republicans and Democrats are essentially the same, and just play up a few minute differences (gay marriage, for example) so that you think you have a choice on election day.

2. What Sandy Berger did is worse than what Karl Rove (allegedly) did, and Berger is getting a pass from this Republican administration - that means that Karl Rove will take absolutely no heat for what he did.

 

[ProudDem]

duh... Fact is, if the Clinton administration did its job, 911 probably wouldn't have happened.

Yeah, let's blame Clinton on 9-11. Would you agree with me that several days before 9-11, Bush received a memo entitled (or something to this effect), "bin Laden determined to attack in United States." I'm not saying that Bush should be blamed, but he isn't blameless.

Right after he became president, in January 2001, he was talking about invading Iraq. He was upset when 9-11 occurred because it took his eye off the ball. Notice that Iraq somehow became connected to 9-11.

Bush is scum, and I am reveling in the fact that his approval ratings have tanked.

 

[Avatar4321]

2. What Sandy Berger did is worse than what Karl Rove (allegedly) did, and Berger is getting a pass from this Republican administration - that means that Karl Rove will take absolutely no heat for what he did.

And what the heck did Rove allegedly do this time?

 

[Avatar4321]

Yeah, let's blame Clinton on 9-11. Would you agree with me that several days before 9-11, Bush received a memo entitled (or something to this effect), "bin Laden determined to attack in United States." I'm not saying that Bush should be blamed, but he isn't blameless.

Right after he became president, in January 2001, he was talking about invading Iraq. He was upset when 9-11 occurred because it took his eye off the ball. Notice that Iraq somehow became connected to 9-11.

Bush is scum, and I am reveling in the fact that his approval ratings have tanked.

Mr. ProudDem, what you’ve just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

 

[ProudDem]

Mr. ProudDem, what you’ve just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

You're entitled to your opinion. And I am a woman, by the way. Buh-bye.

 

[Gem]

ProudDem,

Oh please tell me you are smarter than that? Please tell me that you are an intelligent ProudDem...not a talkingpoints spewing automaton who hasn't ever really looked into the crap they put out?!?! I know its harsh, ProudDem...but from your other posts its obvious you have a brain...have you just chosen not to use it for this particular issue?

The Memo was given to Bush in the beginning of August...its title was "Bin Laden Determined to Strike in US." In it...Bush would have learned that Bin Laden wanted to harm the US for a variety of reasons (SHOCKER!) and that the millenium attack that was foiled might have been part of that plan.

It stated that he may have planned to hijack a plane (OH MY GOD BUSH SHOULD HAVE KNOWN RIGHT THEN!!!!) in order to HAVE ONE OF HIS MEN RELEASED FROM PRISON (oops...nevermind...not the same thing at all really, is it, afterall...lots of people have hijacked planes for that reason...they never flew three of them into buildings before, did they?)

It stated that there has been some suspicious activity in New York (OH GOD THERE IT IS...BUSH THE BASTARD KNEW IT WAS NEW YORK!!!)...around FEDERAL BUILDINGS...(oh, damn...wait...if Bush had put the entire US Millitary around every single Federal Building in NYC it wouldn't have made one damn bit of difference...shucks...)

All the memo stated was that a bad man we already knew about (and could have captured at least twice during the Clinton administration), wanted to hurt us which we already knew about. It was not a smoking gun, it was not a damning piece of evidence proving Bush's incompetance...it was really nothing other than a sad example of how US Bueracracy is harming this nation...Clinton could have taken bin Laden out...but he didn't, because he was afraid that he would get in trouble with the UN and the Congress...and in one case, because he was busy golfing. Bush didn't do anything about it because Clinton didn't do anything about it and he was happy to be complacent, and because we didn't have enough intelligence because of Jamie Gorelick's intelligence wall and because of a lack of Arab speaking interpreters and because of a million other reasons that had nothing to do with this memo.

Please...I know I am harsh at the start of this post...but it really is because we need HONEST, INTELLIGENT, and above all, INFORMED conversation and debate about topics...screeching about the memo that really didn't say anything we hadn't known about for years and has NOTHING to do with a rational debate about 9/11...and to put if forward as something you hold against Bush puts you one step closer to that insane, rabid blame Bush crowd that you should be.

 

[ProudDem]

ProudDem,

Oh please tell me you are smarter than that? Please tell me that you are an intelligent ProudDem...not a talkingpoints spewing automaton who hasn't ever really looked into the crap they put out?!?! I know its harsh, ProudDem...but from your other posts its obvious you have a brain...have you just chosen not to use it for this particular issue?

The Memo was given to Bush in the beginning of August...its title was "Bin Laden Determined to Strike in US." In it...Bush would have learned that Bin Laden wanted to harm the US for a variety of reasons (SHOCKER!) and that the millenium attack that was foiled might have been part of that plan.

It stated that he may have planned to hijack a plane (OH MY GOD BUSH SHOULD HAVE KNOWN RIGHT THEN!!!!) in order to HAVE ONE OF HIS MEN RELEASED FROM PRISON (oops...nevermind...not the same thing at all really, is it, afterall...lots of people have hijacked planes for that reason...they never flew three of them into buildings before, did they?)

It stated that there has been some suspicious activity in New York (OH GOD THERE IT IS...BUSH THE BASTARD KNEW IT WAS NEW YORK!!!)...around FEDERAL BUILDINGS...(oh, damn...wait...if Bush had put the entire US Millitary around every single Federal Building in NYC it wouldn't have made one damn bit of difference...shucks...)

All the memo stated was that a bad man we already knew about (and could have captured at least twice during the Clinton administration), wanted to hurt us which we already knew about. It was not a smoking gun, it was not a damning piece of evidence proving Bush's incompetance...it was really nothing other than a sad example of how US Bueracracy is harming this nation...Clinton could have taken bin Laden out...but he didn't, because he was afraid that he would get in trouble with the UN and the Congress...and in one case, because he was busy golfing. Bush didn't do anything about it because Clinton didn't do anything about it and he was happy to be complacent, and because we didn't have enough intelligence because of Jamie Gorelick's intelligence wall and because of a lack of Arab speaking interpreters and because of a million other reasons that had nothing to do with this memo.

Please...I know I am harsh at the start of this post...but it really is because we need HONEST, INTELLIGENT, and above all, INFORMED conversation and debate about topics...screeching about the memo that really didn't say anything we hadn't known about for years and has NOTHING to do with a rational debate about 9/11...and to put if forward as something you hold against Bush puts you one step closer to that insane, rabid blame Bush crowd that you should be.

I gotta head out, Gem, so I'll try to get to this soon (it may not be today). All I said was that Bush was not blameless. I didn't say that the memo was the smoking gun, and I didn't say he was to blame for 9-11--my word was that he was NOT BLAMELESS. If that assessment makes me dumb, so be it.

 

[Max Power]

And what the heck did Rove allegedly do this time?

The whole Valerie Plame thing.

Assuming that Rove did do it, it's not as bad as what Berger did, and Berger got a pass, so Rove will definately get off scot free.

 

[Max Power]

It stated that he may have planned to hijack a plane (OH MY GOD BUSH SHOULD HAVE KNOWN RIGHT THEN!!!!) in order to HAVE ONE OF HIS MEN RELEASED FROM PRISON (oops...nevermind...not the same thing at all really, is it, afterall...lots of people have hijacked planes for that reason...they never flew three of them into buildings before, did they?)

Actually, it said that US intelligence was unable to corroborate that Bin Laden wanted to hijack planes in order to release prisoners, and that there WAS suspicious activity consistent with preparations for hijackings.

 

[Gem]

Max Power,

Thanks for the clarification...haven't looked at the memo in a few months. Still, as I stated earlier. A hijacked plane in a pre 9-11 world does not equate to a massive 4-pronged assault of planes being flown into buildings.

To look to this memo as anything other than an example on why US Intelligence needs to be majorly overhauled is partisan politics at its worst.

 

[Max Power]

Max Power,

Thanks for the clarification...haven't looked at the memo in a few months. Still, as I stated earlier. A hijacked plane in a pre 9-11 world does not equate to a massive 4-pronged assault of planes being flown into buildings.

To look to this memo as anything other than an example on why US Intelligence needs to be majorly overhauled is partisan politics at its worst.

Yes, I know. There were a million red flags, but the biggest obstacle was that division between the FBI and CIA.

 

[William Joyce]

1. Partisan politics is bullshit. Republicans and Democrats are essentially the same, and just play up a few minute differences (gay marriage, for example) so that you think you have a choice on election day.

Agreed.

It's only in extremely marginal ways that Republicans and Democrats differ. Nobody really gives a crap if the capital gains tax is one percent higher or lower, for instance, but that's how they "fight." Mostly, the two parties just trade power-holding and rub each other's shoulders, while the rest of America gets screwed. Special interests are the only ones truly represented. It's like the left says: "If voting changed anything, they'd make it illegal."

 

[dilloduck]

Agreed.

It's only in extremely marginal ways that Republicans and Democrats differ. Nobody really gives a crap if the capital gains tax is one percent higher or lower, for instance, but that's how they "fight." Mostly, the two parties just trade power-holding and rub each other's shoulders, while the rest of America gets screwed. Special interests are the only ones truly represented. It's like the left says: "If voting changed anything, they'd make it illegal."

I'm gonna jump on this band wagon too----as long as they can keep Americans thinking we have 2 different choices, we'll get the same old crap from politicians for years to come.

 

[Nuc]

I'm gonna jump on this band wagon too----as long as they can keep Americans thinking we have 2 different choices, we'll get the same old crap from politicians for years to come.

I agree heartily with Dillo and Joyce. Ouch!

 

[Gunny]

Yeah, let's blame Clinton on 9-11. Would you agree with me that several days before 9-11, Bush received a memo entitled (or something to this effect), "bin Laden determined to attack in United States." I'm not saying that Bush should be blamed, but he isn't blameless.

Right after he became president, in January 2001, he was talking about invading Iraq. He was upset when 9-11 occurred because it took his eye off the ball. Notice that Iraq somehow became connected to 9-11.

Bush is scum, and I am reveling in the fact that his approval ratings have tanked.

What a freakin' parrot. 9/11 occurred because Clinton ignored AQ for 8 years.

Let's just overlook the fact that we receive hundreds of threats daily, and have for years. Gee, which one to take seriously? All of them? I'd like to see you squeal when you got the budget for THAT.

The fact is, we as Americans, not Bush as the President, took our eyes off the ball. We're so damned arrogant that until 9/11, the UN bombing was a faded memory and we were complacent in our worldwide supremacy.

We ALL let it happen. It was an attack against US as Americans, not the GOP or the DNC.

But true to form, you leftist dweebs just have to figure out some way to point a finger at Bush for a problem that is societal and institutional.

And you claimed to work for DVA, so don't try and act like you don't know what a clusterfuck anything inside the beltway is. I'm surprised they manage to get anything done. Yet you lefties suddenly expect a miraculous coming together of dozens of security agencies with countless tons of intel, and choose which threat out of tens of thousands over the years is real.

Wake up.

 

[Gunny]

I agree heartily with Dillo and Joyce. Ouch!

Did that hurt?