GA School votes to hold graduation in Baptist Church

chanel

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Jun 8, 2009
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CHEROKEE COUNTY, Ga. - A Metro Atlanta school district was threatened with a lawsuit because a group says the county's high school graduations violate the separation of church and state. The Cherokee County school board voted on whether to move graduation away from a local church.

The Cherokee County School Board voted Thursday night not to move the graduation ceremonies from First Baptist Church of Woodstock.

School officials said the church offers the most space and it only charges $2,000 for all the county's graduation ceremonies.

But a national advocacy group threatened to sue the district unless it found a non-religious venue for graduation.

Cherokee School Board Votes on Graduation Site

We have our graduation ceremony on the football field in order to accomodate everyone. If it rains, it's moved to the school and only parents can attend. I can't imagine a district having to pay more than $2000.

Comments?
 
i think its a violation..i think 2000 is a lot to pay....i wonder if the church showed the income on their taxes....o wait they dont pay taxes but are competing with other venues .....unfair
 
Dicey. That's a lot of cash just for a venue for a public school graduation, too. Methinks there's a LOT of information missing here.
 
Actually, that church is HUGE. If they're getting the entire church for $2000 for the day, its a bargain. They probably have parking for 2000 cars?

HUGE church.

Cherokee County is far enough North to be getting into the area where most of the residents are actually native Georgians, and not necessarily Atlantans. Still, I don't think it will fly there.

Pickens, Fanin, Gilmer, Union.....those counties......they could hand out Bibles instead of diplomas and no one would say a word, not even the Latinos. In fact, everyone would applaud (until Atlanta caught wind of it).

But Cherokee is close enough to Atlanta to have many "bedroom communities." All sorts of people there, and a large number of them work in or very near Atlanta.....close enough to be influenced by the political correctness of the big city.

Go a little farther North than Canton, and you'll start running into mostly Georgians, and not transients. Different set of principles up there, and those people are nothing at all like the residents of Atlanta. Thank God :)
 
It said the church is charging 2000K for ALL the ceremonies. How many schools in that district? Are they being honest about having no other options that size?

I'd like to know more about this story, because I have a real problem with outside agitators suing cash strapped schools. If non-Christian families oppose, then they should have a say. But if this is no concern to the students and parents, then they should mind their own fucking business.
 
It said the church is charging 2000K for ALL the ceremonies. How many schools in that district? Are they being honest about having no other options that size?

I'd like to know more about this story, because I have a real problem with outside agitators suing cash strapped schools. If non-Christian families oppose, then they should have a say. But if this is no concern to the students and parents, then they should mind their own fucking business.

For a church that size, I'd guess that $2000 is probably pretty close to their daily expenses to be open. I'm telling you, its a HUGE church!
 
CHEROKEE COUNTY, Ga. - A Metro Atlanta school district was threatened with a lawsuit because a group says the county's high school graduations violate the separation of church and state. The Cherokee County school board voted on whether to move graduation away from a local church.

The Cherokee County School Board voted Thursday night not to move the graduation ceremonies from First Baptist Church of Woodstock.

School officials said the church offers the most space and it only charges $2,000 for all the county's graduation ceremonies.

But a national advocacy group threatened to sue the district unless it found a non-religious venue for graduation.
Cherokee School Board Votes on Graduation Site

We have our graduation ceremony on the football field in order to accomodate everyone. If it rains, it's moved to the school and only parents can attend. I can't imagine a district having to pay more than $2000.

Comments?

I think the amount of money is irrelevant to the church/state issue. My high school rented the University gym, and it was probably $2000 the 30+ years ago that I graduated. I don't think $2000 for a large building is unreasonable. I will also point out that that is for all the ceremonies the district has, and we have no idea how many schools are in that district. From the turnout at the meeting I would not be surprised if there is more than one school involved.

I also don't think it violates the separation of church and state. Renting a building to hold graduation is not sanctioning prayer, any religion, or anything religious. they can easily cover or remove any crosses or other displays that sanction a religion, just like Obama did when he spoke at Norte Dame.

People are going out of their way to find problems where none exist.
 
It's just a building. One that happens to be large enough to accommodate people who wish to attend.

As long as the church members aren't preaching, I don't see a problem with it.

And it's $2,000 for ALL of the counties graduation ceremonies. 6 High schools and a couple of alternative vocational schools.

$2k for at least 8 different ceremonies? C'mon. A dirt cheap bargain.
 
The plaintiff is the "Alliance for the Separation of Church and State" My guess is that these lawsuits are pretty much all they do. Hence, they go out searching for these "problems" simply to justify their existence. Sleazebags.
 
CHEROKEE COUNTY, Ga. - A Metro Atlanta school district was threatened with a lawsuit because a group says the county's high school graduations violate the separation of church and state. The Cherokee County school board voted on whether to move graduation away from a local church.

The Cherokee County School Board voted Thursday night not to move the graduation ceremonies from First Baptist Church of Woodstock.

School officials said the church offers the most space and it only charges $2,000 for all the county's graduation ceremonies.

But a national advocacy group threatened to sue the district unless it found a non-religious venue for graduation.

Cherokee School Board Votes on Graduation Site

We have our graduation ceremony on the football field in order to accomodate everyone. If it rains, it's moved to the school and only parents can attend. I can't imagine a district having to pay more than $2000.

Comments?

Georgia is above the national average on:
Teens not in school and not working
Teen dropouts
Teen pregnancies
Children in poverty

A perfect Red State.

Who cares where they graduate? It's not like they are going to promote education and science.

Georgia Extant Data on Children and Youth Who are Neglected, Delinquent, or At-Risk
 
It's just a building. One that happens to be large enough to accommodate people who wish to attend.

As long as the church members aren't preaching, I don't see a problem with it.

And it's $2,000 for ALL of the counties graduation ceremonies. 6 High schools and a couple of alternative vocational schools.

$2k for at least 8 different ceremonies? C'mon. A dirt cheap bargain.

In that context $2k might not be an overpayment. Context is required for backwoods hicks who are used to thinking of districts with a single or at most two high schools. :lol:

It's still dicey though. Establishment tests are all over the place. It would depend which test was applied and what the facts are as far as covering up symbols, having clergy present, and so on - not to mention whether there were a connection between that particular church and any Board members. If it were me, I would advise the district not to chance it. Obviously somebody complained.
 
It's just a building. One that happens to be large enough to accommodate people who wish to attend.

As long as the church members aren't preaching, I don't see a problem with it.

And it's $2,000 for ALL of the counties graduation ceremonies. 6 High schools and a couple of alternative vocational schools.

$2k for at least 8 different ceremonies? C'mon. A dirt cheap bargain.

In that context $2k might not be an overpayment. Context is required for backwoods hicks who are used to thinking of districts with a single or at most two high schools. :lol:

It's still dicey though. Establishment tests are all over the place. It would depend which test was applied and what the facts are as far as covering up symbols, having clergy present, and so on - not to mention whether there were a connection between that particular church and any Board members. If it were me, I would advise the district not to chance it. Obviously somebody complained.

They've been doing it for years, and until now no one got butthurt over it.

I agree with the sentiment that this is just a group seeking out reasons to sue when no one really cares.
 
Oh, and we're talking thousands and thousands of people. Cherokee county is not rural, it's pretty much just an extension of Atlanta.
 
It's just a building. One that happens to be large enough to accommodate people who wish to attend.

As long as the church members aren't preaching, I don't see a problem with it.

And it's $2,000 for ALL of the counties graduation ceremonies. 6 High schools and a couple of alternative vocational schools.

$2k for at least 8 different ceremonies? C'mon. A dirt cheap bargain.

In that context $2k might not be an overpayment. Context is required for backwoods hicks who are used to thinking of districts with a single or at most two high schools. :lol:

It's still dicey though. Establishment tests are all over the place. It would depend which test was applied and what the facts are as far as covering up symbols, having clergy present, and so on - not to mention whether there were a connection between that particular church and any Board members. If it were me, I would advise the district not to chance it. Obviously somebody complained.

They've been doing it for years, and until now no one got butthurt over it.

I agree with the sentiment that this is just a group seeking out reasons to sue when no one really cares.

Nah, these groups don't get involved until they're approached and get facts to review. They don't have infinite funds to chase their tails with, and these cases cost money. Somebody got butthurt and sought them out.

Right or wrong, it's a chance they're taking.

Ah well, not my taxes. /shrug
 
Here's some more info:

The school board debated the issue back in December, but decided to table the vote until three new board members took office. That happens Thursday night. One member of the board said it's not a matter of religion, just common sense. It costs the district $2,000 dollars to rent First Baptist. The Cobb Energy Center, the next closest and largest venue, would cost $40,000. The vote comes after a month of community debate.

Graduation in Church Vote - 11Alive.com | WXIA | Atlanta, GA

I mean, if I was a taxpayer in Cherokee County, I'd be fucking pissed that a Washington DC based rabble rousing group was about to cost my county an additional $38,000.

Cover up all religious imagery, and let the kids walk and get their diploma. Common sense.
 
In that context $2k might not be an overpayment. Context is required for backwoods hicks who are used to thinking of districts with a single or at most two high schools. :lol:

It's still dicey though. Establishment tests are all over the place. It would depend which test was applied and what the facts are as far as covering up symbols, having clergy present, and so on - not to mention whether there were a connection between that particular church and any Board members. If it were me, I would advise the district not to chance it. Obviously somebody complained.

They've been doing it for years, and until now no one got butthurt over it.

I agree with the sentiment that this is just a group seeking out reasons to sue when no one really cares.

Nah, these groups don't get involved until they're approached and get facts to review. They don't have infinite funds to chase their tails with, and these cases cost money. Somebody got butthurt and sought them out.

Right or wrong, it's a chance they're taking.

Ah well, not my taxes. /shrug

It might be cheaper to just go ahead with the ceremony at $2,000, let the group sue, and if the cost of litigation doesn't exceed $38,000 they're still better off than if they moved the venue.
 
In that context $2k might not be an overpayment. Context is required for backwoods hicks who are used to thinking of districts with a single or at most two high schools. :lol:

It's still dicey though. Establishment tests are all over the place. It would depend which test was applied and what the facts are as far as covering up symbols, having clergy present, and so on - not to mention whether there were a connection between that particular church and any Board members. If it were me, I would advise the district not to chance it. Obviously somebody complained.

They've been doing it for years, and until now no one got butthurt over it.

I agree with the sentiment that this is just a group seeking out reasons to sue when no one really cares.

Nah, these groups don't get involved until they're approached and get facts to review. They don't have infinite funds to chase their tails with, and these cases cost money. Somebody got butthurt and sought them out.

Right or wrong, it's a chance they're taking.

Ah well, not my taxes. /shrug

Maybe someone complained, maybe not. Cherokee county is a huge school district with thousands and thousands of kids. There wouldn't have been a need to really "seek" it out, it would be pretty obvious from the graduation announcements in the papers.
 
OK, yeah, someone got butthurt last year when they did it.

Its questioning of where the graduation ceremonies are held began last year with a complaint from someone who attended Sequoyah High School's ceremony in May 2009.

County Superintendent of Schools Dr. Frank Petruzielo recommended the board keep the graduations at the church not only because of its ability to seat any and everyone who shows up, but also because of its low cost to the district.

Petruzielo said, based on his personal experience of attending graduation ceremonies each year, "the eyes of the members of the audience are transfixed" on their children or grandchildren receiving diplomas, not on any religious symbols in the sanctuary.

The district pays the church $2,000 for each school's ceremony at the 7,000-seat facility, which it began using in 2005.

The district staff reported on secular sites in metro Atlanta as well as the county's high schools as possible venues for the ceremonies.

None of the alternate sites had the capacity, comparable costs and the high number of parking needed to rival that of the Woodstock church. Also, some of the venues weren't available during the district's scheduled graduations, which are on May 27 and 28.

School board members said they're more than willing to keep the graduations at the church.

Board member Kim Cochran of Free Home said if she felt there was a violation of a student's constitutional rights, she wouldn't vote to keep the graduations at the church.

"I don't believe it, and I have not believed it," she said.

Board member Mike Chapman of Canton, who noted he was having a John Boehner moment and getting emotional, said he watched both his sons graduate at the church, and it was a great experience.

He added "there's no way I'd vote to not allow that to happen" to other families.

Rob Usher, one of three newly elected school board members sworn into office at the meeting's start, called the church an "awesome" facility and it's "great" the district can use it.

New board member Robert Wofford added it was the board's responsibility to use the best, most cost-efficient space there is for the district.

He also reiterated that for him, the issue is not about religion.

"I'm not voting for a church or against a church," he said.

School board attorney Tom Roach of Canton, who's offered to defend the district's use of the church pro bono, said he feels comfortable defending it as no clear authority has been decided on either side of the case.

And it's still going to be cheaper to litigate than to move the venue.

Cherokee Tribune - School board Graduations to stay at church

(BTW mods, that really isn't the whole article. Not even half of it. That is one long news article for a small town paper.)
 
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It said the church is charging 2000K for ALL the ceremonies. How many schools in that district? Are they being honest about having no other options that size?

I'd like to know more about this story, because I have a real problem with outside agitators suing cash strapped schools. If non-Christian families oppose, then they should have a say. But if this is no concern to the students and parents, then they should mind their own fucking business.

At the school board meeting, no one in the public opposed the idea. All were for it.

And there will be at least 8 different graduation ceremonies. Say 1,500 students per ceremony. If each student is allowed 3 guests, then you're at 6,000 people. Per ceremony. The church's capacity is 7,000, so there's some wiggle room there.

48,000 people attending the ceremonies over 2 or 3 days. All for $2,000.
 

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