Founding Fathers' words on the second amendment!

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by red states rule, Apr 22, 2007.

  1. red states rule
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    red states rule Senior Member

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    This is in their own words. Still have a question as to the meaning of the second amendment?



    The Constitution [shall] be never construed to ... prevent the people of the United States, who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms. -Samuel Adams, Massachusetts' U.S. Constitution ratification convention, 1788

    Let us remember that if we suffer tamely a lawless attack upon our liberty, we encourage it. -Samuel Adams

    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. -Thomas Jefferson, Proposed Virginia Constitution, 1776


    ...[A]rms discourage and keep the invader and plunderer in awe, and preserve order in the world as property... Horrid mischief would ensue were the law-abiding deprived of the use of them. -Thomas Paine, Thoughts On Defensive War, 1775


    The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government." - Thomas Jefferson
     
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  2. red states rule
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    red states rule Senior Member

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    "This year will go down in history. For the first time, a civilized nation has full gun
    registration. Our streets will be safer, our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead."
    (Chancelor's Speech, 1935)

    "The most foolish mistake we could make would be to allow the subject peoples to
    possess arms. So let's not have any talk about native militias." (Hitler's Secret Conversations,
    1941-44, Farrar, Strauss and Young, 1953)

    Hitler was for gun control

    Look how well gun-control worked for him
     
  3. Paul Revere
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    Paul Revere Member

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  4. 8236
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    8236 VIP Member

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    I've been giving some thoughts to these debates about gun control in the US (given recent events), and I can see both sides of the argument (even as a Brit, where we have probably the most stringent gun laws in the world. e.g. 5 years mandatory for possession of a handgun). (Interesting look into the English origin of 2nd amendment here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution

    I could look at it as 'If only one of those students or professors had been armed', which is indeed a very good argument, and I guess this is where the difference lies in culture between us in Europe and you in America. Guns have become so ingrained in your psyche that the thought or even the possibility of ever getting rid of them has become inconceivable.

    But I am still left with a distinct feeling that the 2nd amendment as framed by the founding fathers is not applicable today.

    In 1776 the only arms that were available were bow, swords, pistols, musket and cannon. All the fired weapons among them were single shot, which required at least 10-30 seconds reload time. That amount of time is so great that it would make the Virginia Tech events impossible. Given these facts is it not likely that your Bill of Rights may be out of date and in need of changing?
     
  5. 8236
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    8236 VIP Member

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    The quotes are indeed interesting. But should we really be so surprised that the silver spooned amongst us have such skeletons in their closets? Thats how such mediocrites as 'Dubya' and Prince Charles etc. have such influence in the world.
     
  6. Paul Revere
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    It is every bit as applicle today as then. We the People then, fought against a tyrannical government. Sure, we used more primative weapons, but so did the people we were fighting. Today we have a tyranical government that is not armed with bows, swords, pistols, musket and cannon. We the People must remain armed with modern weapons.

    It is without a doubt that this imitation US government will attempt to take away guns from We the People, most likey using the guise of Martial Law and foriegn troops. It is without a doubt that will lead to massive bloodshed.
     
  7. 8236
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    Sorry, I wasn't talking about ur government. That's a whole different can of worms. I was only going on about the difference between what might have been intended by the founding fathers (the militia and defense of borders and civil unrest in a young unstable country) and the situation now, which is completely different.

    PS Paul: he said 'the regulars are coming' not the 'redcoats': yes ;)
     
  8. red states rule
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    red states rule Senior Member

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  9. red states rule
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    red states rule Senior Member

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    Do not try and reason with Paul the troll

    He is beyond all hope
     
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    The 'Guardian' may be a newspaper with a left wing bias, but I wouldn't describe it as full of cranks.
     

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