For those who want to blame the Bush admin for this:

[AllieBaba]

A couple of things to note.

THe Democratic congress created this mess.
And the Bush Admin has been warning us about it for years. They wanted oversight, and the assholes refused to provide any, because they swore this would never happen.

Fucking idiots. If this bill passes you better prepare yourself because I'm running for fucking president next time around. And I am partisan, and I will knock heads together.

White House warns of GSE risks
Fannie, Freddie enjoy perception of backing, Mankiw says
By Matt Andrejczak, CBS.MarketWatch.com
Last update: 4:50 p.m. EST Nov. 6, 2003
WASHINGTON (CBS.MW) - The notion that the U.S. government would bail out Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac if they ran into financial trouble "creates a source of systemic risk for our financial system," a top White House economic adviser warned Thursday.
Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, government-sponsored enterprises created by Congress to help fund home mortgages, enjoy special privileges, such as lines of credit with the Treasury Department.
Those special privileges "feed market perceptions that GSE debt has the backing of the U.S. government," said Gregory Mankiw, chairman of the administration's Council of Economic Advisers. "This notion is inaccurate." Read Mankiw's remarks.

Fannie Mae spokesman Chuck Greener disagreed with the administration's assertions about the implicit government guarantee.
"This is a question that has been asked and answered many times before, and in our view, has been refuted definitively by policymakers and economic experts," he said. What a lying sack. That's my editorial. Baba
Mankiw's remarks to the Conference of State Bank Supervisors come as the administration and lawmakers push to overhaul the regulatory framework for Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, which earlier this year admitted to understating its profit by $4.5 billion. See full story.
Adding to the uneasiness, Fannie Mae on Oct. 29 reported a $1.2 billion accounting error but said the mistake would have no impact on its income statement.
Mankiw said that a small misstep in the risk management programs at Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac could have repercussions for other financial institutions.
Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac hold a small amount of capital to cushion against unforeseen financial blows, he said. Combined, the sister companies hold $2.2 trillion in debt.
Coincidentally, Mankiw's predecessor at the White House, Glenn Hubbard, published a study Thursday that indicated that Fannie Mae's assets are less risky than those of commercial banks. Read his paper.
Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac are dominant players in the secondary mortgage securities market.
The sister companies buy mortgages from lenders, package them up, and sell to them to investors as mortgage-backed securities with guaranteed yield payments.
Due to the enormous size of the mortgage-backed securities market, any problems at Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac would have a ripple effect, Mankiw said.
"This risk is a systemic issue also because the debt obligations of the housing GSEs are widely held by other financial institutions," he said.
Matt Andrejczak is a reporter for CBS.MarketWatch.com in Washington.
Bush adviser warns of Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac risks - MarketWatch

 

[Alpha1]

Not one member of Barney Franks banking committee voted for the damn thing...but R's get the blame from the liberal media.....

 

[AllieBaba]

It's because they're dishonest, they're in it up to their necks, and they stand to lose.

Elections, money, you name it. Power. Because if we fail to pass this bail out bill (and I hope we do) people are going to look at the left a LOT differently. The scales will fall from everyone's eyes.

Heck, even Booboo is sounding moderate today. It's amazing.

 

[Care4all]

why did president bush encourage it, have it as an initiative, give fannie and freddie money for 40,000 new home owners down payment to get in to the loans?

Expanding Homeownership. The President believes that homeownership is the cornerstone of America's vibrant communities and benefits individual families by building stability and long-term financial security. In June 2002, President Bush issued America's Homeownership Challenge to the real estate and mortgage finance industries to encourage them to join the effort to close the gap that exists between the homeownership rates of minorities and non-minorities. The President also announced the goal of increasing the number of minority homeowners by at least 5.5 million families before the end of the decade. Under his leadership, the overall U.S. homeownership rate in the second quarter of 2004 was at an all time high of 69.2 percent. Minority homeownership set a new record of 51 percent in the second quarter, up 0.2 percentage point from the first quarter and up 2.1 percentage points from a year ago. President Bush's initiative to dismantle the barriers to homeownership includes:
American Dream Downpayment Initiative, which provides down payment assistance to approximately 40,000 low-income families;
Affordable Housing. The President has proposed the Single-Family Affordable Housing Tax Credit, which would increase the supply of affordable homes;
Helping Families Help Themselves. The President has proposed increasing support for the Self-Help Homeownership Opportunities Program; and
Simplifying Homebuying and Increasing Education. The President and HUD want to empower homebuyers by simplifying the home buying process so consumers can better understand and benefit from cost savings. The President also wants to expand financial education efforts so that families can understand what they need to do to become homeowners. Fact Sheet: America's Ownership Society: Expanding Opportunities

can he really have it both ways? the initiative to have fannie freddie put 5.5 million low income people in to homes while condeming them?

 

[Silence]

THe Democratic congress created this mess.
And the Bush Admin has been warning us about it for years. They wanted oversight, and the assholes refused to provide any, because they swore this would never happen.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republican_Revolution

I'm curious.... at what point during the 12 fucking years of Republican rule in Congress (1993-2007) did the Republicans pass a bill to reign in Fannie and Freddie?

if it's as they said yesterday, when they were in the majority these things didn't happen, why didn't they take care of it when they had control?

ya'll are like McCain and his obvious belief that the war in Iraq began in 2007 with the surge.......you want to pretend Congress was suddenly invented in 2007 when the Dems took back control but the reality is in 1993, with Clinton in office, the Republicans took control of Congress and did not lose that control until just last year.

so regardless of whether the Dems voted against it or not, if the Repubs had the majority they couldn't voted to pass any bill they wanted with just a tad Democratic support, which it's clear they could've mustered by more moderate dems.

stop your fucking bitching and whining just because the public blames Bush & co....that's the reality of the situation... deal with it.

this is how the Congress is split

In the 2006 elections, Democrats won both the House of Representatives (233 Democrats, 202 Republicans) and the Senate (49 Democrats, 49 Republicans, and 2 Independents caucusing with the Democrats) as well as the majority of state governorships (28-22).


doesn't look like a very impressive "majority" to me... they still NEED the Republicans to get shit done...unless of course you think the Republicans should just sit on their ass and do nothing while the Dems get everything done.

 

[WillowTree]

12 fricking Democrats on Barney Franks Finance Committee, voted no on the bail out





Rich!

 

[KittenKoder]

There are plenty of things to make fun of the Chimp for, this mess is EVERYONE'S fault.

 

[Larkinn]

Not one member of Barney Franks banking committee voted for the damn thing...but R's get the blame from the liberal media.....

Perhaps because they know the facts, like the majority of Democrats on the banking committee voted for it, as opposed to just accepting spoon fed lies like you do.

 

[AllieBaba]

why did president bush encourage it, have it as an initiative, give fannie and freddie money for 40,000 new home owners down payment to get in to the loans?

Expanding Homeownership. The President believes that homeownership is the cornerstone of America's vibrant communities and benefits individual families by building stability and long-term financial security. In June 2002, President Bush issued America's Homeownership Challenge to the real estate and mortgage finance industries to encourage them to join the effort to close the gap that exists between the homeownership rates of minorities and non-minorities. The President also announced the goal of increasing the number of minority homeowners by at least 5.5 million families before the end of the decade. Under his leadership, the overall U.S. homeownership rate in the second quarter of 2004 was at an all time high of 69.2 percent. Minority homeownership set a new record of 51 percent in the second quarter, up 0.2 percentage point from the first quarter and up 2.1 percentage points from a year ago. President Bush's initiative to dismantle the barriers to homeownership includes:
American Dream Downpayment Initiative, which provides down payment assistance to approximately 40,000 low-income families;
Affordable Housing. The President has proposed the Single-Family Affordable Housing Tax Credit, which would increase the supply of affordable homes;
Helping Families Help Themselves. The President has proposed increasing support for the Self-Help Homeownership Opportunities Program; and
Simplifying Homebuying and Increasing Education. The President and HUD want to empower homebuyers by simplifying the home buying process so consumers can better understand and benefit from cost savings. The President also wants to expand financial education efforts so that families can understand what they need to do to become homeowners. Fact Sheet: America's Ownership Society: Expanding Opportunities

can he really have it both ways? the initiative to have fannie freddie put 5.5 million low income people in to homes while condeming them?

They've already walked away from the mortgages. But other than that, I don't know. I think in being so desperately bi-partisan he frequently allowed himself to sign onto ideas that are Dem ideas...which is why the Republicans are so fed up with him. He did try to put the brakes on this years ago, and Congress and the Democrats shouted him down and said there was no cause for concern, and oversight wasn't needed.

All I know now is that bailing out is not going to fix it, it will make it worse. We have to have a major shift in our country. People need to be dependent upon themselves again. If you want a house, you'd better damn well save for one, the way we used to. And live within your fucking means, instead of relying on credit.

 

[AllieBaba]

Perhaps because they know the facts, like the majority of Democrats on the banking committee voted for it, as opposed to just accepting spoon fed lies like you do.

Oh, yes..those secret "facts" that nobody really knows about and which will all be revealed...in time...if we're good.

Talk about being spoon fed.

 

[Larkinn]

Oh, yes..those secret "facts" that nobody really knows about and which will all be revealed...in time...if we're good.

Talk about being spoon fed.

Umm, no, like the fact that many Democrats on the Banking committee voted for the bill.

Its not a secret at all. Its quite public actually.

And nobody spoon fed me that. I decided to check out a Republican claim that seemed a bit weird. And what a coincidence, it ends up being a bald faced lie. Who woulda thunk.

 

[AllieBaba]

Oh, I see. You're admitting the Dems are idiots.

Never mind, then.

 

[Larkinn]

Oh, I see. You're admitting the Dems are idiots.

Never mind, then.

No they just, unlike you, don't have a perverse, sick glee at the prospect of the economy fucking up.

 

[AllieBaba]

I don't have a glee about it. I feel really sorry for all the pieces of shit who got rich on the backs of the tax payers.

I do have a sense of glee as I watch the liberal machine break apart, however. It's classic. And I look forward to re-building the economy the right way, once all the shit has been flushed down the toilet.

 

[Larkinn]

I don't have a glee about it. I feel really sorry for all the pieces of shit who got rich on the backs of the tax payers.

I do have a sense of glee as I watch the liberal machine break apart, however. It's classic. And I look forward to re-building the economy the right way, once all the shit has been flushed down the toilet.

The people who got rich are already hurting. Thats not what the bailout is designed to fix. Trust me, Wall Street is already fucked. Its designed to keep that from spreading all across the country.

 

[Chris]

Phil Gramm is to blame for the crisis, Bush is to blame for Iraq.

 

[Alpha1]

Perhaps because they know the facts, like the majority of Democrats on the banking committee voted for it, as opposed to just accepting spoon fed lies like you do.

Thanks for the correction .... my bad for sure....

I'll try again....

12 members of Franks own Banking Committee voted NO on that bail out and still R's get the blame for it not passing....(12 out of 37)

That should set the record right.....first error I've ever made....

The Virginian Federalist: House Banking Committee Democrats defeat Bank Bailout

Monday, September 29, 2008
House Banking Committee Democrats defeat Bank Bailout


The House of Representatives voted down the bank bailout bill today on a close vote 228 to 205. 95 Democrats and 133 Republicans voted no. The Virginia congressional delegation vote was also split with Congressman Bobby Scott (D) and Robb Wittman (R), Thelma Drake (R), Randy Forbes (R), Virgil Goode (R) and Robert Goodblatte (R) voting no. Eric Cantor (R), Frank Wolf (R), Tom Davis (R), Jim Moran (D) and Rick Boucher (D) voted yes. The entire roll call is here.

What is interesting is the vote cast by members of the House Banking Committee (see below the fold). With the difference between yeas and nays overall 23, a shift of 12 votes would pass the bill. Of the 37 Democrats on the committee, 12 voted no. One can conclude that it was the 12 Democrat members of the House Banking Committee who voted no were the votes which defeated the bill.

Brad Sherman, California N
William Clay, Jr., Missouri N
Joe Baca, California N
Stephen Lynch, Massachusetts N
David Scott, Georgia N
Al Green, Texas N
Emanuel Cleaver, Missouri N
Lincoln Davis, Tennessee N
Paul Hodes, New Hampshire N
André Carson, Indiana N
Don Cazayoux, Louisiana N
Travis Childers, Mississippi N

 

[AllieBaba]

Larkinn said:
The people who got rich are already hurting. Thats not what the bailout is designed to fix. Trust me, Wall Street is already fucked. Its designed to keep that from spreading all across the country.

And it will fail miserably, as did the "plan" to "build" the economy by extending low-interest loans to high-risk lenders.

PEOPLE HAVE TO BE ACCOUNTABLE. They have to earn their own money, they have to support their own lifestyle, and when they fail, THEY FUCKING FAIL.

You can't continue to prop up a system which doesn't work. People will lose jobs. Particularly people in the banking industry. Oh no, there goes Money Tree, Rent A Center, Barney's Used Car Mo-Town (Everyone Approved for a Car Loan!).

But it has got to happen and we will recover. You can't save everyone all the time from bad choices. Eventually someone has to take a fall, and the longer you put it off, the more people will fall. And no, it isn't going to be the fault of Bill the Valet at the casino down the road (ok, well, maybe a casino is a bad example, but you get the idea) when the casino (ok, casino is a really bad comparison, but I couldn't think of anyone else around here with valets) has to lay off 35 percent of its workers.

But he's not going to die. He already lost his house when he got busted for drugs and got behind on payments, after all. He'll just get a job either fishing or at an oil refinery, if we ever build any. Or he'll get a job washing dishes. Or he'll start his own window-washing business.

The point is, it's gonna happen. Quit bailing people out and let the cards fall where they may and start over.

I know I can always get a job. Always. I don't care what it is, I am not someone who will ever be whining that there's no work. If there's no work, I'll make fucking work. And most Americans are like that.

It'll be ok, Larkinn. Perhaps the business I create will be that of a professional hand-holder for the liberals and lefties who freak out at the thought of life being too intense and realistic.

 

[Alpha1]

Phil Gramm is to blame for the crisis, Bush is to blame for Iraq.

Your VP knows his facts..

Biden on Meet the Press in 2002, discussing Saddam Hussein: “He’s a long term threat and a short term threat to our national security… “We have no choice but to eliminate the threat. This is a guy who is an extreme danger to the world.”

Biden on Meet the Press in 2002: “Saddam must be dislodged from his weapons or dislodged from power.”

Biden on Meet the Press in 2007, on Hussein’s WMDs: “Well, the point is, it turned out they didn’t, but everyone in the world thought he had them. The weapons inspectors said he had them. He catalogued — they catalogued them. This was not some, some Cheney, you know, pipe dream. This was, in fact, catalogued.”

Biden to the Brookings Institution in 2005: “We can call it quits and withdraw from Iraq. I think that would be a gigantic mistake.

I tire of posting the same shit, but it seems to be a necessity to pound into the numbskulls...

 

[AllieBaba]

They just ignore it.