For those who said forcing Americans to buy private insurance was Unconstitutional...

[NYcarbineer]

Why aren't you saying that about Ryan's kill-Medicare plan?

Which forces seniors to buy private insurance...

 

[boedicca]

Because it doesn't. It provides a voucher for senior to use to purchase their own health insurance, if they so choose.

It doesn't fine them if they opt out.

 

[dblack]

Why aren't you saying that about Ryan's kill-Medicare plan?

Which forces seniors to buy private insurance...

I have been. Repeatedly.

 

[Wacky Quacky]

Why aren't you saying that about Ryan's kill-Medicare plan?

Which forces seniors to buy private insurance...

Since when are seniors forced to use medicare at all? It's a voluntary program. The government has the choice stacked against you (if you begin collecting social security benefits then you're automatically enrolled in medicare), but in the end it's still voluntary.

 

[dblack]

Because it doesn't. It provides a voucher for senior to use to purchase their own health insurance, if they so choose.

It doesn't fine them if they opt out.

It converts their previous medicare payments into vouchers that can only be used for insurance. They can "opt out" but then they lose their benefits altogether. It's hard to miss the similarity between this and Obamacare as each as has the same intent - to push as many people as possible into the private insurance pool, at taxpayer expense. More corporate welfare.

 

[boedicca]

Why aren't you saying that about Ryan's kill-Medicare plan?

Which forces seniors to buy private insurance...

Since when are seniors forced to use medicare at all? It's a voluntary program. The government has the choice stacked against you (if you begin collecting social security benefits then you're automatically enrolled in medicare), but in the end it's still voluntary.

Actually, under current law, seniors who don't sign up for Medicare can be denied their Social Security benefits.

 

[boedicca]

Because it doesn't. It provides a voucher for senior to use to purchase their own health insurance, if they so choose.

It doesn't fine them if they opt out.

It converts their previous medicare payments into vouchers that can only be used for insurance. They can "opt out" but then they lose their benefits altogether. It's hard to miss the similarity between this and Obamacare as each as has the same intent - to push as many people as possible into the private insurance pool, at taxpayer expense. More corporate welfare.

I'd like to see the voucher turned into something they can use to purchase health care directly without having to buy insurance or saved in a health savings account for the future if they so choose.

Ultimately, this is can only be a transition plan to dismantle the entire thing altogether. We should privatize retirement and health care.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Because it doesn't. It provides a voucher for senior to use to purchase their own health insurance, if they so choose.

It doesn't fine them if they opt out.

Yes it does because you still have to pay in. Where does the voucher money come from?

It's a defacto fine if you don't buy the insurance.

 

[dblack]

Since when are seniors forced to use medicare at all? It's a voluntary program.

I'm pretty sure that's not right. Paying into Medicare is not voluntary.

 

[Wacky Quacky]

Why aren't you saying that about Ryan's kill-Medicare plan?

Which forces seniors to buy private insurance...

Since when are seniors forced to use medicare at all? It's a voluntary program. The government has the choice stacked against you (if you begin collecting social security benefits then you're automatically enrolled in medicare), but in the end it's still voluntary.

Actually, under current law, seniors who don't sign up for Medicare can be denied their Social Security benefits.

Right, that's what I meant. But none-the-less, it's all voluntary. Ryan's fix/attack or whatever you want to call it doesn't change the fact that Medicare is voluntary.

 

[Truthmatters]

So if a person takes their voucher and spends it instead of buying insurance what happens wehn they are rushed to the hospital and taken to the emergency room?

 

[NYcarbineer]

Because it doesn't. It provides a voucher for senior to use to purchase their own health insurance, if they so choose.

It doesn't fine them if they opt out.

It converts their previous medicare payments into vouchers that can only be used for insurance. They can "opt out" but then they lose their benefits altogether. It's hard to miss the similarity between this and Obamacare as each as has the same intent - to push as many people as possible into the private insurance pool, at taxpayer expense. More corporate welfare.

I'd like to see the voucher turned into something they can use to purchase health care directly owithout having to buy insurance or saved in a health savings account for the future if they so choose.

So you acknowledge it forces seniors to buy private insurance, or lose the money they were forced to pay in.

 

[boedicca]

Since when are seniors forced to use medicare at all? It's a voluntary program. The government has the choice stacked against you (if you begin collecting social security benefits then you're automatically enrolled in medicare), but in the end it's still voluntary.

Actually, under current law, seniors who don't sign up for Medicare can be denied their Social Security benefits.

Right, that's what I meant. But none-the-less, it's all voluntary. Ryan's fix/attack or whatever you want to call it doesn't change the fact that Medicare is voluntary.

Medicare is currently NOT VOLUNTARY unless you wish to give up your Social Security benefits.

 

[dblack]

I'd like to see the voucher turned into something they can use to purchase health care directly owithout having to buy insurance or saved in a health savings account for the future if they so choose.

Me too. But the fact that such an obvious thing isn't even discussed is proof of Ryan's hypocrisy.

 

[Wacky Quacky]

Since when are seniors forced to use medicare at all? It's a voluntary program.

I'm pretty sure that's not right. Paying into Medicare is not voluntary.

True, but that's not what the OP was addressing.

If given the option I would stop paying into medicare immediately. I'm actually preparing for my retirement, so the government and their bankrupt bullshit programs can kiss my ass.

 

[boedicca]

I'd like to see the voucher turned into something they can use to purchase health care directly owithout having to buy insurance or saved in a health savings account for the future if they so choose.

Me too. But the fact that such an obvious thing isn't even discussed is proof of Ryan's hypocrisy.

We haven't seen the full thing discussed yet. The concept put forward is a voucher. The full use and nature of that voucher is still up for negotiation.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Since when are seniors forced to use medicare at all? It's a voluntary program. The government has the choice stacked against you (if you begin collecting social security benefits then you're automatically enrolled in medicare), but in the end it's still voluntary.

Actually, under current law, seniors who don't sign up for Medicare can be denied their Social Security benefits.

Right, that's what I meant. But none-the-less, it's all voluntary. Ryan's fix/attack or whatever you want to call it doesn't change the fact that Medicare is voluntary.

I don't think the payroll tax is voluntary. Is Ryan getting rid of the payroll tax? Is he giving seniors a voucher whether they paid in or not?

And a voucher is a voucher. It's not cash. It's a coupon.

 

[Annie]

Why aren't you saying that about Ryan's kill-Medicare plan?

Which forces seniors to buy private insurance...

Not accurate, does nothing of the sort for today's seniors or those that will be such in next 10 years:

Ramesh Ponnuru: Medicare: Ryan care vs. bureaucrats | Contributors | projo.com | The Providence Journal

 

[Wacky Quacky]

Actually, under current law, seniors who don't sign up for Medicare can be denied their Social Security benefits.

Right, that's what I meant. But none-the-less, it's all voluntary. Ryan's fix/attack or whatever you want to call it doesn't change the fact that Medicare is voluntary.

Medicare is currently NOT VOLUNTARY unless you wish to give up your Social Security benefits.

Yup, voluntary.

 

[Truthmatters]

Ok then what happens to the people who opt out?

What does a emergency dr do when a patient is brought in without any knowledge of wether the person opted out or not?