FLUSH the DC TOILET in 2010!

[Dr Grump]

editec

Right now Wall Street transcends congress and the Supremes. I don't know how many Americans believe campaign donations qualify as "free" speech but I'm convinced Republicans and Democrats will turn on their mothers before taking on Wall Street.

How about changing your electoral system....

 

[slackjawed]

Slackjawed:

Lately I've noticed those on the left and right have different definitions of "socialism."

For decades I used the word as a workers paradise where workers controlled the means of production and were compensated fairly for their labor.

I was always confused when the right would refer to Rockefeller and Armand Hammer as socialists. Until I learned how Hammer and other capitalists helped Lenin come to power in 1918.

What I saw as a worker's paradise the right saw as a centralized one world government.

My bad...

lol, don't worry. The fact is that socialism does have different meanings to different folks. Consider that while attempting to overthrow the rule of the tsar, socialism looks pretty good- a workers paradise rather than a life of serfdom(slavery).
For this country though, it would be a big step backwards, and while some may say workers paradise, most, including me would say slavery.
The "rhetoric" I was accused of spouting is normal everyday speech where I live. I have been all over the world, and have lived in 18 states. I have been to every state and a couple of us terratories. I live where I do because of the wide open spaces and the people here are, for the most part, like me. Yes we have our nut cases, Bill Cooper lived in the town I live in, I am spending the winter on what used to be his property. Yes, we have a few that come here and try to change things, but they never last long and they leave.
The warning signs are present to those that choose to pay attention. There seems to be a real movement afoot to 'socialize' (no pun intended) our country and a lot of the people that support it live in cities and do not understand what they are supporting.
It just seems to me that those that are continually asking the federal government to give them more do not understand that the cost of that will be their freedom, even if they do succeed in 'taxing the rich', in the end we will all lose our liberty. It isn't empty rhetoric, open attempts at socialism will be met with resistance, here in the white mountains of AZ anyway, and I suspect that more rural areas would react the same way.
We have another chance, and another choice. We need real leaders, not the pretenders that scoff at our constitution and portray themselves as above the law, but real leaders. I predict that we shall have them. The most peaceful way to get them is to send the current bunch home, stop putting people in office for more than one term and elect people to representiaives that truely represent us. If we can't do that, I personally believe that we will end up with another civil war, or even second american revolution.
My first choice is the path of civilized peace. I believe most people would choose that as well. What I know about the other choices can't be posted here.

 

[Dr Grump]

Diuretic

Globalization is driven by things like tax policy for corporations who outsource jobs. One of the latest examples is Obama's rescue of Detroit automakers. That deal is structured in such a way that the owners receive maximum benefit by shuttering plants in this country and moving operations to Mexico or China.

Domestic labor suffers and Wall Street profits because Republicans and Democrats receive more campaign money from investment bankers than from unions.

Most Western countries are becoming service-based, while manufacturing jobs are going overseas...Western countries cannot compete with the cheap labour......

 

[georgephillip]

Rightwinger:

What is speculative about the results of NAFTA?

Millions of American workers have lost good paying jobs and the middle-class lifestyle those jobs provided.

Millions of Mexicans have lost their farms and many have migrated to this country.

The richest 1% of US citizens and Mexican elites have even more money they won't live long enough to spend.

And it's all made real by Republicans and Democrats.

 

[Big Black Dog]

FLUSH the DC TOILET in 2010!

Great idea. I hope nobody votes for any incumbent.

 

[Old Rocks]

Yet, so many here are adamantly opposed to the government promoting research into disruptive technologies like very high capacity batteries ( or capacitors), or very high efficiency solar cells.

While our own people are cursing the price of labor here, we have German, Japanese, and Chinese companies building solar manufacturing facilities here in Oregon.

GM produced an electric car in 1991 that the people who drove one for thousands of miles loved. And destroyed them all for no named reason. GM is bragging about a plug in hybrid for sale this year at $40,000. BYD is selling a plug in hybrid in China right now for $22,000 that gets 1 1/2 times as much mileage on all electric as the Volt.

A very good book on the descent of America is "Hot, Flat, and Crowded" by Thomas Friedman.

 

[georgephillip]

Dr. Grump:

Changing the electoral system would be much easier after FLUSHING most Republicans and Democrats from the congress. Proportional representation and instant run-off elections, for example, would weaken the corporate choke hold that both major parties take turns inflicting on Americans.

If it's true the manufacturing jobs aren't coming back, then it's time to revisit one of the original talking points of the Industrial Revolution: Namely the machine would eventually free humanity from the need to work full time.

If the US has reached that point, then something like a guaranteed annual wage for all citizens should rate at least as much consideration from "our" representatives as bailing out Goldman Sachs.

 

[Diuretic]

Diuretic

Globalization is driven by things like tax policy for corporations who outsource jobs. One of the latest examples is Obama's rescue of Detroit automakers. That deal is structured in such a way that the owners receive maximum benefit by shuttering plants in this country and moving operations to Mexico or China.

Domestic labor suffers and Wall Street profits because Republicans and Democrats receive more campaign money from investment bankers than from unions.

I remember reading in Time magazine a few years ago where various states were engaged in battles to attract industry and were bidding against one another to lower costs to businesses who would bring industry and therefore employment. Understandable but parochial and in the end self-defeating.

If the bailout of Detroit has done that as you say then it's bloody stupid policy.

 

[georgephillip]

Old Rocks:

In addition to the electric car wars you mention, I've heard that Internet subscribers in Korea and Australia enjoy speeds 20-50 times faster than the US, yet pay half as much every month.

I've also heard of an experiment slated for trial this year in Canada that will bill Internet services on a cable television model.

You'll receive "X" number of monthly sites for a fixed payment, and any additional sites you visit will require additional money.

Left to the corporations...how long before we're billed by the mouse click?

Technological innovation in the USA is often payed for by the taxpayer (usually via the Pentagon) but once profit potential is realized the technology gets turned over to for profit corporations.

Thanks, yet again, to the Republicans AND Democrats.

 

[Douger]

WW3 will get that manufacturing kicking again !
Sell them weapons and send the idiots overseas so they can get shot at.

That's why they call it a "theater" It's where they have you act out their movie.

 

[georgephillip]

Diuretic:

State and local governments often compete for new jobs by offering to slash property or sales taxes paid by large employers. Usually there are claw back provisions that allow government to ensure that corporations receiving a "free lunch" don't abandon the community for cheaper labor elsewhere without returning some of their local tax breaks.

It's probably fair to say that American corporations completed their "Internationalism Agenda" decades ago and today have only a "PR"-level commitment to America or American workers/taxpayers.

 

[georgephillip]

Douger:

What happens if that WW3 "theater" goes viral (global)?

It's hard for me to imagine "winners" of that conflict that aren't envious of the "losers."

 

[ron scott]

Jeez, this is the 500 Ilb gorilla in the room, this thread!

 

[georgephillip]

Ron:

I believe there's an Axis of Greed at work in this country today. Wall Street, the Pentagon, and the US Congress have found ways to profit from war and private banking in ways no previous empire could have dreamed of.

Rome. Spain. Holland and Britain. None of these faced the same ticking clock that Americans face today.

War is a racket, and Natural Selection may be the cure.

I believe that any specie corrupt or evil enough to kill its young for profit is hardwired to self destruct. Probably about the time its weapons begin leaving its planet's surface.

"(S)hall we put an end to the human race; or shall mankind renounce war." (A. Einstein)

The Internet makes it possible to target all the war whores, Republican and Democrats, next November 2.

Please ask yourself what changes in January 2011 if there are 50-100 new House members and maybe a dozen Senator-elects waiting to be sworn in?

Now imagine if 75%-90% of the new legislators are neither Republican nor Democrat.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

Ron:

I believe there's an Axis of Greed at work in this country today. Wall Street, the Pentagon, and the US Congress have found ways to profit from war and private banking in ways no previous empire could have dreamed of.

Rome. Spain. Holland and Britain. None of these faced the same ticking clock that Americans face today.

War is a racket, and Natural Selection may be the cure.

I believe that any specie corrupt or evil enough to kill its young for profit is hardwired to self destruct. Probably about the time its weapons begin leaving its planet's surface.

"(S)hall we put an end to the human race; or shall mankind renounce war." (A. Einstein)

The Internet makes it possible to target all the war whores, Republican and Democrats, next November 2.

Please ask yourself what changes in January 2011 if there are 50-100 new House members and maybe a dozen Senator-elects waiting to be sworn in?

Now imagine if 75%-90% of the new legislators are neither Republican nor Democrat.

I'm not saying I don't agree with you in theory, but let me play devil's advocate for a moment.

Purely Hypothetical:

What do you think would happen if, tomorrow morning, war ended? All fighting, all over the world, immediately ended?

It would destroy the economy of the United States. All of a sudden, 200 million people around the world would be out of a job. Thousands of American companies suddenly go bankrupt. The military industrial complex is one of the largest industries of the world - not only the US.

Like it or not, War is profit - and a large portion of our GDP is war-related.

 

[FireFly]

Change the campiagn finance laws.

But in fact the Supreme court just changed them BACK to something even worse than they've been for the last thirty years by calling into question the post watergate reforms,.

Wall street's lock on our government is therefore, stronger than ever.

What is even worse than campaign finance laws are the way they are completely circumvented.

Take the fact that GE & Westinghouse are big beneficiaries of big government bailouts & contracts. These corporations own media empires NBC & CBS respectively. Your propaganda is bought & paid for by the government. Who needs campaign finance when government campaigns 24/7/365. This should be criminal to say the least.

 

[ron scott]

not sure or sure:
It starts with the way we think, basically two choices I see: curse the darkness or light a candle. If we think about something we give power to it. I think the american conscienceness knows what's up, I believe we are all connected. the way forward is to put the thoughts and words there.. which may not be here (USMB).. but where? arguing with the seemingly conscience challenged does not seem to be the way forward, most of them seem to get on board what ever bus everybody is getting on anyway. More than 50% of humans are not dumbed down to the point they can't do something good -and most of the rest will go along with whatever the majority is doing.

 

[georgephillip]

theDoctorisIn:

I tried posting this reply two days ago...hope springs eternal.

I don't think there's any possibility of all war ending any time soon. My target is Wall Street, who's just completing the largest transfer of private debt into public debt in history.

I don't think war PROFITS and private debt are sustainable at their current levels on a planet with 6 billion people...There are some gifted number crunchers who believe today's war/debt economy would be sustainable with a global population of 500 million.

Something to think about the next time you're in a room with 11 other people.

 

[georgephillip]

Since I last posted on this thread on January 18, 2010, I've seen nothing to change my opinion of Republicans AND Democrats.

Both parties are wholly owned subsidiaries of Wall Street.

Take a look at the seating chart of the US Congress that assigns seats by major business sponsors instead of party affiliation.

The Senate is dominated by FIRE, Drugs, and Lawyers.

Our "People's House" serves Big Labor or Big Money.

"Choosing" between a Republican OR a Democrat ensures more good times for Wall Street and more misery for Main Street.

There are viable and unknown third party candidates on many ballots around this country. INCUMBENTS can be FLUSHED for no other reason than their fealty to Wall Street.

What changes if the next congress has 100 - 200 new legislators who are neither Republican nor Democrat?

Yes, it's a political leap of faith.
Wingnuts on both sides will take their seats in congress.
But will they serve Wall Street or Main Street interests?

There is NO DOUBT which side new Republicans OR new Democrats will serve.

FLUSH the DC TOILET in 2010!
Fire the second shot heard 'round the world.

Who Owns Congress