Flu shots over-hyped, not as effective as touted.

[zzzz]

I've only had 1 in the last 20 years and never had the flu. It appears that the effectiveness is not quite as high as advertised. Put that together with the strains that pop up and they are not in the shot and it is a wonder if they do anything at all. It does look like shooting a person up with a live virus is more effective than a dead virus. I wonder how sick that shot makes you.

Michael Osterholm, an infectious disease specialist at the University of Minnesota, and his colleagues found that the most common flu vaccine in the United States is effective for 59 percent of healthy adults, well below the 70 percent to 90 percent level previously reported.

World needs to update its flu vaccines: study | Reuters

A meta-analysis of the 31 studies also showed that a newer type of vaccine that uses a live virus was 83 percent effective in protecting children between six months and seven years old.

However, this type of vaccine, which is made by MedImmune, is not currently recommended as the best treatment for children by the CDC group that decides immunization practices in the United States, the study's authors said.

 

[waltky]

Granny says get yer kids vaccinated fer pneumonia so's dey don't get sick an' die...

Pneumonia Vaccines Could Save Millions
November 12, 2011 - Health agencies are marking this year's World Pneumonia Day by touting the advancements made in the prevention and treatment of pneumonia, the biggest killer of children under age five.

Pneumonia is the leading cause of death in children worldwide. The World Health Organization reports a child dies of pneumonia every 20 seconds and 98 percent of these deaths are in developing countries. In total, WHO estimates nearly 1.5 million children under age five die every year from this killer disease. That is more than AIDS, malaria and tuberculosis combined. Studies show that prevention and proper treatment of pneumonia could avert one million deaths in children every year. The GAVI Alliance says life-saving vaccines against pneumonia, which previously had been available mainly in rich nations, now are being introduced in developing countries.

GAVI spokesman, Jeffrey Rowland calls this a tremendous achievement. He notes last year, nearly no poor child in the developing world was protected against pneumonia. "Thanks to the global rollout of pneumococcal vaccines-pneumococcal being a bacterium that is the largest cause of pneumonia, 3.6 million children have been immunized against pneumonia. By this time next year, the number is expected to rise to nearly 13.6 million," said Rowland. "This number is a number to celebrate and celebrate loudly because it was not in existence a year ago." Pneumococcal vaccines have been around in the United States since 2007. But, their prohibitive cost has made them inaccessible for people in poor countries. Three doses are needed to protect a child against pneumonia. Each dose costs between $85 and $110.

Rowland says through a series of complex negotiations, pharmaceutical companies have agreed to lower their prices to $3.50 per dose for developing countries. He says the new vaccines are expected to prevent more than 70 percent of serious pneumococcal infections among children in Africa and Asia, where children have the highest risk of this disease. But vaccines are only half the story. Children who get sick with pneumonia have to be treated with antibiotics. Unfortunately, many children in poor countries are not able to reach the health facilities that can offer them lifesaving treatment. The results of a World Health Organization (WHO) study in Pakistan find most children with pneumonia, can be successfully treated at home. WHO spokeswoman Olivia Lawe-Davies says these findings offer great hope.

"The results of that study have shown that in fact, you get just as good results, in fact even slightly better results with treating children at home with the oral antibiotic, rather than referring them, possibly because, a lot of times, when children are referred in poor, isolated communities, they never actually make it to the facility," Lawe-Davies noted. "Or, when they get to the facility, they might not get the treatment that they are supposed to get. So, we found that the results of the outcomes of the at-home treated children were, in fact, slightly better." Currently, WHO recommends that children with non-severe pneumonia be treated at home. This recent study, it notes, indicates that children with severe forms of pneumonia also could benefit from home treatment. Lawe-Davies says WHO plans to conduct similar studies in other places. If the results indicate that children with severe pneumonia can be effectively managed at home, she says this would make treatment more accessible and cut costs. And, it would save more lives.

Source

 

[waltky]

Granny sendin' Uncle Ferd to get his flu shot inna mornin'...

Morning flu jabs 'work better for men'
21 December 2011 - Men fare better if they are vaccinated in the morning, say the researchers

Flu jabs can be made more effective by changing the time of day they are given - mornings for men and afternoons for women are best - scientists believe. Synchronising the jab with the body's natural daily cyclical rhythm makes it more likely to offer good immunity, says the Medical Research Council team. The immune system gets sluggish as we age which explains why only a third of elderly people vaccinated get full protection from their winter flu vaccine. Rescheduling appointments may help.

To test their theory, the researchers are using GP patients in Birmingham as guinea pigs. 300 of them will be given morning or afternoon vaccination appointments, determined by their gender. Professor Janet Lord, who is leading the research, said: "It's a major health issue trying to find ways to improve the vaccination response. "We know that immunity goes down with ageing. But we may have found a way to counter that." She said it was a chance finding in about 150 patients that led them to the idea in the first place. "A colleague discovered that vaccine response varies with the time of day. "Men tend to have a better response in the morning, and women in the afternoon. "We're not sure why, but we think it is down to hormones."

Hormone levels in the body change throughout the day in a predictable, cyclical pattern. And the effect of this differs between men and women, the scientists suspect. Prof Lord and her team hope to get a definitive answer by studying at least 300 elderly patients attending for their routine flu vaccinations this winter and next. "We've already made a start and hope to get enough patients on board to be able to see if such a simple, cheap measure of changing appointment times can make all the difference."

BBC News - Morning flu jabs 'work better for men'

 

[zzzz]

I would think diet is more effective than time of day. For myself, I tend to drink a glass of OJ every morning during flu season. The natural vitamin C is very effective in keeping me from getting sick and when I do it tends to be mild and short duration.

 

[geauxtohell]

I've only had 1 in the last 20 years and never had the flu. It appears that the effectiveness is not quite as high as advertised. Put that together with the strains that pop up and they are not in the shot and it is a wonder if they do anything at all. It does look like shooting a person up with a live virus is more effective than a dead virus. I wonder how sick that shot makes you.

The vaccine is not a "live virus". Only the nasal spray is.

Thanks for the read. 60% is still better than 0%. The researchers don't dispute the need for the vaccine, just that we need to tweak it to make it better. This kind of research is helpful.

Michael Osterholm, an infectious disease specialist at the University of Minnesota, and his colleagues found that the most common flu vaccine in the United States is effective for 59 percent of healthy adults, well below the 70 percent to 90 percent level previously reported.

World needs to update its flu vaccines: study | Reuters

A meta-analysis of the 31 studies also showed that a newer type of vaccine that uses a live virus was 83 percent effective in protecting children between six months and seven years old.

However, this type of vaccine, which is made by MedImmune, is not currently recommended as the best treatment for children by the CDC group that decides immunization practices in the United States, the study's authors said.

[/QUOTE]

 

[FurthurBB]

I've only had 1 in the last 20 years and never had the flu. It appears that the effectiveness is not quite as high as advertised. Put that together with the strains that pop up and they are not in the shot and it is a wonder if they do anything at all. It does look like shooting a person up with a live virus is more effective than a dead virus. I wonder how sick that shot makes you.

Michael Osterholm, an infectious disease specialist at the University of Minnesota, and his colleagues found that the most common flu vaccine in the United States is effective for 59 percent of healthy adults, well below the 70 percent to 90 percent level previously reported.

World needs to update its flu vaccines: study | Reuters

A meta-analysis of the 31 studies also showed that a newer type of vaccine that uses a live virus was 83 percent effective in protecting children between six months and seven years old.

However, this type of vaccine, which is made by MedImmune, is not currently recommended as the best treatment for children by the CDC group that decides immunization practices in the United States, the study's authors said.

Anecdotal evidence is not the best thing to go by. I know people who have had flu shots and who haven't that don't get the flu. I just think that flu shots should be for people who are immunocompromised or otherwise in danger from serious injury or death from the flu and people who are around them, but I am overruled. There is a new flu shot that is in the second stage of clinical trials that targets a novel epitope on the surface of the virus that should, if successful, provide life-long protection after a series of three shots. I will get it for myself and my family if it is approved. Other than that I have never had a flu shot and only my oldest daughter ever has either. My girls get sick once every three years, and my son once every 5 years, I never saw the point. My son has actually never had the flu or at least never made any antibodies for any flu strain, it is possible that he was infected with the flu, but his innate immune system took care of it before his adaptive immune system become involved. He joined a study in Montreal a few years back. The funny thing is that of the 300 original participants who claimed they never had the flu or were recommended by their doctors, only 15 did not have any antibodies for influenza and most the rest had has many as the general population. So, thinking you have never had the flu is not the same as never having it. oh, I just wanted to edit to say that the participants also had to have never had a flu shot.

 

[Mad Scientist]

I've only had 1 in the last 20 years and never had the flu.

I haven't had a flu shot in about 25 years or so, got the flu only twice.

 

[waltky]

First bird flu casualty of the season in China...

Bird flu claims first casualty in China
Jan 1, 2012: The Chinese government has confirmed a 39-year-old man's death in southern China due to bird flu, which is showing signs of resurfacing after an 18-month gap.

Authorities had earlier reported that two dead birds had tested positive for the H5N1 avian influenza virus and ordered killing of thousands of birds in Hong Kong.

The official Xinhua news agency reported that the 39-year-old bus driver died of multiple organ failure at Shenzhen in Guangdong Province. He was admitted to a hospital last Sunday after he developed pneumonia. He tested positive for bird flu over the next few days.

The victim had not travelled outside Shenzhen in the past few months. The incident had triggered panic in Shenzhen after reports that he had come in contact with nearly 120 people.

Source

 

[koshergrl]

I would think diet is more effective than time of day. For myself, I tend to drink a glass of OJ every morning during flu season. The natural vitamin C is very effective in keeping me from getting sick and when I do it tends to be mild and short duration.

So you're lucky.

Young children, the elderly, and those with compromised immune systems are at risk of dying from the flu. Vaccinations are not touted as a way to prevent people from contracting the illness, they are touted as a good way to lessen the severity.

H1N1 was an exception because it targeted adults in their prime, and the vaccination that had been developed for that year focused on a different virus, which sometimes happen. It's an educated guessing game. Usually the vaccine that is developed is quite effective, but that doesn't mean people won't still get flu, particularly a different strain than that they have been vaccinated against. And they may still get the flu they've been vaccinated for...but they won't get it so severely.

People who pooh-pooh the deadliness of influenza are living in a plastic bubble and don't have a clue about the disease or how it works, and they are living with a false sense of security. There are very few people who have never had the flu. I suspect you had it, and just didn't know it. You either thought you had a cold, or some other illness, and didn't correctly diagnose yourself.

It's fine to be blase about your own health, but nothing pisses me off faster than people who are blessed with good health who think that because they are they are in a position to advise other people about things like vaccinations. It's great that you've never had the flu. Kindly don't tell people that flu vaccines are unnecessary. Flu was responsible for wiping out huge numbers of people, in this country, not that long ago. Before vaccines.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

Last winter they were saying on the radio that doctors here in the Charlotte area were reporting that half of the people showing up at their offices with the flu had already had the flu vaccine. It's a total scam. I've never had a flu shot in my life and I rarely ever get sick.

 

[koshergrl]

Hello. Did you read my post? JUST BECAUSE YOU HAVEN'T HAD THE FLU DOES NOT MEAN YOU ARE AN AUTHORITY ON IT.

People DO catch the flu, and die from it. Flu shots are not a scam. H1N1 was a strain that was not anticipated, which is why it made so many people sick, including people who had been vaccinated.

But for the most part, flu vaccines will keep you from getting as sick as you would without it. And they save the lives of elderly and young children.

Regardless of whether or not you've had it. Just because you've never had it doesn't mean they're worthless.

And people always kibbitz about them. People also complain about every hospital on the face of the earth. There are always rumors and wives tales circulating. They mean nothing.

If you aren't worried about dying from pnemonia and you aren't in a population that is at risk, by all means don't get the vaccine. But kindly refrain from spreading the idiotic rumors about them. If you can control yourself, that is. Flu epidemics are not funny. I spent some hours closeted with CDC and county health personnel when they were mopping up after H1N1. They were scared out of their wits...and desperately hanging on until the H1N1 vaccines were available. Flu vaccines are not a scam. Those people were not faking it.

 

[Wiseacre]

Wonder if ObamaCare will mandate flu shots. You pay a penalty if you don't get one.

 

[whitehall]

I can't seem to find it but I thought I saw a news feed last week about the CDC manufacturing different flu strains to test their vaccine (or use against enemies?). It sounds like a plot for a doomsday novel like Stephen King's "The Stand" where the military accidently released a flue strain that killed 90% of the world's population. Anyway it's a chilling thought that the future of the world might depend on the folks who ran Fannie May.

 

[koshergrl]

They understand how deadly influenza is. Yet another reason to get vaccinated.

I'm not a huge fan of the CDC, their leader is generally a political drone, but I don't buy into conspiracy theories where our own health professionals are trying to kill us with a fake vaccine just to test the real thing. For one thing, there are much better ways to test them.

And I fear flu epidemics enough to take a chance that the vaccine isn't poison. Everything has a risk attached when it comes to medicine; you take a risk for any surgery, no matter how run of the mill, and vaccines have the potential to be lethal, if there's a bad batch. But the risk of that happening are minute.

 

[waltky]

Mutant bird flu research halted...

Bioterror fears halt research on mutant bird flu
20 January 2012 - A majority of H5N1 human cases have been contracted through contact with live or dead poultry

Scientists who created a more deadly strain of bird flu have temporarily stopped their research amid fears it could be used by bioterrorists. In a letter published in Science and Nature, the teams call for an "international forum" to debate the risks and value of the studies. US authorities last month asked the authors of the research to redact key details in forthcoming publications. A government advisory panel suggested the data could be used by terrorists. Biosecurity experts fear a mutant form of the virus could spark a pandemic deadlier than the 1918-19 Spanish flu outbreak that killed up to 40 million people.

'Right step'

The National Science Advisory Board for Biosecurity (NSABB) recommended key details be omitted from publication of the research, which an sparked international furore. "I would have preferred if this hadn't caused so much controversy, but it has happened and we can't change that," Ron Fouchier, a researcher from Erasmus Medical Center in Rotterdam, told Science Insider. "So I think it's the right step to make." While bird flu is deadly, its reach has been limited because it is not transmissible between humans.

However, the H5N1 flu virus was altered to be passed easily between ferrets, during the joint research by Erasmus University in the Netherlands and the University of Wisconsin-Madison in the US. Two scientific journals want to publish the research - albeit in redacted form - and are trying to work out with the US government how to make the data accessible to "responsible scientists". The World Health Organization said in a December statement that limiting access to the research would harm an agreement between its members. The NSABB is made up of scientists and public health experts, 23 from outside the government, and 18 from within.

'Flatly false'

It cannot stop publication but makes recommendations to researchers. The scientists' letter published on Friday argues that knowledge of more infectious strains before they mutate in nature is valuable for public health. "More research is needed to determine how influenza viruses in nature become human pandemic threats," the statement says, "so that they can be contained before they acquire the ability to transmit from human to human, or so that appropriate countermeasures can be deployed if adaptation to humans occurs."

But some said the pause on research was not enough. One critic of the studies, Richard Ebright, a biologist at Rutgers University, told Science Insider that the letter "includes flatly false statements" making assurances about the safety of H1N1 research labs. Reports say that a meeting debating the research and steps forward could come during a World Health Organization meeting in February.

BBC News - Bioterror fears halt research on mutant bird flu

 

[waltky]

Might explain why some vaccines lose their effectiveness...

Study Shows PFCs Can Reduce Vaccine Effectiveness
January 28, 2012 - A new study finds that children exposed to common industrial chemicals, called perfluorinated compounds or PFCs, have a reduced immune response to vaccines intended to protect them from disease. PFCs are used around the world to make waterproof rain gear and food containers, and are known to pollute drinking water and seafood. PFC contamination could have a significant impact on the effectiveness of global immunization efforts.

When children are vaccinated their immune systems produce antibodies that protect them from debilitating and potentially deadly childhood infections, such as polio, measles, diphtheria and tetanus. The protection is supposed to last a lifetime. But scientists say the effectiveness of these vaccines is severely reduced when children are exposed to high levels of PFCs: “This was quite serious because we could also see some of the children were so low in antibody concentration that they were essentially not protected. They have been vaccinated four times and vaccines had not worked,” said Dr. Phillipe Grandjean of the Harvard School of Public Health.

Grandjean led a team of scientists in a study of children living on the Faroe Islands between Scotland and Iceland. The islanders were chosen as subjects because their diet is mainly seafood, known to have high concentrations of PFCs. The scientists followed a group of more than 500 children who'd been vaccinated against diphtheria and tetanus. But children who showed elevated levels of PFCs in their blood also had very low concentrations of antibodies against these infections. “It was quite a striking fact, one that I would not have anticipated,” said Dr. Peter Hotez, president of the Sabin Vaccine Institute, which promotes vaccine development and delivery around the world.

Hotez said if PFCs do, in fact, interfere with antibodies and immune system functions, then the public health problem is going to be much worse in the urban slums of low- and middle-income countries, where exposure to these industrial chemicals can be much higher. “Even a modest reduction in vaccine coverage and vaccine immune responses could lead to subsequent outbreaks of childhood disease. And there is a risk that we could see recurrences of childhood killers such as diphtheria or pertussis or other childhood diseases now becoming more common in the world’s poorest countries,” said Hotez.

Scientists say PFCs are stable and persistent chemicals that have been in wide use for decades - so much so that everyone probably has detectable levels of the compounds in their body. “We have not done enough in regard to protecting the population against these old compounds, and now we are stuck because we all have them in our bodies and we are all using them,” said Grandjean. Critics note that since the study was done on island residents eating a mostly fish diet, it should have taken into account polyunsaturated fatty acids [PUFAs], which are found in fish and may suppress the immune system. Researchers say there is an urgent need to study the adverse health effects of perfluorinated compounds on larger populations.

Source

 

[waltky]

Polymorphic bacteria can mutate to evade vaccines...

Bacterial disguise evades vaccine
29 January 2012 - Streptococcus pneumoniae bacteria can cause pneumonia and meningitis.

Some bacteria can evade efforts to vaccinate against them by wearing a new disguise, researchers say. A study, published in Nature Genetics, tracked how pneumococcus bacteria responded to the introduction of a vaccine in the US in 2000. Doctors said the evasion would make some vaccines less successful in the long term. An updated pneumococcus vaccine is already in use.

Vaccines train the immune system to attack something unique to an infection. In the case of tetanus, it results in the body making antibodies which target the toxin produced. Dr Rory Bowden, one of the researchers from the University of Oxford, told the BBC: "There are plenty of vaccines out there that look stable and continue to work because they target bacteria or viruses that are not changing." Pneumococcus bacteria, however, comes in more than 90 varieties or serotypes. Each variety looks different to the immune system so would each need separate vaccines.

Immunisation

Infection can result in pneumonia and meningitis. Across the globe, more than 800,000 children under five die as a result each year. A vaccine against more than 90 types would not be possible, but in 2000 the US authorities began immunising against seven of the most common varieties. Cases rapidly dropped. By 2007, there was a sustained 76% drop in cases of septicaemia, pneumonia and meningitis in children under five. However, some bacteria managed to change their outer coat - known as capsule switching - to avoid the immune response.

They did it by collecting pieces of DNA from other pneumococcus bacteria which had died. By analysing bacterial genes, the researchers identified five cases of capsule switching. They said one of the new strains, called P1, "quickly became established spreading from east to west across the United States". It had "become one of the most prevalent" varieties by 2007, the report said. An updated vaccine which protects against 13 types has since been introduced. Dr Bowden said the "holy grail" would be a universal vaccine which would target something common to all types of pneumococcus.

Prof Derrick Crook, from Oxford University Hospitals NHS Trust, said: "Understanding what makes a vaccine successful and what can cause it to fail is important. "Our work suggests that current strategies for developing new vaccines are largely effective but may not have long term effects that are as successful as hoped." Dr Bernard Beall, from the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, added: "The current vaccine strategy of targeting predominant pneumococcal serotypes is extremely effective, however our observations indicate that the organism will continue to adapt to this strategy with some measurable success." The Wellcome Trust's Dr Michael Dunn said: "New technologies allow us to rapidly sequence disease-causing organisms and see how they evolve. This will provide useful lessons for vaccine implementation strategies."

BBC News - Bacterial disguise evades vaccine

See also:

Rapid virus evolution witnessed in lab
Jan. 27,`12 (UPI) -- U.S. researchers say they have observed how a new virus evolves and how diseases can quickly gain dangerous mutations.

Scientists at Michigan State University showed for the first time how a virus called "Lambda" evolved to find a new way to attack host cells, a change accomplished in just four mutation steps. While Lambda isn't dangerous to humans, the research demonstrated how viruses evolve complex and potentially deadly new traits, researcher Justin Meyer said in an MSU release Thursday. "We were surprised at first to see Lambda evolve this new function, this ability to attack and enter the cell through a new receptor -- and it happened so fast," Meyer said. "But when we re-ran the evolution experiment, we saw the same thing happen over and over."

This study follows recent news that scientists in the United States and the Netherlands produced a deadly version of bird flu just five mutations away from becoming transmissible between humans. While it's highly unlikely the bird flu virus could naturally obtain all of the beneficial mutations all at once, it might evolve sequentially, gaining benefits one by one, Meyer said.

When the genomes of the adaptable Lambda virus were sequenced, they always had four mutations in common, he said. "In other words, natural selection promoted the virus' evolution because the mutations helped them use both their old and new attacks," Meyer said. "The finding raises questions of whether the five bird flu mutations may also have multiple functions, and could they evolve naturally?"

Read more: http://www.upi.com/Science_News/201...ssed-in-lab/UPI-74601327704205/#ixzz1kueUx2UY

 

[waltky]

Granny says, "If ya's pregnant, get yer flu shot an' protect dat baby too...

Mom's Flu Vaccination Boosts Baby Birth Weight
February 24, 2012 - Benefits for infant can last a lifetime

Pregnant women who get vaccinated against influenza are less likely to have low birth weight babies, according to a study conducted in Bangladesh. In this study, 340 pregnant women were randomly assigned to get either a flu vaccination or another vaccine. If the period after vaccination did not include the flu season, the newborn babies weighed about the same, regardless of which vaccines their mothers received.

But study author Mark Steinhoff of the Cincinnati, Ohio, Children's Hospital says that during influenza season, the women who got the flu vaccine came down with the flu less than half as often as the women who got the other vaccine, and their babies were born at a healthier weight. "If the mother got the vaccine and was exposed to influenza, the babies weighted 200 grams more - 3.1 kilos versus 2.9 kilos. And that is a substantial increase in birth weights," says Steinhoff, noting that it is well established that lower birth weights can have a lifetime impact.

"If there is a decreased birth weight in an otherwise healthy baby, the more it is decreased, the more likely that infant, as an adult, is likely to have conditions such as obesity, diabetes, and heart disease." Steinhoff says he and his colleagues were the first to identify this link between flu vaccination and birth weight, but four other studies have since come up with the same findings. Still, exactly why a mother sick with flu should have a smaller baby is unclear.

"But in general terms, if the pregnant woman is sick with flu - that's an illness of a week, maybe eight days, 10 days - the baby doesn't grow as well during that time and may end up being born slightly less well-nourished." Steinhoff stresses that the influenza vaccine is safe for mother and baby, and is one of the few vaccines that a pregnant woman can take that will protect both her and her baby.

Source

 

[konradv]

I've only had 1 in the last 20 years and never had the flu. It appears that the effectiveness is not quite as high as advertised.

Interesting juxtaposition of statements, where one has nothing to do with the other. Kinda makes you look like a loon right off the bat! Just sayin', you could just give us info without the bias. Now I'm wondering if whoever wrote the article is just as loony. What a way to step on your message!

BTW, these kinds of articles can keep people, especially the elderly or those with small children, from getting shots. It's only a "not as effective as stated" message, not an "it's bad for you" message, which makes the whole notion that you really might not need it, highly irreponsible.

 

[Douger]

Wonder if ObamaCare will mandate flu shots. You pay a penalty if you don't get one.

It's on the list, believe that.
I had the flu in 1968. Not fun.