Five Founding Fathers Who Would Be Rejected by the Religious Right Today

[Billy_Kinetta]

Here is a good read that I came upon that I want to share with all, but especially those who insist that the United States was founded as a Christian Nation. I am hard pressed to imagine how that view can be reconciled with the information in this piece. All opinions are welcome

Here are 5 founding fathers whose skepticism about Christianity would make them unelectable today

Error | US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum ( selected excerpts)

To hear the Religious Right tell it, men like George Washington, John Adams, Thomas Jefferson and James Madison were 18th-century versions of Jerry Falwell in powdered wigs and stockings. Nothing could be further from the truth.

1. George Washington. The father of our country was nominally an Anglican but seemed more at home with Deism. The language of the Deists sounds odd to today’s ears because it’s a theological system of thought that has fallen out of favor. Deists believed in God but didn’t necessarily see him as active in human affairs. The god of the Deists was a god of first cause. He set things in motion and then stepped back.

2. John Adams. The man who followed Washington in office was a Unitarian, although he was raised a Congregationalist and never officially left that church. Adams rejected belief in the Trinity and the divinity of Jesus, core concepts of Christian dogma. In his personal writings, Adams makes it clear that he considered some Christian dogma to be incomprehensible.

As president, Adams signed the famous Treaty of Tripoli, which boldly stated, “[T]he government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion….”

3. Thomas Jefferson. It’s almost impossible to define Jefferson’s subtle religious views in a few words. As he once put it, “I am a sect by myself, as far as I know.” But one thing is clear: His skepticism of traditional Christianity is well established. Our third president did not believe in the Trinity, the virgin birth, the divinity of Jesus, the resurrection, original sin and other core Christian doctrines. He was hostile to many conservative Christian clerics, whom he believed had perverted the teachings of that faith.

Jefferson once famously observed to Adams, “And the day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter.”

4. James Madison. Jefferson’s close ally would be similarly unelectable today. Madison is perhaps the most enigmatic of all the founders when it comes to religion. To this day, scholars still debate his religious views.

Madison was perhaps the strictest church-state separationist among the founders, taking stands that make the ACLU look like a bunch of pikers. He opposed government-paid chaplains in Congress and in the military. As president, Madison rejected a proposed census because it involved counting people by profession. For the government to count the clergy, Madison said, would violate the First Amendment.

5. Thomas Paine. Paine never held elective office, but he played an important role as a pamphleteer whose stirring words helped rally Americans to independence. Washington ordered that Paine’s pamphlet “The American Crisis” be read aloud to the Continental Army as a morale booster on Dec. 23, 1776. “Common Sense” was similarly popular with the people. These seminal documents were crucial to winning over the public to the side of independence.

So Paine’s a hero, right? He was also a radical Deist whose later work, The Age of Reason, still infuriates fundamentalists.

There you have it folks!!

Actually that's not too bad considering the progressive left would have placed most of the Founding Fathers up against the wall and killed them.

Perhaps you would like to explain that . That is a pretty rash assertion. I would take them all over almost any one the Republicans who are in power now or seeking power

Ri-iiiight.

Back then, you would have been too busy defending King George.

These days, they would to a man count Progressives as traitors.

Tories were the conservatives. It's so funny watching you trumpanzees try to twist your heritage away from yourselves.

Liberal in that time had a meaning alien to today's "liberals".

 

[Winston]

I don’t think Reagan clinton and Obama’s were atheists.

I agree.....and neither is Trump. ...

Trump doesn’t believe in anything except enriching himself. He doesn’t believe in G-d.

The founders were deists. Trump is a meist, the only person he worships is himself.

 

[JakeStarkey]

The Founders at the convention were overwhelmingly Christian, along with a polytheist, maybe as many as three deists, and maybe an atheist.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

…get the f••• off my thread.

By what authority do you presume to tell anyone to get off of this or any other thread on this forum? You're not a moderator here, an you have no more authority than anyone else.

 

[ding]

Here is a good read that I came upon that I want to share with all, but especially those who insist that the United States was founded as a Christian Nation. I am hard pressed to imagine how that view can be reconciled with the information in this piece. All opinions are welcome

Here are 5 founding fathers whose skepticism about Christianity would make them unelectable today

Error | US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum ( selected excerpts)

To hear the Religious Right tell it, men like George Washington, John Adams, Thomas Jefferson and James Madison were 18th-century versions of Jerry Falwell in powdered wigs and stockings. Nothing could be further from the truth.

1. George Washington. The father of our country was nominally an Anglican but seemed more at home with Deism. The language of the Deists sounds odd to today’s ears because it’s a theological system of thought that has fallen out of favor. Deists believed in God but didn’t necessarily see him as active in human affairs. The god of the Deists was a god of first cause. He set things in motion and then stepped back.

2. John Adams. The man who followed Washington in office was a Unitarian, although he was raised a Congregationalist and never officially left that church. Adams rejected belief in the Trinity and the divinity of Jesus, core concepts of Christian dogma. In his personal writings, Adams makes it clear that he considered some Christian dogma to be incomprehensible.

As president, Adams signed the famous Treaty of Tripoli, which boldly stated, “[T]he government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion….”

3. Thomas Jefferson. It’s almost impossible to define Jefferson’s subtle religious views in a few words. As he once put it, “I am a sect by myself, as far as I know.” But one thing is clear: His skepticism of traditional Christianity is well established. Our third president did not believe in the Trinity, the virgin birth, the divinity of Jesus, the resurrection, original sin and other core Christian doctrines. He was hostile to many conservative Christian clerics, whom he believed had perverted the teachings of that faith.

Jefferson once famously observed to Adams, “And the day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter.”

4. James Madison. Jefferson’s close ally would be similarly unelectable today. Madison is perhaps the most enigmatic of all the founders when it comes to religion. To this day, scholars still debate his religious views.

Madison was perhaps the strictest church-state separationist among the founders, taking stands that make the ACLU look like a bunch of pikers. He opposed government-paid chaplains in Congress and in the military. As president, Madison rejected a proposed census because it involved counting people by profession. For the government to count the clergy, Madison said, would violate the First Amendment.

5. Thomas Paine. Paine never held elective office, but he played an important role as a pamphleteer whose stirring words helped rally Americans to independence. Washington ordered that Paine’s pamphlet “The American Crisis” be read aloud to the Continental Army as a morale booster on Dec. 23, 1776. “Common Sense” was similarly popular with the people. These seminal documents were crucial to winning over the public to the side of independence.

So Paine’s a hero, right? He was also a radical Deist whose later work, The Age of Reason, still infuriates fundamentalists.

There you have it folks!!

And each and every one believed that liberty and freedom was dependent upon morality and virtue and in the Natural Law.

 

[ding]

Five Founding Fathers who would have approved of militant atheism:

1. Karl Marx
2. Vladimir Lenin
3. Joseph Stalin
4. Mao Tse Tung
5. Pol Pot

 

[norwegen]

Thomas Paine was a radical Deist? Radical? Hardly, although a Deist in some measure, when the urge struck. And not much of a founder, even, save for his urging the Americans to separate from Paine's own country. Ben Franklin dabbled in Deism briefly before abandoning it. Deism really had no impact on any of the others. Contrary to leftist indoctrination, Deism just didn't factor into the American character as they would have us believe.

Christians signed the Declaration of Independence, including ordained minister John Witherspoon. Not Muslims, not professed atheists, not Deists, not anyone of another faith or vocation. Christianity was unequivocally a part of the American character in the 18th century.

 

[Wyatt earp]

Here is a good read that I came upon that I want to share with all, but especially those who insist that the United States was founded as a Christian Nation. I am hard pressed to imagine how that view can be reconciled with the information in this piece. All opinions are welcome

Here are 5 founding fathers whose skepticism about Christianity would make them unelectable today

Error | US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum ( selected excerpts)

To hear the Religious Right tell it, men like George Washington, John Adams, Thomas Jefferson and James Madison were 18th-century versions of Jerry Falwell in powdered wigs and stockings. Nothing could be further from the truth.

1. George Washington. The father of our country was nominally an Anglican but seemed more at home with Deism. The language of the Deists sounds odd to today’s ears because it’s a theological system of thought that has fallen out of favor. Deists believed in God but didn’t necessarily see him as active in human affairs. The god of the Deists was a god of first cause. He set things in motion and then stepped back.

2. John Adams. The man who followed Washington in office was a Unitarian, although he was raised a Congregationalist and never officially left that church. Adams rejected belief in the Trinity and the divinity of Jesus, core concepts of Christian dogma. In his personal writings, Adams makes it clear that he considered some Christian dogma to be incomprehensible.

As president, Adams signed the famous Treaty of Tripoli, which boldly stated, “[T]he government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion….”

3. Thomas Jefferson. It’s almost impossible to define Jefferson’s subtle religious views in a few words. As he once put it, “I am a sect by myself, as far as I know.” But one thing is clear: His skepticism of traditional Christianity is well established. Our third president did not believe in the Trinity, the virgin birth, the divinity of Jesus, the resurrection, original sin and other core Christian doctrines. He was hostile to many conservative Christian clerics, whom he believed had perverted the teachings of that faith.

Jefferson once famously observed to Adams, “And the day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter.”

4. James Madison. Jefferson’s close ally would be similarly unelectable today. Madison is perhaps the most enigmatic of all the founders when it comes to religion. To this day, scholars still debate his religious views.

Madison was perhaps the strictest church-state separationist among the founders, taking stands that make the ACLU look like a bunch of pikers. He opposed government-paid chaplains in Congress and in the military. As president, Madison rejected a proposed census because it involved counting people by profession. For the government to count the clergy, Madison said, would violate the First Amendment.

5. Thomas Paine. Paine never held elective office, but he played an important role as a pamphleteer whose stirring words helped rally Americans to independence. Washington ordered that Paine’s pamphlet “The American Crisis” be read aloud to the Continental Army as a morale booster on Dec. 23, 1776. “Common Sense” was similarly popular with the people. These seminal documents were crucial to winning over the public to the side of independence.

So Paine’s a hero, right? He was also a radical Deist whose later work, The Age of Reason, still infuriates fundamentalists.

There you have it folks!!

Actually that's not too bad considering the progressive left would have placed most of the Founding Fathers up against the wall and killed them.

Actually I find many more Democrats (as you call them progressives) more like Jesus of the bible (NT) than the religious right.

The laugh of the year.

 

[Wyatt earp]

I don’t think Reagan clinton and Obama’s were atheists.

I agree.....and neither is Trump. ...

Trump doesn’t believe in anything except enriching himself. He doesn’t believe in G-d.

That's not true, once again the first president since I was born who tried to keep all his campaign promises ..

 

[jillian]

I don’t think Reagan clinton and Obama’s were atheists.

I agree.....and neither is Trump. ...

Trump doesn’t believe in anything except enriching himself. He doesn’t believe in G-d.

That's not true, once again the first president since I was born who tried to keep all his campaign promises ..

That’s si funny.

How is that wall going?

 

[Wyatt earp]

I don’t think Reagan clinton and Obama’s were atheists.

I agree.....and neither is Trump. ...

Trump doesn’t believe in anything except enriching himself. He doesn’t believe in G-d.

That's not true, once again the first president since I was born who tried to keep all his campaign promises ..

That’s si funny.

Well he has and did some of them, just because you don't like what he did......

 

[sparky]

Regardless of their personal beliefs, our FF's escaped from a theocracy, and wrote a constitution explicitly distancing it from influence.

A basic fundamental American religmo's have consitsteny violated ,for their own theocratic gains

~S~

 

[ding]

Regardless of their personal beliefs, our FF's escaped from a theocracy, and wrote a constitution explicitly distancing it from influence.

A basic fundamental American religmo's have consitsteny violated ,for their own theocratic gains

~S~

You people don't really understand what a theocracy is or that the 1st Amendment allowed for state established religions, none of which were actual theocracies.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

The Founders at the convention were overwhelmingly Christian, along with a polytheist, maybe as many as three deists, and maybe an atheist.

Jake? Welcome back!

 

[rightwinger]

Here is a good read that I came upon that I want to share with all, but especially those who insist that the United States was founded as a Christian Nation. I am hard pressed to imagine how that view can be reconciled with the information in this piece. All opinions are welcome

Here are 5 founding fathers whose skepticism about Christianity would make them unelectable today

Error | US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum ( selected excerpts)

To hear the Religious Right tell it, men like George Washington, John Adams, Thomas Jefferson and James Madison were 18th-century versions of Jerry Falwell in powdered wigs and stockings. Nothing could be further from the truth.

1. George Washington. The father of our country was nominally an Anglican but seemed more at home with Deism. The language of the Deists sounds odd to today’s ears because it’s a theological system of thought that has fallen out of favor. Deists believed in God but didn’t necessarily see him as active in human affairs. The god of the Deists was a god of first cause. He set things in motion and then stepped back.

2. John Adams. The man who followed Washington in office was a Unitarian, although he was raised a Congregationalist and never officially left that church. Adams rejected belief in the Trinity and the divinity of Jesus, core concepts of Christian dogma. In his personal writings, Adams makes it clear that he considered some Christian dogma to be incomprehensible.

As president, Adams signed the famous Treaty of Tripoli, which boldly stated, “[T]he government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion….”

3. Thomas Jefferson. It’s almost impossible to define Jefferson’s subtle religious views in a few words. As he once put it, “I am a sect by myself, as far as I know.” But one thing is clear: His skepticism of traditional Christianity is well established. Our third president did not believe in the Trinity, the virgin birth, the divinity of Jesus, the resurrection, original sin and other core Christian doctrines. He was hostile to many conservative Christian clerics, whom he believed had perverted the teachings of that faith.

Jefferson once famously observed to Adams, “And the day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter.”

4. James Madison. Jefferson’s close ally would be similarly unelectable today. Madison is perhaps the most enigmatic of all the founders when it comes to religion. To this day, scholars still debate his religious views.

Madison was perhaps the strictest church-state separationist among the founders, taking stands that make the ACLU look like a bunch of pikers. He opposed government-paid chaplains in Congress and in the military. As president, Madison rejected a proposed census because it involved counting people by profession. For the government to count the clergy, Madison said, would violate the First Amendment.

5. Thomas Paine. Paine never held elective office, but he played an important role as a pamphleteer whose stirring words helped rally Americans to independence. Washington ordered that Paine’s pamphlet “The American Crisis” be read aloud to the Continental Army as a morale booster on Dec. 23, 1776. “Common Sense” was similarly popular with the people. These seminal documents were crucial to winning over the public to the side of independence.

So Paine’s a hero, right? He was also a radical Deist whose later work, The Age of Reason, still infuriates fundamentalists.

There you have it folks!!

Actually that's not too bad considering the progressive left would have placed most of the Founding Fathers up against the wall and killed them.

Actually I find many more Democrats (as you call them progressives) more like Jesus of the bible (NT) than the religious right.

I don't remember Jesus telling Romans to pay thier "fair share " can you give me one instance of Jesus sounding like a state loving Progressive

Jesus never advocated tax the poor

 

[sparky]

You people don't really understand what a theocracy is or that the 1st Amendment allowed for state established religions, none of which were actual theocracies.

We ended state religion(s) here ding>>>
Religion in the Original 13 Colonies - Under God in the Pledge - ProCon.org

Although some wish it back....
North Carolina's Proposed State Religion Isn't as Unprecedented as It Sounds

but for the most part we are a secular nation

~S~

 

[Billy_Kinetta]

Here is a good read that I came upon that I want to share with all, but especially those who insist that the United States was founded as a Christian Nation. I am hard pressed to imagine how that view can be reconciled with the information in this piece. All opinions are welcome

Here are 5 founding fathers whose skepticism about Christianity would make them unelectable today

Error | US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum ( selected excerpts)

To hear the Religious Right tell it, men like George Washington, John Adams, Thomas Jefferson and James Madison were 18th-century versions of Jerry Falwell in powdered wigs and stockings. Nothing could be further from the truth.

1. George Washington. The father of our country was nominally an Anglican but seemed more at home with Deism. The language of the Deists sounds odd to today’s ears because it’s a theological system of thought that has fallen out of favor. Deists believed in God but didn’t necessarily see him as active in human affairs. The god of the Deists was a god of first cause. He set things in motion and then stepped back.

2. John Adams. The man who followed Washington in office was a Unitarian, although he was raised a Congregationalist and never officially left that church. Adams rejected belief in the Trinity and the divinity of Jesus, core concepts of Christian dogma. In his personal writings, Adams makes it clear that he considered some Christian dogma to be incomprehensible.

As president, Adams signed the famous Treaty of Tripoli, which boldly stated, “[T]he government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion….”

3. Thomas Jefferson. It’s almost impossible to define Jefferson’s subtle religious views in a few words. As he once put it, “I am a sect by myself, as far as I know.” But one thing is clear: His skepticism of traditional Christianity is well established. Our third president did not believe in the Trinity, the virgin birth, the divinity of Jesus, the resurrection, original sin and other core Christian doctrines. He was hostile to many conservative Christian clerics, whom he believed had perverted the teachings of that faith.

Jefferson once famously observed to Adams, “And the day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter.”

4. James Madison. Jefferson’s close ally would be similarly unelectable today. Madison is perhaps the most enigmatic of all the founders when it comes to religion. To this day, scholars still debate his religious views.

Madison was perhaps the strictest church-state separationist among the founders, taking stands that make the ACLU look like a bunch of pikers. He opposed government-paid chaplains in Congress and in the military. As president, Madison rejected a proposed census because it involved counting people by profession. For the government to count the clergy, Madison said, would violate the First Amendment.

5. Thomas Paine. Paine never held elective office, but he played an important role as a pamphleteer whose stirring words helped rally Americans to independence. Washington ordered that Paine’s pamphlet “The American Crisis” be read aloud to the Continental Army as a morale booster on Dec. 23, 1776. “Common Sense” was similarly popular with the people. These seminal documents were crucial to winning over the public to the side of independence.

So Paine’s a hero, right? He was also a radical Deist whose later work, The Age of Reason, still infuriates fundamentalists.

There you have it folks!!

Actually that's not too bad considering the progressive left would have placed most of the Founding Fathers up against the wall and killed them.

Actually I find many more Democrats (as you call them progressives) more like Jesus of the bible (NT) than the religious right.

I don't remember Jesus telling Romans to pay thier "fair share " can you give me one instance of Jesus sounding like a state loving Progressive

Jesus never advocated tax the poor

Jesus never advocated taxing anyone.

 

[Penelope]

Here is a good read that I came upon that I want to share with all, but especially those who insist that the United States was founded as a Christian Nation. I am hard pressed to imagine how that view can be reconciled with the information in this piece. All opinions are welcome

Here are 5 founding fathers whose skepticism about Christianity would make them unelectable today

Error | US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum ( selected excerpts)

To hear the Religious Right tell it, men like George Washington, John Adams, Thomas Jefferson and James Madison were 18th-century versions of Jerry Falwell in powdered wigs and stockings. Nothing could be further from the truth.

1. George Washington. The father of our country was nominally an Anglican but seemed more at home with Deism. The language of the Deists sounds odd to today’s ears because it’s a theological system of thought that has fallen out of favor. Deists believed in God but didn’t necessarily see him as active in human affairs. The god of the Deists was a god of first cause. He set things in motion and then stepped back.

2. John Adams. The man who followed Washington in office was a Unitarian, although he was raised a Congregationalist and never officially left that church. Adams rejected belief in the Trinity and the divinity of Jesus, core concepts of Christian dogma. In his personal writings, Adams makes it clear that he considered some Christian dogma to be incomprehensible.

As president, Adams signed the famous Treaty of Tripoli, which boldly stated, “[T]he government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion….”

3. Thomas Jefferson. It’s almost impossible to define Jefferson’s subtle religious views in a few words. As he once put it, “I am a sect by myself, as far as I know.” But one thing is clear: His skepticism of traditional Christianity is well established. Our third president did not believe in the Trinity, the virgin birth, the divinity of Jesus, the resurrection, original sin and other core Christian doctrines. He was hostile to many conservative Christian clerics, whom he believed had perverted the teachings of that faith.

Jefferson once famously observed to Adams, “And the day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter.”

4. James Madison. Jefferson’s close ally would be similarly unelectable today. Madison is perhaps the most enigmatic of all the founders when it comes to religion. To this day, scholars still debate his religious views.

Madison was perhaps the strictest church-state separationist among the founders, taking stands that make the ACLU look like a bunch of pikers. He opposed government-paid chaplains in Congress and in the military. As president, Madison rejected a proposed census because it involved counting people by profession. For the government to count the clergy, Madison said, would violate the First Amendment.

5. Thomas Paine. Paine never held elective office, but he played an important role as a pamphleteer whose stirring words helped rally Americans to independence. Washington ordered that Paine’s pamphlet “The American Crisis” be read aloud to the Continental Army as a morale booster on Dec. 23, 1776. “Common Sense” was similarly popular with the people. These seminal documents were crucial to winning over the public to the side of independence.

So Paine’s a hero, right? He was also a radical Deist whose later work, The Age of Reason, still infuriates fundamentalists.

There you have it folks!!

Actually that's not too bad considering the progressive left would have placed most of the Founding Fathers up against the wall and killed them.

Actually I find many more Democrats (as you call them progressives) more like Jesus of the bible (NT) than the religious right.

I don't remember Jesus telling Romans to pay thier "fair share " can you give me one instance of Jesus sounding like a state loving Progressive

He stripped naked and washed the feet of the apostles, he fed 5000, he said the poor woman paid more tax than the rich, he said to go an extra mile, he healed on Sunday, and

Luke 14:13-23 New International Version (NIV)
13 But when you give a banquet, invite the poor, the crippled, the lame, the blind, and you will be blessed. Although they cannot repay you, you will be repaid at the resurrection of the righteous.”

I could go on but you get the message I'm sure.

 

[Penelope]

Regardless of their personal beliefs, our FF's escaped from a theocracy, and wrote a constitution explicitly distancing it from influence.

A basic fundamental American religmo's have consitsteny violated ,for their own theocratic gains

~S~

You people don't really understand what a theocracy is or that the 1st Amendment allowed for state established religions, none of which were actual theocracies.

No they didn't allow for a state to establish one religion.

 

[rightwinger]

Here is a good read that I came upon that I want to share with all, but especially those who insist that the United States was founded as a Christian Nation. I am hard pressed to imagine how that view can be reconciled with the information in this piece. All opinions are welcome

Here are 5 founding fathers whose skepticism about Christianity would make them unelectable today

Error | US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum ( selected excerpts)

To hear the Religious Right tell it, men like George Washington, John Adams, Thomas Jefferson and James Madison were 18th-century versions of Jerry Falwell in powdered wigs and stockings. Nothing could be further from the truth.


There you have it folks!!

Actually that's not too bad considering the progressive left would have placed most of the Founding Fathers up against the wall and killed them.

Actually I find many more Democrats (as you call them progressives) more like Jesus of the bible (NT) than the religious right.

I don't remember Jesus telling Romans to pay thier "fair share " can you give me one instance of Jesus sounding like a state loving Progressive

Jesus never advocated tax the poor

Jesus never advocated taxing anyone.

He understood the need for government