Fight the good fight. It is worth it.

[Foxfyre]

Okay, it's all over but the gloating, weeping, and post mortems. The Romney supporters lost the contest. The Obama supporters won. And I'm not sure where that leaves everybody else--feeling self righteous? Non commital? Don't care? Buyer's remorse?

But one fact remains. The popular vote went slightly to Obama in the head to head matchup, but when you add in the 'other parties' votes, he did not get a clear mandate from a majority of the people. But he won. And that is that for now.

But the fact is that even though Obama won--and this would have been true of Romney had he won--the battle is ended but not the war. We remain a widely divided country with one half pulling one way and the other half pulling another way on a lot of issue.

But I believe the vast majority of us share some common ground.

1. We love America.
2. We want what is best for our people.
3. We want responsible, effective government and prosperity for all.
4. We value our freedoms and do not compromise these lightly.
5. We know in our hearts things don't always have to be the way they are.
6. We will fight for what is right when we strongly believe.

So now is not the time to throw in the towel. Now is not the time for either gloating or tucking tails and slinking away. America has been through many many tough times from depression, recession, drought/famine, foreign wars, civil war and has expended much precious blood and treasure to be the nation we have been and can be again. And Americans have proved to be their toughest in the toughest times.

Let's find what common ground there is to be found, but stick to our best principles and continue to fightfor them. If we don't, they weren't worth having in the first place.

 

[Foxfyre]

And think about this folks. Nothing much has changed since yesterday. Obama is in the White House. The Senate is controlled by Democrats and the House is controlled by Republicans. Nobody has changed their minds about much of anything. . . .yet.

In short we are no worse off than we were before. . . .yet. And we honestly don't know if things would have been better.

But we have to start somewhere. USMB provides a broad cross section of perspectives, convictions, hopes, dreams, concepts. If we on USMB can have a conversation about what is really important and if we can agree on holding those we elect accountable for what they do, then there is hope for America everywhere.

 

[HenryFortune]

if we can agree on holding those we elect accountable for what they do, then there is hope for America everywhere.

To me, this is our biggest problem. Personally, I don't think it matters who's in the White House, or who we elect to Congress, if all we're going to get is more of the same: professional politicians who represent the highest corporate and/or banking industry bidder and not the majority of citizens who voted for them. Nothing is going to get better until we get our political system out of the hands of Wall Street.

 

[Foxfyre]

if we can agree on holding those we elect accountable for what they do, then there is hope for America everywhere.

To me, this is our biggest problem. Personally, I don't think it matters who's in the White House, or who we elect to Congress, if all we're going to get is more of the same: professional politicians who represent the highest corporate and/or banking industry bidder and not the majority of citizens who voted for them. Nothing is going to get better until we get our political system out of the hands of Wall Street.

See? We already agree on something.

I honestly hoped Romney would have been different. He has demonstrated for some time now that he has all the money he needs or wants and that could suggest that he could not be bought. But who knows how he would have governed? We certainly did not get a President who governed as Obama campaigned.

But ultimately we need to agree on what is most important to most of us and demand that from our elected leaders. As long as partisanship trumps common sense, we are screwed.

 

[WillowTree]

And think about this folks. Nothing much has changed since yesterday. Obama is in the White House. The Senate is controlled by Democrats and the House is controlled by Republicans. Nobody has changed their minds about much of anything. . . .yet.

In short we are no worse off than we were before. . . .yet. And we honestly don't know if things would have been better.

But we have to start somewhere. USMB provides a broad cross section of perspectives, convictions, hopes, dreams, concepts. If we on USMB can have a conversation about what is really important and if we can agree on holding those we elect accountable for what they do, then there is hope for America everywhere.

Are you out of your friggin mind? When has the left EVAH held obummer accountable for any damn thing? Name one! Go ahead I double dog dare ya.

 

[g5000]

If Obama's re-election does not snap the right wing back to sanity I shudder to think what it will take. If it has to get worse than Obama, we are in deeper shit than I thought.

Perhaps a good place to start for people who have deluded themselves into believing they are conservatives is to turn off Fox News, stop reading the Daily Caller, and take a critical thinking class or two.


Here is something to think about: If you don't learn from your mistakes and bad decisions, you WILL get a chance to learn again!

You've already had two chances. Why wait for a third?


.

 

[Immanuel]

if we can agree on holding those we elect accountable for what they do, then there is hope for America everywhere.

To me, this is our biggest problem. Personally, I don't think it matters who's in the White House, or who we elect to Congress, if all we're going to get is more of the same: professional politicians who represent the highest corporate and/or banking industry bidder and not the majority of citizens who voted for them. Nothing is going to get better until we get our political system out of the hands of Wall Street.

The only thing I disagree with here is"Wall Street". When you use that phrase it limits who you are talking about. K Street is also a major player in the division of America and all the rich SOBs whether investment bankers or not.

Immie

 

[Caroljo]

I think the biggest fight is getting ALL of us to agree and talk. We are all soooo divided in this country. So many can't even imagine agreeing with the other side on anything.

We need to start working toward what's best for all of us. But can that happen? The last few months we spent screaming, cussing, putting down other Americans because we don't think the same way. Many, both sides, voted Party instead of People.

One of the biggest problems i see is some people will not admit when they're wrong. They won't use their own brains and study a problem and see both sides and make their own decision. They wait for some news person to tell them how to think. They'll suck up lies without really looking into it and will never admit if they screwed up.

Hell, I'd like to hear Obama say ONE TIME "I was wrong", or "I made the wrong decision"...SOMETHING! I have no respect for anyone that knows they're wrong and won't admit to it, or throws someone else under the bus to make himself look good. He is no "Honest" Abe like he thinks he is. This president has divided this country more than any other. I can't believe that people don't see this.

 

[Foxfyre]

I think the biggest fight is getting ALL of us to agree and talk. We are all soooo divided in this country. So many can't even imagine agreeing with the other side on anything.

We need to start working toward what's best for all of us. But can that happen? The last few months we spent screaming, cussing, putting down other Americans because we don't think the same way. Many, both sides, voted Party instead of People.

One of the biggest problems i see is some people will not admit when they're wrong. They won't use their own brains and study a problem and see both sides and make their own decision. They wait for some news person to tell them how to think. They'll suck up lies without really looking into it and will never admit if they screwed up.

Hell, I'd like to hear Obama say ONE TIME "I was wrong", or "I made the wrong decision"...SOMETHING! I have no respect for anyone that knows they're wrong and won't admit to it, or throws someone else under the bus to make himself look good. He is no "Honest" Abe like he thinks he is. This president has divided this country more than any other. I can't believe that people don't see this.

Yes, finding--or admitting--common ground is the hardest part. And give up the assigned talking points that G5000 put in his post. Willow is right that nobody on the left has held Obama accountable for anything and that also has to stop somewhere before anything will improve. The same goes for those on the right regarding their elected leaders. And we have to learn to stop accusing others of ridiculous things, making mountains out of molehills, and blowing unimportant things up into gigantic issues.

Obama will stop being divisive when his base demands that he stop being divisive. It is as simple as that. Even if he is not so inclined, those in Congress want to be re-elected and they ARE responsive to the will of the people when the people make that known. And THEY will insist that their President behave accordingly or they will render him impotent.

But if we here cannot find some bipartisanship in what is important to us, we give no reason for our elected leaders to find any bipartisanship either. It requires being honest, looking at real facts and figures instead of assigned propaganda, and a willingness to compromise when possible.

 

[konradv]

All you have to remember is, it's only four years and Obama isn't really a communist or a dictator. Go off the deep end and you're guaranteeing Republicans won't be taken seriously again for a long, long time.

 

[Foxfyre]

All you have to remember is, it's only four years and Obama isn't really a communist or a dictator. Go off the deep end and you're guaranteeing Republicans won't be taken seriously again for a long, long time.

So far Obama has not shown us much that he is not a dictator and he has not given up his soft Marxist rhetoric. When he tells the Republicans that he won and therefore doesn't have to agree with them and/or tells them they can come along but they have to sit in back, that is not the words of a bipartisan negotiator or compromiser or one who wishes to find common ground to move things along.

And at times the Republicans have been just as intractable.

The bottom line is often in where our deepfelt principles cannot allow us to compromise. But we start at that bottom line and don't even try to find any common ground.

For instance neither Democrats or Republicans would see ending Social Security and cutting off everybody now receiving it as something that could even be considered, let alone compromised. If the Democrats refuse to consider reform of the program as is, the Republicans accuse them of worshipping and protecting the nanny state. If Republicans point out that the program cannot be sustained indefinitely as it is, Democrats accuse them of wanting to push Granny off the cliff. And the discussion then invariably dissolves into a food fight or pissing match that only intensifies the division and partisanship.

Somewhere there must be a way to address the concerns of both in a way that the program can be saved while addressing the most important goals of the other.

Is that so difficult because one side is determined to prevail over the other? Or is it because we have lost the ability to debate and discuss civilly?

 

[Foxfyre]

Another example is that the Senate Republicans blocked a bill that would have required employers to PROVE that they paid a woman less because of experience or qualifications or productivity rather than due to gender. The Republicans maintained that the requirement was impossible to meet and would serve to line deep pockets of lawyers in endless litigation and would result in employers being far less likely to hire women in the first place.

The Democrats and most of the media portrayed it that the Republicans refused to pay women equally with men.....it was part of the so-called 'war on women'. Without the MSM on their side, the Republicans could not counter it with their true motives which was to protect both business owners and women's jobs.

It is things like this that need to be in the national discourse and discussed honestly instead of being used to dishonestly demonize a group.

 

[HenryFortune]

if we can agree on holding those we elect accountable for what they do, then there is hope for America everywhere.

To me, this is our biggest problem. Personally, I don't think it matters who's in the White House, or who we elect to Congress, if all we're going to get is more of the same: professional politicians who represent the highest corporate and/or banking industry bidder and not the majority of citizens who voted for them. Nothing is going to get better until we get our political system out of the hands of Wall Street.

The only thing I disagree with here is"Wall Street". When you use that phrase it limits who you are talking about. K Street is also a major player in the division of America and all the rich SOBs whether investment bankers or not.

Immie

Right, and who do you think owns and operates K Street?

 

[whitehall]

Can the cliches will you?

 

[HenryFortune]

Somewhere there must be a way to address the concerns of both in a way that the program can be saved while addressing the most important goals of the other.

Is that so difficult because one side is determined to prevail over the other? Or is it because we have lost the ability to debate and discuss civilly?

I think it's both. The first one led to the second one.

 

[HenryFortune]

Can the cliches will you?

It might be a cliche but it's true nonetheless, and publicly admitted by at least one politician:

"The banks—hard to believe in a time when we're facing a banking crisis that many of the banks created—are still the most powerful lobby on Capitol Hill. And they frankly own the place.”—Senator Frank Durbin in an interview with Ray Hanania, Radio Chicagoland, April 27, 2009; quotation transcribed by Adam Doster, “Durbin on Congress: The Banks ‘Own The Place,’ ”Progress Illinois, April 29, 2009.

I don't just make this shit up as I go along.

 

[Foxfyre]

Somewhere there must be a way to address the concerns of both in a way that the program can be saved while addressing the most important goals of the other.

Is that so difficult because one side is determined to prevail over the other? Or is it because we have lost the ability to debate and discuss civilly?

I think it's both. The first one led to the second one.

Well, I know from experience that bad behavior and responses take time to learn, and they sometimes take even more time to unlearn, but it can be done.

I think it is worth trying.

 

[tinydancer]

Anyone down there really want to know how to do it?

You have to nuke your beltway republicans? You have to take them out. Now I know everyone was desperately trying to back Romney, because none of you wanted more more damage done.

But now. Fair game.

I am so sick to death of these beltway republicans who would give over their country because their wife wants to have dinner with Katie.

I am so angry at this.

ETA" I have to remember it's an international board. Katie Couric

 

[Foxfyre]

Anyone down there really want to know how to do it?

You have to nuke your beltway republicans? You have to take them out. Now I know everyone was desperately trying to back Romney, because none of you wanted more more damage done.

But now. Fair game.

I am so sick to death of these beltway republicans who would give over their country becaus their wife wants to have dinner with Katie.

I am so angry at this.

A lot of us are angry at this TD, but look at the vote. Split almost evenly 50/50 between Obama and Romney with a pittance of votes going to other diehard candidates who demanded to make a statement for their own egos and didn't care that they might affect the election negatively.

But what the vote tells us is that we have 50% of the electorate who wants a more European style government that takes care of everybody; and we have 50% of the electorate who want to govern themselves rather than give up their options, opportunities, and liberty. No amount of principled, honest, right thinking, and yes, tougher, Republicans are going to overcome that other 50%, most especially when you get photo ops that Sandy and Governor Christie provided for the opposition.

So yeah, we didn't get Romney who might or might not have been any more fiscally responsible than Obama has been, but who certainly knew what to do to get business hiring and making money again. That would have gone a long way to stop the bleeding. We most likely don't have a prayer for that to happen for awhile now. The Dow was down 313 today.

So the solution is for us to spend the next couple of years reaching a substantial majority consensus and agreeing on some core principles that we all want--I believe that consensus is there if we could just cut through the partisan crap--and then find a candidate to carry it out for us. I believe this is the last generation who will have any kind of chance to do that.

 

[AmyNation]

Why conservatives are hell bent to make this election about a fundamental shift of our nation, I haven't quite figured out yet.