Farmer on NPR said he couldn't find an American who would pick fruit...

[toobfreak]

How are you going to pay tax to Uncle Sam unless you have a Social Security number?

They get a fake S.S. number to present to their employer or an ITIN if independent. Fake ID cards, fake birth certificates......Supplying these things is a profitable business. As is moving illegals across the border. Not worth the effort to do regularly if you are here illegally. It's expensive and risky. Even if you are a "tough Mexican". Lol You're an idiot.
You don't have a clue what you are talking about.

Then they HAVE a SS number, JACKASS!!! But fake ID can be traced, it can cause conflicts in the system and pop up for alert. After they are long gone, the Fed shows up and it is the employer who has the explaining to do. If I was an employer, I would simply pay them under the table, so much simpler for all. If it is done regularly with false ID, then either the employer is an idiot or the Fed is in on the take. Why do you think we have so many lobbyists for Mexico??? Going across the border is FREE, if you have the means, it is only expensive for those who need help getting here, and crossing the border is so easy, 10-20 million illegals have already done it. Boy, you would be a one smart fellow if you weren't so stupid.

 

[sartre play]

...he said an American tried it and gave up after one box.

Question.

How much does this farmer pay a fruit picker to pick one box of fruit?

Obviously, just enough to entice an illegal alien, but not enough to entice an American who has other employment options.

Solution.

Pay your workers more, enough so someone can actually live off what you are paying him, maybe enough for groceries, rent, utilties, with a little extra left to go to the movies on Saturday.

Illegal aliens don't need that. They live 12 to an apartment, eat rice and beans, and send the rest of their money to their families in Mexico or Central America.

So, the farmer wants us to let in illegal aliens so he doesn't have to pay a living wage for an American.

So, why are the Democrats AGAINST a living wage for American workers?

This is why Trump won the election, because American workers realized the Democrats have abandoned them.

Both party's have abandoned us.

BOTH party's always give a better deal to the rich & corporations.

Check how they vote not on what they say. then decide. very few farmers left its mostly big corporations now.

 

[Picaro]

​

You keep harping on milk, one of the least labor intensive agricultural products. Why not make this same calculations for lettuce or strawberries or grapes.

Because the argument is a strawman.

This OP is based on a lie about a NPR article about the difficulty finding labor to pick apples. Of course cnelsen would prefer to address his own strawman rather than the topic.

Where agriculture can mechanize and automate- it is doing so as rapidly as it can. Dairy has been mechanized for decades, as has grain and much of livestock production.

It is produce- fruits and vegetables- that are hard to mechanize or automate- and those are the commodities that have the highest labor costs.

Easy enough to see how that affects American produce- compare the price of Chinese garlic to American garlic- almost twice as expensive- almost all due to labor costs- even with the cost of transporting the garlic from China.

I wonder how the Japanese manage to feed themselves at all. High wage country. No immigrants. It must be impossible to get a fruit or vegetable in Japan, huh, strawman?

Indeed; same for Singapore. As I said earlier, automation goes on regardless of wage levels, and that included fast food chains. Labor costs are a small percentage of costs. Employers would whine and cry over paying 2 cents an hour.

That would depend on the industry. It's the same debate that goes on with minimum wage increases.

If we increased the federal minimum wage to $15.00 per hour, it wouldn't have much effect on fast food chains like McDonald's. That's because they sell thousands of burgers and drinks every day, plus the hundreds of french fries and deserts. So absorbing that increased wage is divided by the thousands and nobody would know the difference.

Not the same for Tom's hardware store. Tom doesn't sell a thousand hammers a day or hundreds of screw drivers. He has to increase the cost of his products much more than Wendy's.

So when we talk about agriculture and increased wages for Americans, I don't think it would be that noticeable because of the amount of crops they pick, sort or package.

Raising the minimum wage may not be necessary if we get rid of all the employed illegal aliens wages will raise out of necessity.

Much more effective is if the Feds actually bothered to prosecute the CEO's of the companies hiring them, and crack down on contractors as well. That will get rid of 80% of the problem, and without having to round anybody up; they would self-deport. Throw in prosecuting those states that spend Federal welfare grants and other subsidies on criminal illegal aliens and we're pretty much done with a 'border problem' outside of the drug and prostitution gangs and the professional thieves and robbers.

 

[Two Thumbs]

npr interviewed an illegal that's been her 28 years, that lazy fuck still can't speak English.

Why do you assume that someone who can't speak English is lazy?

Maybe they aren't very intelligent and can barely speak their own language.

Maybe they live in a situation where they aren't exposed to English (such as working with non-English speakers and living with non-English speakers and not interacting with anyone in the general public).

28 years

their kids go to school here, so must speak English.

he's a lazy pile of garbage

 

[Picaro]

How are you going to pay tax to Uncle Sam unless you have a Social Security number?

They get a fake S.S. number to present to their employer or an ITIN if independent. Fake ID cards, fake birth certificates......Supplying these things is a profitable business. As is moving illegals across the border. Not worth the effort to do regularly if you are here illegally. It's expensive and risky. Even if you are a "tough Mexican". Lol You're an idiot.
You don't have a clue what you are talking about.

Then they HAVE a SS number, JACKASS!!! But fake ID can be traced, it can cause conflicts in the system and pop up for alert. After they are long gone, the Fed shows up and it is the employer who has the explaining to do. If I was an employer, I would simply pay them under the table, so much simpler for all. If it is done regularly with false ID, then either the employer is an idiot or the Fed is in on the take. Why do you think we have so many lobbyists for Mexico??? Going across the border is FREE, if you have the means, it is only expensive for those who need help getting here, and crossing the border is so easy, 10-20 million illegals have already done it. Boy, you would be a one smart fellow if you weren't so stupid.

Well, the stats are that only about 4% of farm workers are H2A's, so good luck trying to find the other 96% who are invisible to the 'system' for any practical purpose. The SS administration has no real budget for enforcement, and that is because all these pols on both ends of the spectrum make all kinds of noises in speeches but never provide a budget for enforcement that actually means anything; they're fond of unfunded mandates. H2A's also overstay their visas as well, some 25% or so do, lower than the average of 40% for the tourist visas and the like, but still pretty high.

Anybody care to guess at what the AG's budget is for investigation and prosecution of labor racketeering and sweat shop practices are? Want to bet it's never been more than a fraction of percent? Same for DHS, despite all the noise made by their PR flacks.

 

[Syriusly]

I hear a million PR's are headed this way

It's ok. The libtards have nearly succeeded in bringing about a race war. It won't be long now, and we'll send them all right back to Puerto Rico, then pull the plug.

Contards like you are always hoping for a race war, so you think you will be able to legally shoot the non-whites.

Not that you actually would have the balls to do anything but whine in your basement.

 

[Syriusly]

Gilroy is a Silicon Valley bedroom community (35 miles south of SJ) where median house cost is close to $650K. Rent is close to $2000/mo for almost anything.

Yes. I used to live in Sunnyvale doing contract work at a couple of companies near that 'America' something or other amusement park, and from there to Berkeley and Lawrence Livermore for a couple of years, then from there to Portland, Or. for 8 months or so.

Why is it Tax free income? I keep hearing these "workers" pay taxes. They did pay ~$0.50/Gallon when they drove through "uninsured". Does the old Pontiac need tires and brakes? probably. another $1000. The apples are gone in time? Or do they ripen all year long? What do they do? Live in the car? They pull up a Trailer?

The majority are hired by 'labor contractors', not directly by the farmers; these 'contractors' allegedly withhold the payroll taxes and stuff, but it's highly unlikely they ever actually pay a dime to the govt.

But hey, Syriusly saves a penny at the produce stand, and that's what counts. Who cares if the farmer uses illegals to drive down wages of his neighbors, then sticks his neighbors with the cost of educating their kids and paying for their medical care?

But hey- Picaro gets to drive small farmers out of business, and then stick Americans with the costs of educating all of those driven out of business because you prefer family farms to be driven out of business rather than have legal immigrant agriculture labor.

 

[Syriusly]

Just pointing out again- that this entire thread is premised on Blackrook's lie regarding what he said a farmer said.

But he lied.

The farmer- a Trump voter- said he could not find Americans to pick apples- and never supported illegal immigration at all.

 

[xotoxi]

npr interviewed an illegal that's been her 28 years, that lazy fuck still can't speak English.

Why do you assume that someone who can't speak English is lazy?

Maybe they aren't very intelligent and can barely speak their own language.

Maybe they live in a situation where they aren't exposed to English (such as working with non-English speakers and living with non-English speakers and not interacting with anyone in the general public).

28 years

their kids go to school here, so must speak English.

he's a lazy pile of garbage

Or maybe not intelligent.

There are some unintelligent English speakers that can't even speak English.

 

[Syriusly]

How are you going to pay tax to Uncle Sam unless you have a Social Security number?

They get a fake S.S. number to present to their employer or an ITIN if independent. Fake ID cards, fake birth certificates......Supplying these things is a profitable business. As is moving illegals across the border. Not worth the effort to do regularly if you are here illegally. It's expensive and risky. Even if you are a "tough Mexican". Lol You're an idiot.
You don't have a clue what you are talking about.

Then they HAVE a SS number, JACKASS!!! But fake ID can be traced, it can cause conflicts in the system and pop up for alert. After they are long gone, the Fed shows up and it is the employer who has the explaining to do. If I was an employer, I would simply pay them under the table, so much simpler for all. If it is done regularly with false ID, then either the employer is an idiot or the Fed is in on the take. Why do you think we have so many lobbyists for Mexico??? Going across the border is FREE, if you have the means, it is only expensive for those who need help getting here, and crossing the border is so easy, 10-20 million illegals have already done it. Boy, you would be a one smart fellow if you weren't so stupid.

Well, the stats are that only about 4% of farm workers are H2A's, so good luck trying to find the other 96% who are invisible to the 'system' for any practical purpose. The SS administration has no real budget for enforcement, and that is because all these pols on both ends of the spectrum make all kinds of noises in speeches but never provide a budget for enforcement that actually means anything; they're fond of unfunded mandates. H2A's also overstay their visas as well, some 25% or so do, lower than the average of 40% for the tourist visas and the like, but still pretty high.

Anybody care to guess at what the AG's budget is for investigation and prosecution of labor racketeering and sweat shop practices are? Want to bet it's never been more than a fraction of percent? Same for DHS, despite all the noise made by their PR flacks.

And then Trump hires foreign workers for Mara Lago- under the H2B visa program.

Without worrying one bit whether or not H2B visa workers overstay their visas.

Nor any concern from Trump about a budget for investigation of this program?