Family Values means on counselling for battered women

[eots]

I talked to a couple of people yesterday in the thread that joked about giving a woman two black eyes.

people make jokes about violence on others all the time...including woman toward men

 

[jillian]

Isn't there funds from states to help with the battered women? Why would the federal government even get involved with this?

VAWA, the Violence Against Women Act.

Why? Because it's the right thing to do (I know, that's hard for callous conservatives to wrap their arms around).

Go hug a tree asshat.
Conservatives are concerned with family violence, of any type.
There are plenty of state funded policies that deal with violence against women, such as DELTA.

Wouldn't "the right thing to do" is put a Cadillac in every garage? Just another ultra liberal figuring out a way to spend more money that we don't have. You never fail, wry, Frisco has taught you well.

states can't afford to do these things, especially with the fed making all kinds of cuts to anything that benefits the middle class. even if states could do it, they wouldn't do it across the board. if the idea is to service a group of people, it has to be done globally.

no one is talking about "putting a cadillac in every garage".

the federal government has the right to act in the general welfare... and it should.

now, if money is an issue, perhaps the bush tax cuts should be restored and we should stop fighting two wars of choice??

 

[Meister]

VAWA, the Violence Against Women Act.

Why? Because it's the right thing to do (I know, that's hard for callous conservatives to wrap their arms around).

Go hug a tree asshat.
Conservatives are concerned with family violence, of any type.
There are plenty of state funded policies that deal with violence against women, such as DELTA.

Wouldn't "the right thing to do" is put a Cadillac in every garage? Just another ultra liberal figuring out a way to spend more money that we don't have. You never fail, wry, Frisco has taught you well.

states can't afford to do these things, especially with the fed making all kinds of cuts to anything that benefits the middle class. even if states could do it, they wouldn't do it across the board. if the idea is to service a group of people, it has to be done globally.

no one is talking about "putting a cadillac in every garage".

the federal government has the right to act in the general welfare... and it should.

now, if money is an issue, perhaps the bush tax cuts should be restored and we should stop fighting two wars of choice??

States can and do fund these programs, Jillian. The federal government should let the states handle this.....and the states do on many levels for the general welfare of the abused.
As far as Putting a Cadillac in every garage, it was in response to wry's broadbrush on "it's the right thing to do" mantra.
Your last sentence should be debated in another thread.

 

[Katzndogz]

Programs to help battered women don't really help.

The best thing is a shelter. When they know that the next punch is going to be a killer and they can get away they'll have someplace to go. Until they go back to the abuser that is. Without intense psychiactric care, these women are lost.

 

[Meister]

Programs to help battered women don't really help.

The best thing is a shelter. When they know that the next punch is going to be a killer and they can get away they'll have someplace to go. Until they go back to the abuser that is. Without intense psychiactric care, these women are lost.

Like I said....the states do help the abused on many levels.

 

[The Infidel]

From Family PAC Federal Vice President Sandy Rios on Fox:

“Is the White House out of their mind? Does the West Wing not know what the left wing is doing? We’re $14 trillion in debt and now we’re going to cover birth control, breast pumps, counseling for abuse? Are we going to do pedicures and manicures as well?”

Fox News Compares Helping Battered Women To Getting a Manicure | Addicting Info

Counseling for abused women = PEDICURE according to FOX.

 

[OohPooPahDoo]

We have programs at the state level in place already to help the abused family member...not just battered wives or mothers.
Let the states handle these issues, we don't need to get the feds involved in these matters.

Try and remember why we are called "United States" of America and not just America.

Because clearly the states have done such a great job WITH all the federal funding they get to fight violence agaisnt women http://www.ncadv.org/files/appropschartfy08briefingbook7.27.07.pdf - its time to take that money back. Why spend money fighting an issue that's solved?

 

[OohPooPahDoo]

From Family PAC Federal Vice President Sandy Rios on Fox:

“Is the White House out of their mind? Does the West Wing not know what the left wing is doing? We’re $14 trillion in debt and now we’re going to cover birth control, breast pumps, counseling for abuse? Are we going to do pedicures and manicures as well?”

Fox News Compares Helping Battered Women To Getting a Manicure | Addicting Info

Counseling for abused women = PEDICURE according to FOX.

Not sure what this has to do with federal spending.

 

[DiAnna]

Programs to help battered women don't really help.

The best thing is a shelter. When they know that the next punch is going to be a killer and they can get away they'll have someplace to go. Until they go back to the abuser that is. Without intense psychiactric care, these women are lost.

Nobody, including you, have commented on the male's responsibility in these situations, nor have they indicated that men who beat women need psychiatric care. Why is that?

I've known several battered women, and they didn't marry a man they thought would beat them. Men who batter can be incredibly charming and devious. They exert control slowly, over time. First it's just minor disapproval over her clothing, her hair, her cooking, her housecleaning, whatever. Then the disapproval comes with "punishments", that increase in severity over the years. The "silent treatment", verbal abuse, slamming doors, throwing things, threats to break something she cherishes, which eventually leads to threats to break someone she cherishes.

By this time, the man has control of all the family finances, has managed to distance her from family and friends, and there are usually children involved. Then the hitting starts. If she threatens to leave, he threatens to take the children away and since he has all the money and everything is in his name, she realizes she can't even hire an attorney to help her. Then comes the flowers, the apology, the promise never to do it again. Lather, rinse, repeat.

Eventually his threats turn deadly. If she leaves, he'll kill her, kill her kids... sometimes he kills a pet, just to make sure she knows he's serious. By this time, she literally is too terrified to leave. She knows he'll kill her.

And in the case of three women I knew, when they did finally leave, the threats were carried out. One woman colleague was murdered after her husband killed all three of their children in her presence; he then killed himself. A neighbor woman, forced to give her abusive husband visitation, arrived to pick them up to discover that he had murdered her two children and killed himself. The third woman, a friend I'd known since high school, was gunned down by her husband in a parking lot. He got away, and to this day has not been caught.

So tell me, while you are railing about the psychotic women who know that if they allow their husbands to be arrested, they'll be back to hurt them twice as bad the next day, where is the responsibility of these abusive men? Are they psychotic too? Or is it just the women at fault?

 

[2twsted4colorTV]

Programs to help battered women don't really help.

The best thing is a shelter. When they know that the next punch is going to be a killer and they can get away they'll have someplace to go. Until they go back to the abuser that is. Without intense psychiactric care, these women are lost.

Nobody, including you, have commented on the male's responsibility in these situations, nor have they indicated that men who beat women need psychiatric care. Why is that?

I've known several battered women, and they didn't marry a man they thought would beat them. Men who batter can be incredibly charming and devious. They exert control slowly, over time. First it's just minor disapproval over her clothing, her hair, her cooking, her housecleaning, whatever. Then the disapproval comes with "punishments", that increase in severity over the years. The "silent treatment", verbal abuse, slamming doors, throwing things, threats to break something she cherishes, which eventually leads to threats to break someone she cherishes.

By this time, the man has control of all the family finances, has managed to distance her from family and friends, and there are usually children involved. Then the hitting starts. If she threatens to leave, he threatens to take the children away and since he has all the money and everything is in his name, she realizes she can't even hire an attorney to help her. Then comes the flowers, the apology, the promise never to do it again. Lather, rinse, repeat.

Eventually his threats turn deadly. If she leaves, he'll kill her, kill her kids... sometimes he kills a pet, just to make sure she knows he's serious. By this time, she literally is too terrified to leave. She knows he'll kill her.

And in the case of three women I knew, when they did finally leave, the threats were carried out. One woman colleague was murdered after her husband killed all three of their children in her presence; he then killed himself. A neighbor woman, forced to give her abusive husband visitation, arrived to pick them up to discover that he had murdered her two children and killed himself. The third woman, a friend I'd known since high school, was gunned down by her husband in a parking lot. He got away, and to this day has not been caught.

So tell me, while you are railing about the psychotic women who know that if they allow their husbands to be arrested, they'll be back to hurt them twice as bad the next day, where is the responsibility of these abusive men? Are they psychotic too? Or is it just the women at fault?

You are absolutely right and you bring up excellent points. But I think everyone is saying is that unless the woman WANTS to press charges (unless he's killed her of course) there isn't anything the cops can do. It doesn't do any good to try to intervene in the types of situations you describe, the women often times deny it or refuse help. But the "red flags" you describe show up right away. I had a boyfriend who slapped me once evening over and over (I left him the next day and never looked back), but the red flags were there in the beginning - telling me what kind of makeup to use, telling me this and that, much the way you describe. But often times nobody believes he is abusive or controlling, they just refuse to believe it. But, yes I think those men ARE psychotic control freaks. But I guess what were talking about is ways women can avoid becoming entangled with these men in the first place, if there IS a way that is. I don't know. My husband now of 41 years has his faults, but being controlling isn't one of them. The finances are in MY name, since I'm the breadwinner, he has no idea how to balance a check book. He has access to money of course, my God. He just doesn't WANT to control them. I don't know, I feel terrible for women in that situation, I don't know what the answer is.

 

[Katzndogz]

Everything you say Twsted is absolutely correct. That said. It is not the responsibility of a woman to make a psychotic man get help. Her responsibility is limited to what she does. That's the problem. It's one of control. There is NO control over what he does. A woman who is battered only has control over what she does. Over and over, battered women say one thing "How can I make him stop?" The answer is - you can't. Unfortunately for many of these women, they leave one batterer for another! That's why such women needs psychiatric help. What makes them seek out men who batter? I got news, ALL batterers are charming and devious. Far more charming than any other man. They are complimentary and generous. They buy expensive presents. They take their women to expensive places. The female trick is to recognize the first indication that this isn't what it appears and leave right then and there. Before it escalates.

As far at not being able to do anything because he has control of the finances, don't believe it for a minute. There are numerous organizations that provide services for women who can't afford it. There are numerous ways to get money out of a man who won't pay. Courts will order it, and forensic accountants will find it. It is a cop out. It is one more excuse women use to wiggle out of taking care of their own business.

If you want to discuss men who kill their wives and children, they are a different class than batterers. They are killers. They are killers like the guy waiting in an alley for someone unsuspecting to walk by.

I've had batterers in my life. Not for long, but I am quite familiar with the way these things progress.

 

[Iridescence]

Eyes that see and ears that hear....

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3YxaaGgTQYM&ob=av2e]Evanescence - Bring Me To Life - YouTube[/ame]