Faith is Born from Fear

[AtheistBuddah]

It has been said by many Christians that one of the primary reasons for someone being an atheist and saying that they don't believe is because they don't want to believe. They don't want to ask the hard question "What if I'm wrong?" because they can't accept the implications of that questioning. They claim that we as atheists take the easy way out but I argue that it is just the opposite. Christians downright refuse to humor any kind of questioning when it comes to their belief. They refuse to look inside themselves and ask "What if there is no God?" because they are terrified of the implications of that question. They claim we are afraid of hell but in fact it is they who are afraid of oblivion. Of nonexistence. Understandably so. The idea of ceasing to exist is unpleasant to say the least. That is why being an atheist is far from the easy way out.

As an atheist you look that unpleasant reality in the face, swallow your fear and accept it and live your life to its fullest. Being a Christian is a way of ignoring the fact that the world is an unpleasant and often unjust place where some people live their whole lives in despair before their flame of consciousness goes out forever. This world can be cruel and unfair but as atheists we accept that it's the only one we are ever going to get and that motivates us to fight our hardest to make it a better and brighter one. For our sake and for the sake of our children. We don't turn away from reality and turn a wishful eye to an afterlife that isn't going to happen.

You are doing to others what you complain others are doing to you.

I am doing no such thing. I do not complain about the criticism of my ideas in fact I welcome and cherish it. I welcome Christians to make the same criticizing statements about my views because that is a vital part of how a free society works. What I complain about is when my rights and the rights of other minorities are infringed upon by the Christian majority in the name of their specific values.

Yes, you are. You are taking an entire class of people and sticking them into a little box and slapping a label on it. You are acting in exactly the same manner as the people you are complaining about.

The fundamental difference is that I am not trying to get laws passed that limit their freedom of expression.

I have no idea what you personally might be doing, but to say Atheists have not tried to do this is flat wrong. In fact, most of the attempts to limit freedom of expression I can think of have come from either Atheists or the left.

We want an Atheist display next to your Christmas displays. We want a booth next to Santa to talk to all the kids that don't believe in Santa or Xmas. And we want to put up right next to the Prayer you have in our school a sign that says THERE IS NO GOD and a Website where students can go see that their parents and churches have quite possibly been feeding them a fairy tale for the last 3-18 years. Let them decide after seeing both sides of the argument. But instead it is you who wouldn't dare let us have a place in society because we would expose your lie.

So don't cry about us. We sit quietly and let your religious holidays go by and some of us even participate. I like Easter and Xmas for the family. I skip church. The people bore me. Should I find a new church? Why? Am I doing it because I believe in God or because I want to meet new friends and have fun?

For some they believe because they want to believe. They don't want to be the odd ball in the flock. They enjoy church and the people at church. Met their wives or husbands at church. I know there is a lot of good that comes out of this cult but a lot of bad comes too. Like Ghandi said. Christ sounded like a good man. It's Christians that he had a problem with. AGREED!

I thought Santa Clause WAS the atheists alternative to Christmas.....

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that the Santa remark was joke.

 

[PostmodernProph]

I have found truth=God and God says we believers are to share the good news about God's love, I take no pleasure seeing you played for a fool used as satan tool puppet on the road to hell.

So talking with us here about hell and satan and how if we don't believe what you believe we'll be sent to a place of eternal torture and pain and sadness is your idea of sharing the news about God's love is it?

You might wanna take a commercial psychology course somewhere. Your 'sales pitch' needs work.

The" GOOD NEWS" is that Jesus gave his blood and life on the cross to pay your sin debt and buy you a pardon to keep you out of hell but you must chose to accept His love mercy forgiveness or pay your own sin debt=death and hell.

And miss the big bbq at the Lake of Fire Café???? I don't think so. All the best people will be there.

If they were truly the best people, they wouldn't be.

Oh, yes they would. Anyone who would choose to spend eternity with a being who created hell would not qualify as the best.

????....so, the logic is that its better to spend eternity in hell than with the being who created it?......

Yes.

gotta say, logic like that is not going to make you the reddest tulip in the garden......

I can live with that. I can't live with immorality. A being which creates hell is immoral.

/shrugs.....you say God is immoral, he says you're immoral.....guess it boils down to who actually is the authority on morality.....you or God......

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Who I can someone not be offended by the notion that without their God we are all broken, worthless and deserving only of damnation. I resent the assertion that without their God I cannot be a force for good. That I can not possess morals of my own that are of value.

You resent a condition that mostly is the result of your misinterpretation of the Bible?

Sounds like a personal problem to me.

 

[PostmodernProph]

The USA started as a Christian nation.

The Treaty of Tripoli would beg to differ.

you mean a document crafted to convince a Muslim nation we didn't intend to impose Christianity upon them?.....no, I suppose it did NOT say we were a Christian nation.....

I did more than not say we were a Christian nation it explicitly state that we AREN'T one.

I suspect if charged with the task of convincing a Muslim nation we didn't intend to force Christianity upon them as part of a peace treaty I might make the same argument......doesn't mean it's true.....its called diplomacy......

 

[AtheistBuddah]

It is a very insulting and creepy conversation when a born again approaches you and asks if you know where you are going when you die.

you're just afraid they might still have holy water on their clothes from their last baptism and it could get on you.....

Well it says in the Secret Satan Worshiper's Handbook to avoid holy water so I mean what do you want from us? Lol

 

[PostmodernProph]

It has been said by many Christians that one of the primary reasons for someone being an atheist and saying that they don't believe is because they don't want to believe. They don't want to ask the hard question "What if I'm wrong?" because they can't accept the implications of that questioning. They claim that we as atheists take the easy way out but I argue that it is just the opposite. Christians downright refuse to humor any kind of questioning when it comes to their belief. They refuse to look inside themselves and ask "What if there is no God?" because they are terrified of the implications of that question. They claim we are afraid of hell but in fact it is they who are afraid of oblivion. Of nonexistence. Understandably so. The idea of ceasing to exist is unpleasant to say the least. That is why being an atheist is far from the easy way out.

As an atheist you look that unpleasant reality in the face, swallow your fear and accept it and live your life to its fullest. Being a Christian is a way of ignoring the fact that the world is an unpleasant and often unjust place where some people live their whole lives in despair before their flame of consciousness goes out forever. This world can be cruel and unfair but as atheists we accept that it's the only one we are ever going to get and that motivates us to fight our hardest to make it a better and brighter one. For our sake and for the sake of our children. We don't turn away from reality and turn a wishful eye to an afterlife that isn't going to happen.

You are doing to others what you complain others are doing to you.

I am doing no such thing. I do not complain about the criticism of my ideas in fact I welcome and cherish it. I welcome Christians to make the same criticizing statements about my views because that is a vital part of how a free society works. What I complain about is when my rights and the rights of other minorities are infringed upon by the Christian majority in the name of their specific values.

Yes, you are. You are taking an entire class of people and sticking them into a little box and slapping a label on it. You are acting in exactly the same manner as the people you are complaining about.

The fundamental difference is that I am not trying to get laws passed that limit their freedom of expression.

I have no idea what you personally might be doing, but to say Atheists have not tried to do this is flat wrong. In fact, most of the attempts to limit freedom of expression I can think of have come from either Atheists or the left.

We want an Atheist display next to your Christmas displays. We want a booth next to Santa to talk to all the kids that don't believe in Santa or Xmas. And we want to put up right next to the Prayer you have in our school a sign that says THERE IS NO GOD and a Website where students can go see that their parents and churches have quite possibly been feeding them a fairy tale for the last 3-18 years. Let them decide after seeing both sides of the argument. But instead it is you who wouldn't dare let us have a place in society because we would expose your lie.

So don't cry about us. We sit quietly and let your religious holidays go by and some of us even participate. I like Easter and Xmas for the family. I skip church. The people bore me. Should I find a new church? Why? Am I doing it because I believe in God or because I want to meet new friends and have fun?

For some they believe because they want to believe. They don't want to be the odd ball in the flock. They enjoy church and the people at church. Met their wives or husbands at church. I know there is a lot of good that comes out of this cult but a lot of bad comes too. Like Ghandi said. Christ sounded like a good man. It's Christians that he had a problem with. AGREED!

I thought Santa Clause WAS the atheists alternative to Christmas.....

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that the Santa remark was joke.

I'm going to give YOU the benefit of the doubt and assume you don't really think Santa has anything to do with Christianity......

 

[PratchettFan]

[

I have been a non-Christian all of my life. I have yet to have anyone threaten violence against me as a result. If you have, I expect it had more to do with delivery than content.

If you don't believe in hell, how can it be an insult?

I've been a good person all of my life and never hesitate to help others if I can simply because I have empathy and yet Christians tell me that I am worthy only of eternal punishment. How am I not to be offended by this?

They are not saying you are a bad person, other than the general belief that we are all bad by nature. If you don't believe that then there is nothing to be offended by. Assuming, of course, that you truly don't believe it.

If you are offended, it is because you choose to be offended.[/QUOTE]

Who I can someone not be offended by the notion that without their God we are all broken, worthless and deserving only of damnation. I resent the assertion that without their God I cannot be a force for good. That I can not possess morals of my own that are of value.[/QUOTE]

Because if you don't believe it then it should mean nothing to you. Are you offended that if you don't die in battle you don't get to go to Valhalla? It only has offense if you believe, and you say you don't believe.

 

[PratchettFan]

[

I have been a non-Christian all of my life. I have yet to have anyone threaten violence against me as a result. If you have, I expect it had more to do with delivery than content.

If you don't believe in hell, how can it be an insult?

I've been a good person all of my life and never hesitate to help others if I can simply because I have empathy and yet Christians tell me that I am worthy only of eternal punishment. How am I not to be offended by this?

They are not saying you are a bad person, other than the general belief that we are all bad by nature. If you don't believe that then there is nothing to be offended by. Assuming, of course, that you truly don't believe it.

If you are offended, it is because you choose to be offended.

Who I can someone not be offended by the notion that without their God we are all broken, worthless and deserving only of damnation. I resent the assertion that without their God I cannot be a force for good. That I can not possess morals of my own that are of value.[/QUOTE]

Because if you don't believe it then it should mean nothing to you. Are you offended that if you don't die in battle you don't get to go to Valhalla? It only has offense if you believe, and you say you don't believe.[/QUOTE]

Just as an aside, my God this new format sucks.

 

[dblack]

It has been said by many Christians that one of the primary reasons for someone being an atheist and saying that they don't believe is because they don't want to believe. They don't want to ask the hard question "What if I'm wrong?" because they can't accept the implications of that questioning. They claim that we as atheists take the easy way out but I argue that it is just the opposite. Christians downright refuse to humor any kind of questioning when it comes to their belief. They refuse to look inside themselves and ask "What if there is no God?" because they are terrified of the implications of that question. They claim we are afraid of hell but in fact it is they who are afraid of oblivion. Of nonexistence. Understandably so. The idea of ceasing to exist is unpleasant to say the least. That is why being an atheist is far from the easy way out.

As an atheist you look that unpleasant reality in the face, swallow your fear and accept it and live your life to its fullest. Being a Christian is a way of ignoring the fact that the world is an unpleasant and often unjust place where some people live their whole lives in despair before their flame of consciousness goes out forever. This world can be cruel and unfair but as atheists we accept that it's the only one we are ever going to get and that motivates us to fight our hardest to make it a better and brighter one. For our sake and for the sake of our children. We don't turn away from reality and turn a wishful eye to an afterlife that isn't going to happen.

You are doing to others what you complain others are doing to you.

I am doing no such thing. I do not complain about the criticism of my ideas in fact I welcome and cherish it. I welcome Christians to make the same criticizing statements about my views because that is a vital part of how a free society works. What I complain about is when my rights and the rights of other minorities are infringed upon by the Christian majority in the name of their specific values.

Yes, you are. You are taking an entire class of people and sticking them into a little box and slapping a label on it. You are acting in exactly the same manner as the people you are complaining about.

The fundamental difference is that I am not trying to get laws passed that limit their freedom of expression.

I have no idea what you personally might be doing, but to say Atheists have not tried to do this is flat wrong. In fact, most of the attempts to limit freedom of expression I can think of have come from either Atheists or the left.

We want an Atheist display next to your Christmas displays. We want a booth next to Santa to talk to all the kids that don't believe in Santa or Xmas. And we want to put up right next to the Prayer you have in our school a sign that says THERE IS NO GOD and a Website where students can go see that their parents and churches have quite possibly been feeding them a fairy tale for the last 3-18 years. Let them decide after seeing both sides of the argument. But instead it is you who wouldn't dare let us have a place in society because we would expose your lie.

So don't cry about us. We sit quietly and let your religious holidays go by and some of us even participate. I like Easter and Xmas for the family. I skip church. The people bore me. Should I find a new church? Why? Am I doing it because I believe in God or because I want to meet new friends and have fun?

For some they believe because they want to believe. They don't want to be the odd ball in the flock. They enjoy church and the people at church. Met their wives or husbands at church. I know there is a lot of good that comes out of this cult but a lot of bad comes too. Like Ghandi said. Christ sounded like a good man. It's Christians that he had a problem with. AGREED!

I thought Santa Clause WAS the atheists alternative to Christmas.....

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that the Santa remark was joke.

Santa is like a training bra for future atheists.

 

[PratchettFan]

It has been said by many Christians that one of the primary reasons for someone being an atheist and saying that they don't believe is because they don't want to believe. They don't want to ask the hard question "What if I'm wrong?" because they can't accept the implications of that questioning. They claim that we as atheists take the easy way out but I argue that it is just the opposite. Christians downright refuse to humor any kind of questioning when it comes to their belief. They refuse to look inside themselves and ask "What if there is no God?" because they are terrified of the implications of that question. They claim we are afraid of hell but in fact it is they who are afraid of oblivion. Of nonexistence. Understandably so. The idea of ceasing to exist is unpleasant to say the least. That is why being an atheist is far from the easy way out.

As an atheist you look that unpleasant reality in the face, swallow your fear and accept it and live your life to its fullest. Being a Christian is a way of ignoring the fact that the world is an unpleasant and often unjust place where some people live their whole lives in despair before their flame of consciousness goes out forever. This world can be cruel and unfair but as atheists we accept that it's the only one we are ever going to get and that motivates us to fight our hardest to make it a better and brighter one. For our sake and for the sake of our children. We don't turn away from reality and turn a wishful eye to an afterlife that isn't going to happen.

You are doing to others what you complain others are doing to you.

I am doing no such thing. I do not complain about the criticism of my ideas in fact I welcome and cherish it. I welcome Christians to make the same criticizing statements about my views because that is a vital part of how a free society works. What I complain about is when my rights and the rights of other minorities are infringed upon by the Christian majority in the name of their specific values.

Yes, you are. You are taking an entire class of people and sticking them into a little box and slapping a label on it. You are acting in exactly the same manner as the people you are complaining about.

The fundamental difference is that I am not trying to get laws passed that limit their freedom of expression.

I have no idea what you personally might be doing, but to say Atheists have not tried to do this is flat wrong. In fact, most of the attempts to limit freedom of expression I can think of have come from either Atheists or the left.

We want an Atheist display next to your Christmas displays. We want a booth next to Santa to talk to all the kids that don't believe in Santa or Xmas. And we want to put up right next to the Prayer you have in our school a sign that says THERE IS NO GOD and a Website where students can go see that their parents and churches have quite possibly been feeding them a fairy tale for the last 3-18 years. Let them decide after seeing both sides of the argument. But instead it is you who wouldn't dare let us have a place in society because we would expose your lie.

So don't cry about us. We sit quietly and let your religious holidays go by and some of us even participate. I like Easter and Xmas for the family. I skip church. The people bore me. Should I find a new church? Why? Am I doing it because I believe in God or because I want to meet new friends and have fun?

For some they believe because they want to believe. They don't want to be the odd ball in the flock. They enjoy church and the people at church. Met their wives or husbands at church. I know there is a lot of good that comes out of this cult but a lot of bad comes too. Like Ghandi said. Christ sounded like a good man. It's Christians that he had a problem with. AGREED!

I thought Santa Clause WAS the atheists alternative to Christmas.....

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that the Santa remark was joke.

Santa is like a training bra for future atheists.

It would appear not.

 

[AtheistBuddah]

It is a very insulting and creepy conversation when a born again approaches you and asks if you know where you are going when you die.

When I was a christian, I use to tell them that it was us Greeks that translated the bible from the old writing into Greek then eventually English. We told you white people what the bible said so please don't you now try to tell me what the bible says.

And after talking to you cry babies about freedom of speech, I have decided that I'm going to start acting like christians. I'm going to go to the mall and walk up to people with a flyer with a link to an atheist website and I'm going to ask them if they realize god is a lie.

Freedom of speech, right guys? Do you have a problem with me approaching your kids in the mall and telling them that their parents and church have been lying to them?

But then in their infinite knowledge, Christians will call YOU hypocritical for doing that lol.

In this case, they would be right.

No we have every right to do as they do. If it's okay for them to tell my kids that they are going to hell then it's alright for me to tell their kids that they're just going to rot in the ground.

I agree you have the right to do this. But if you do it just because they do it and you think they should not do it, then you are a hypocrite. You have the right to be a hypocrite.[/QUOTE]

Honestly, I think that Christians and all other faiths should have the right to spread the word about their beliefs and encourage others to join but they shouldn't be such dicks about it. And they choose to be dicks then I will fight fire with fire and if that makes me a hypocrite then so be it.

 

[dblack]

Jeez, people. It's not that hard to figure out the quoting. Or find the edit button afterwards.....

 

[PratchettFan]

It is a very insulting and creepy conversation when a born again approaches you and asks if you know where you are going when you die.

When I was a christian, I use to tell them that it was us Greeks that translated the bible from the old writing into Greek then eventually English. We told you white people what the bible said so please don't you now try to tell me what the bible says.

And after talking to you cry babies about freedom of speech, I have decided that I'm going to start acting like christians. I'm going to go to the mall and walk up to people with a flyer with a link to an atheist website and I'm going to ask them if they realize god is a lie.

Freedom of speech, right guys? Do you have a problem with me approaching your kids in the mall and telling them that their parents and church have been lying to them?

But then in their infinite knowledge, Christians will call YOU hypocritical for doing that lol.

In this case, they would be right.

No we have every right to do as they do. If it's okay for them to tell my kids that they are going to hell then it's alright for me to tell their kids that they're just going to rot in the ground.

I agree you have the right to do this. But if you do it just because they do it and you think they should not do it, then you are a hypocrite. You have the right to be a hypocrite.

Honestly, I think that Christians and all other faiths should have the right to spread the word about their beliefs and encourage others to join but they shouldn't be such dicks about it. And they choose to be dicks then I will fight fire with fire and if that makes me a hypocrite then so be it.[/QUOTE]

Then they have control over you because they you give them the control. Do not blame them for it.

 

[PratchettFan]

Jeez, people. It's not that hard to figure out the quoting. Or find the edit button afterwards.....

Hey. If you can provide a tutorial it would help. I haven't found any consistency yet.

 

[dblack]

It has been said by many Christians that one of the primary reasons for someone being an atheist and saying that they don't believe is because they don't want to believe. They don't want to ask the hard question "What if I'm wrong?" because they can't accept the implications of that questioning. They claim that we as atheists take the easy way out but I argue that it is just the opposite. Christians downright refuse to humor any kind of questioning when it comes to their belief. They refuse to look inside themselves and ask "What if there is no God?" because they are terrified of the implications of that question. They claim we are afraid of hell but in fact it is they who are afraid of oblivion. Of nonexistence. Understandably so. The idea of ceasing to exist is unpleasant to say the least. That is why being an atheist is far from the easy way out.

As an atheist you look that unpleasant reality in the face, swallow your fear and accept it and live your life to its fullest. Being a Christian is a way of ignoring the fact that the world is an unpleasant and often unjust place where some people live their whole lives in despair before their flame of consciousness goes out forever. This world can be cruel and unfair but as atheists we accept that it's the only one we are ever going to get and that motivates us to fight our hardest to make it a better and brighter one. For our sake and for the sake of our children. We don't turn away from reality and turn a wishful eye to an afterlife that isn't going to happen.

You are doing to others what you complain others are doing to you.

I am doing no such thing. I do not complain about the criticism of my ideas in fact I welcome and cherish it. I welcome Christians to make the same criticizing statements about my views because that is a vital part of how a free society works. What I complain about is when my rights and the rights of other minorities are infringed upon by the Christian majority in the name of their specific values.

Yes, you are. You are taking an entire class of people and sticking them into a little box and slapping a label on it. You are acting in exactly the same manner as the people you are complaining about.

The fundamental difference is that I am not trying to get laws passed that limit their freedom of expression.

I have no idea what you personally might be doing, but to say Atheists have not tried to do this is flat wrong. In fact, most of the attempts to limit freedom of expression I can think of have come from either Atheists or the left.

We want an Atheist display next to your Christmas displays. We want a booth next to Santa to talk to all the kids that don't believe in Santa or Xmas. And we want to put up right next to the Prayer you have in our school a sign that says THERE IS NO GOD and a Website where students can go see that their parents and churches have quite possibly been feeding them a fairy tale for the last 3-18 years. Let them decide after seeing both sides of the argument. But instead it is you who wouldn't dare let us have a place in society because we would expose your lie.

So don't cry about us. We sit quietly and let your religious holidays go by and some of us even participate. I like Easter and Xmas for the family. I skip church. The people bore me. Should I find a new church? Why? Am I doing it because I believe in God or because I want to meet new friends and have fun?

For some they believe because they want to believe. They don't want to be the odd ball in the flock. They enjoy church and the people at church. Met their wives or husbands at church. I know there is a lot of good that comes out of this cult but a lot of bad comes too. Like Ghandi said. Christ sounded like a good man. It's Christians that he had a problem with. AGREED!

I thought Santa Clause WAS the atheists alternative to Christmas.....

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that the Santa remark was joke.

Santa is like a training bra for future atheists.

It would appear not.

No? What are the central lesson's of Santa Claus?

1. People love a good bullshit story if it makes them feel good.
2. There's no such thing as a free lunch.

Pretty much the atheist credo.

 

[dblack]

Jeez, people. It's not that hard to figure out the quoting. Or find the edit button afterwards.....

Hey. If you can provide a tutorial it would help. I haven't found any consistency yet.

Yeah. I suppose. Maybe I've just been doing html so long that the idea of opening and closing tags seems intuitive. Forgive my asshattery.

 

[PratchettFan]

It has been said by many Christians that one of the primary reasons for someone being an atheist and saying that they don't believe is because they don't want to believe. They don't want to ask the hard question "What if I'm wrong?" because they can't accept the implications of that questioning. They claim that we as atheists take the easy way out but I argue that it is just the opposite. Christians downright refuse to humor any kind of questioning when it comes to their belief. They refuse to look inside themselves and ask "What if there is no God?" because they are terrified of the implications of that question. They claim we are afraid of hell but in fact it is they who are afraid of oblivion. Of nonexistence. Understandably so. The idea of ceasing to exist is unpleasant to say the least. That is why being an atheist is far from the easy way out.

As an atheist you look that unpleasant reality in the face, swallow your fear and accept it and live your life to its fullest. Being a Christian is a way of ignoring the fact that the world is an unpleasant and often unjust place where some people live their whole lives in despair before their flame of consciousness goes out forever. This world can be cruel and unfair but as atheists we accept that it's the only one we are ever going to get and that motivates us to fight our hardest to make it a better and brighter one. For our sake and for the sake of our children. We don't turn away from reality and turn a wishful eye to an afterlife that isn't going to happen.

You are doing to others what you complain others are doing to you.

I am doing no such thing. I do not complain about the criticism of my ideas in fact I welcome and cherish it. I welcome Christians to make the same criticizing statements about my views because that is a vital part of how a free society works. What I complain about is when my rights and the rights of other minorities are infringed upon by the Christian majority in the name of their specific values.

Yes, you are. You are taking an entire class of people and sticking them into a little box and slapping a label on it. You are acting in exactly the same manner as the people you are complaining about.

The fundamental difference is that I am not trying to get laws passed that limit their freedom of expression.

I have no idea what you personally might be doing, but to say Atheists have not tried to do this is flat wrong. In fact, most of the attempts to limit freedom of expression I can think of have come from either Atheists or the left.

We want an Atheist display next to your Christmas displays. We want a booth next to Santa to talk to all the kids that don't believe in Santa or Xmas. And we want to put up right next to the Prayer you have in our school a sign that says THERE IS NO GOD and a Website where students can go see that their parents and churches have quite possibly been feeding them a fairy tale for the last 3-18 years. Let them decide after seeing both sides of the argument. But instead it is you who wouldn't dare let us have a place in society because we would expose your lie.

So don't cry about us. We sit quietly and let your religious holidays go by and some of us even participate. I like Easter and Xmas for the family. I skip church. The people bore me. Should I find a new church? Why? Am I doing it because I believe in God or because I want to meet new friends and have fun?

For some they believe because they want to believe. They don't want to be the odd ball in the flock. They enjoy church and the people at church. Met their wives or husbands at church. I know there is a lot of good that comes out of this cult but a lot of bad comes too. Like Ghandi said. Christ sounded like a good man. It's Christians that he had a problem with. AGREED!

I thought Santa Clause WAS the atheists alternative to Christmas.....

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that the Santa remark was joke.

Santa is like a training bra for future atheists.

It would appear not.

No? What are the central lesson's of Santa Claus?

1. People love a good bullshit story if it makes them feel good.
2. There's no such thing as a free lunch.

Pretty much the atheist credo.

And yet most people who believed in Santa turn out to be believers in Jesus. So again, it would appear not.

 

[PratchettFan]

Jeez, people. It's not that hard to figure out the quoting. Or find the edit button afterwards.....

Hey. If you can provide a tutorial it would help. I haven't found any consistency yet.

Yeah. I suppose. Maybe I've just been doing html so long that the idea of opening and closing tags seems intuitive. Forgive my asshattery.

I was raising kids when slide rules were being replaced with calculators. I don't even know what opening and closing tags are. I'm hitting reply and sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. I find that if I edit to reduce the size of the quote the whole thing goes wahoonie. Seriously, if you can give some tips I would appreciate it.

 

[dblack]

It has been said by many Christians that one of the primary reasons for someone being an atheist and saying that they don't believe is because they don't want to believe. They don't want to ask the hard question "What if I'm wrong?" because they can't accept the implications of that questioning. They claim that we as atheists take the easy way out but I argue that it is just the opposite. Christians downright refuse to humor any kind of questioning when it comes to their belief. They refuse to look inside themselves and ask "What if there is no God?" because they are terrified of the implications of that question. They claim we are afraid of hell but in fact it is they who are afraid of oblivion. Of nonexistence. Understandably so. The idea of ceasing to exist is unpleasant to say the least. That is why being an atheist is far from the easy way out.

As an atheist you look that unpleasant reality in the face, swallow your fear and accept it and live your life to its fullest. Being a Christian is a way of ignoring the fact that the world is an unpleasant and often unjust place where some people live their whole lives in despair before their flame of consciousness goes out forever. This world can be cruel and unfair but as atheists we accept that it's the only one we are ever going to get and that motivates us to fight our hardest to make it a better and brighter one. For our sake and for the sake of our children. We don't turn away from reality and turn a wishful eye to an afterlife that isn't going to happen.

You are doing to others what you complain others are doing to you.

I am doing no such thing. I do not complain about the criticism of my ideas in fact I welcome and cherish it. I welcome Christians to make the same criticizing statements about my views because that is a vital part of how a free society works. What I complain about is when my rights and the rights of other minorities are infringed upon by the Christian majority in the name of their specific values.

Yes, you are. You are taking an entire class of people and sticking them into a little box and slapping a label on it. You are acting in exactly the same manner as the people you are complaining about.

The fundamental difference is that I am not trying to get laws passed that limit their freedom of expression.

I have no idea what you personally might be doing, but to say Atheists have not tried to do this is flat wrong. In fact, most of the attempts to limit freedom of expression I can think of have come from either Atheists or the left.

We want an Atheist display next to your Christmas displays. We want a booth next to Santa to talk to all the kids that don't believe in Santa or Xmas. And we want to put up right next to the Prayer you have in our school a sign that says THERE IS NO GOD and a Website where students can go see that their parents and churches have quite possibly been feeding them a fairy tale for the last 3-18 years. Let them decide after seeing both sides of the argument. But instead it is you who wouldn't dare let us have a place in society because we would expose your lie.

So don't cry about us. We sit quietly and let your religious holidays go by and some of us even participate. I like Easter and Xmas for the family. I skip church. The people bore me. Should I find a new church? Why? Am I doing it because I believe in God or because I want to meet new friends and have fun?

For some they believe because they want to believe. They don't want to be the odd ball in the flock. They enjoy church and the people at church. Met their wives or husbands at church. I know there is a lot of good that comes out of this cult but a lot of bad comes too. Like Ghandi said. Christ sounded like a good man. It's Christians that he had a problem with. AGREED!

I thought Santa Clause WAS the atheists alternative to Christmas.....

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that the Santa remark was joke.

Santa is like a training bra for future atheists.

It would appear not.

No? What are the central lesson's of Santa Claus?

1. People love a good bullshit story if it makes them feel good.
2. There's no such thing as a free lunch.

Pretty much the atheist credo.

And yet most people who believed in Santa turn out to be believers in Jesus. So again, it would appear not.

Sure. It's a minority in any case.

You ever read any Florence King? She's a bisexual, pagan, southern, conservative who argues for prayer in school and closeted sexual deviance. Her point of view, in broad strokes, is that the real value of having an independent mind is the level of resistance you face in claiming it. In other words, the value of being an atheist is emphasized by the fact that so few people bother to think for themselves.

 

[PratchettFan]

I can live with that. I can't live with immorality. A being which creates hell is immoral.

God did not create Hell, man did.

Bullshit.