Debate Now "Facts" you know that are wrong.

candycorn

Diamond Member
Aug 25, 2009
107,659
39,549
2,250
Deep State Plant.
The purpose of this thread is to, hopefully, field engaging back and fourths between posters concerning "facts" that they know about theirs or "the other" side that can be shown to be wrong by a member of the other side. Nobody need bring up something to get it discussed--feel free to start us off if you like. Just speak in the macro for the purposes of this debate. For example, a lot of liberals think that conservatives do not give much to charity when there have been credible studies that show conservatives give a higher percentage of their personal wealth directly to charity. Now certainly, there are some conservatives that give more than others and some liberals give more than some conservatives so the statement isn't true in every case. Some liberals give more than all others and some conservatives give more than all others. The outcome I'm hoping for are some corrections to the conventional wisdom that, who knows, will perhaps be acknowledged by a member of the other side.

Again, you needn't wait for someone to bring up "Liberals are weak on defense" to post facts about how liberal presidents and congresses have supported the troops. Or if you're conservative, you needn't wait for "Conservatives care only about the rich" and point out how conservatives have shown care and concern for the poor.

The ground rules:

1) Again, for purposes of this debate, speak in the macro. You needn't point out that Warren Buffet and Bill Gates are philanthropists when discussing who gives more to the poor. Again, what we're doing here is, hopefully, dyspelling myths about "the other side" or your side. And, once more, you needn't take on the other side. You can definitely lambast what you see as conservatism or liberalism go where it was never needed. I personally think Pelosi's brand of liberalism is exactly what the DNC should be avoiding and, to their credit, they have done a good job centering the Party.

2) Feel free to let the fur fly. Just bring some light when you bring the heat.

3) Have fun. If you're running to the mod every day, you're not doing it right.

So, in conclusion.

By posting here,

You're hopefully dyspelling myths about your side or the other side. You're doing so in the macro, fully acknowledging that there are exceptions and that one liberal or conservative being a dork somewhere does not mean that all libs or cons are dorks.

You're fully entitled to tell someone they are nuts BUT please explain why they are nuts. One-liners are what the board is made up of but they don't belong here.

Your sink is thick enough to take it and your powder is dry enough to dish it out. Again try to be topical....dyspel myths.

Goals of this thread:

Gold Standard: You change minds.
Silver Standard: You gain acknowledgement (voiced or not) that your opponent has been moved off the mark.
Bronze Standard: You make a strong case and support your argument using well respected sources. You defend your case utilizing same.
 
Hmm.

What's the difference between "speak in the macro" and "speak in broad generalizations"?
 
There are no such things as "drop bears" in Oz. It is a story told by some Auzzie blokes to visiting good looking tourist type sheilas so that they can hold their .........hands.

Greg
 
Republicans blocked the Obama administration from having subpoena power to investigate BP after the BP oil spill for months until BP could set up a defense and destroy incriminating evidence. One even apologized to BP.





So why don't we debate on this? We can't. Because USMB Republicans say it never happened. You can present footage from the Senate and they will still say it never happened. You can't debate when someone says flat out, "I don't believe it. Republicans would never do that".
 
There are no Kangaroos in Austria outside of zoos.

Greg


Isn't it Austrailia (sp?)?
th.jpeg
 
Another example of why you can't debate the right wing. Look at the Bush Tax Cuts:

Unemployment benefits not until Bush tax cuts pass Senate GOP says - CSMonitor.com

US Labor Secretary Hilda Solis, speaking Wednesday at a press conference organized by Democratic congressional leaders, said that by next spring, another 6 million unemployed workers will lose benefits if Congress does not act. “Millions of families are going to struggle to put food on the table or put gas in the gas tank,” she said.

Congress lets unemployment benefits expire What now and six other questions - Who is losing their benefits - CSMonitor.com
-----------------------------------
Obama was blackmailed. He couldn't stand to see millions of Americans being put under this kind of hardship when we know Republicans have no problem with it. When I first posted it, USMB Republicans called it lies, Republicans would never do that. Then they said the Christian Science Monitor was "left wing liberals" which of course is laughable. Then they said there were rider bills and there weren't. Finally, they just called names. And that is how right wingers debates.

And when it comes to the "right wingers give more" myth, they may give to their church, and then that church gives to other members. None of the help going outside their small community. Then is it really charity?
And what is that charity anyway? Some blankets? Some old can of creamed corn sitting in the pantry no one will eat anyway? At least Democrats are looking for ways to educate people. Something always blocked by the GOP:

"Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day; teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime."

States sued over education funding

And what do you say about people who vote for a party and know nothing about that party's policies?
 
Liberals saying most Republicans only care about big corporations when they put the brakes on the import.export bank. Which infuriated GE and Boeing

U.S. Export-Import Bank Heading Toward Closure - US News

Money speaks Boeing General Electric cut off donations to Republicans blocking Export-Import Bank - Strange Bedfellows Politics News
From the Article you posted:

Ex-Im helps U.S. exports, and returned a $679 million profit to the federal treasury last year.

House Speaker John Boehner claims to support renewal of the bank. In Boehner’s home state of Ohio, the Export-Import Bank helped 358 exporters last year, 226 of them small businesses. It guaranteed credit for $3,803 in exports by the Akron Brass Co., but also $38 million for Anglo American Hardwood.

The renewal of Ex-Im would almost certainly pass if the House Republican leadership — including Rep. Cathy McMorris Rodgers, R-Wash. –allowed a vote. Almost all 188 Democrats would support it, and 45 Republicans (including Rep. Dave Reichert, R-Wash.) have signed a letter supporting renewal. But Boehner is afraid of attempts to purge him rising out of the far-right fringe of the Republican caucus. The Speaker will not stand up to the crazies in his caucus.

-----------------------------------------
Let me make sure I understand this. The Republicans are shutting down an organization that brings in hundreds of millions of dollars a year. Helps hundreds of businesses in one state alone. And the article says the people blocking it are "crazies".

And that proves Republicans are what? Crazy? I don't get it.
 
Liberals saying most Republicans only care about big corporations when they put the brakes on the import.export bank. Which infuriated GE and Boeing

U.S. Export-Import Bank Heading Toward Closure - US News

Money speaks Boeing General Electric cut off donations to Republicans blocking Export-Import Bank - Strange Bedfellows Politics News
From the Article you posted:

Ex-Im helps U.S. exports, and returned a $679 million profit to the federal treasury last year.

House Speaker John Boehner claims to support renewal of the bank. In Boehner’s home state of Ohio, the Export-Import Bank helped 358 exporters last year, 226 of them small businesses. It guaranteed credit for $3,803 in exports by the Akron Brass Co., but also $38 million for Anglo American Hardwood.

The renewal of Ex-Im would almost certainly pass if the House Republican leadership — including Rep. Cathy McMorris Rodgers, R-Wash. –allowed a vote. Almost all 188 Democrats would support it, and 45 Republicans (including Rep. Dave Reichert, R-Wash.) have signed a letter supporting renewal. But Boehner is afraid of attempts to purge him rising out of the far-right fringe of the Republican caucus. The Speaker will not stand up to the crazies in his caucus.

-----------------------------------------
Let me make sure I understand this. The Republicans are shutting down an organization that brings in hundreds of millions of dollars a year. Helps hundreds of businesses in one state alone. And the article says the people blocking it are "crazies".

And that proves Republicans are what? Crazy? I don't get it.

Its crony capitalism, the import export is the bank of GE and Boeing they receive 87% of it.
 
Hmm.

What's the difference between "speak in the macro" and "speak in broad generalizations"?

None.

Then what's the point of fomenting fallacies?

I don't know what that means.

I do know what I mean. Like what Dean just posted before you when he says "Republicans blocked Obama". When you read it, he doesn't make a distinction between John Boenher and the newest member of the Young Republican's club at Page Community College in Arizona. Now, if I were to ask Dean, I would assume he would come back and say, "Obviously I didn't mean every single republican". My message was to acknowledge at least in your own mind that "not all liberals" feel one way about anything or "not all conseravtives" feel one way about anything or "not all Yankee fans" feel one way about anything except possibly Derek Jeter's HOF credentials.

Hope that helps you.
 
The purpose of this thread is to, hopefully, field engaging back and fourths between posters concerning "facts" that they know about theirs or "the other" side that can be shown to be wrong by a member of the other side. Nobody need bring up something to get it discussed--feel free to start us off if you like. Just speak in the macro for the purposes of this debate. For example, a lot of liberals think that conservatives do not give much to charity when there have been credible studies that show conservatives give a higher percentage of their personal wealth directly to charity. Now certainly, there are some conservatives that give more than others and some liberals give more than some conservatives so the statement isn't true in every case. Some liberals give more than all others and some conservatives give more than all others. The outcome I'm hoping for are some corrections to the conventional wisdom that, who knows, will perhaps be acknowledged by a member of the other side.

Again, you needn't wait for someone to bring up "Liberals are weak on defense" to post facts about how liberal presidents and congresses have supported the troops. Or if you're conservative, you needn't wait for "Conservatives care only about the rich" and point out how conservatives have shown care and concern for the poor.

The ground rules:

1) Again, for purposes of this debate, speak in the macro. You needn't point out that Warren Buffet and Bill Gates are philanthropists when discussing who gives more to the poor. Again, what we're doing here is, hopefully, dyspelling myths about "the other side" or your side. And, once more, you needn't take on the other side. You can definitely lambast what you see as conservatism or liberalism go where it was never needed. I personally think Pelosi's brand of liberalism is exactly what the DNC should be avoiding and, to their credit, they have done a good job centering the Party.

2) Feel free to let the fur fly. Just bring some light when you bring the heat.

3) Have fun. If you're running to the mod every day, you're not doing it right.

So, in conclusion.

By posting here,

You're hopefully dyspelling myths about your side or the other side. You're doing so in the macro, fully acknowledging that there are exceptions and that one liberal or conservative being a dork somewhere does not mean that all libs or cons are dorks.

You're fully entitled to tell someone they are nuts BUT please explain why they are nuts. One-liners are what the board is made up of but they don't belong here.

Your sink is thick enough to take it and your powder is dry enough to dish it out. Again try to be topical....dyspel myths.

Goals of this thread:

Gold Standard: You change minds.
Silver Standard: You gain acknowledgement (voiced or not) that your opponent has been moved off the mark.
Bronze Standard: You make a strong case and support your argument using well respected sources. You defend your case utilizing same.

Debunking the "Conservatives Give More to Charity" Myth.



Partisanship and Charitable Giving

Do conservatives give more to charity than liberals? Nope:

While levels of giving are roughly equivalent, liberals are much more likely to donate to secular organizations, and conservatives are more likely to donate to religious causes, especially their own congregation. ...





Economist s View Partisanship and Charitable Giving


Study: Conservatives and liberals are equally charitable, but they give to different charities

....no statistically significant relationship between peoples' political beliefs, or their partisan affiliation, and their charitable giving level.


Study Conservatives and liberals are equally charitable but they give to different charities - The Washington Post



Giving Differently: Liberals and Conservatives Have Radically Different Views of Charity

Republicans’ moral foundations are embedded in respect for authority and traditions, loyalty and purity


On the other side, Democrats’ moral foundations are rooted in equality and protection from harm, says Mittal...

Giving Differently Liberals and Conservatives Have Radically Different Views of Charity
 
Liberals saying most Republicans only care about big corporations when they put the brakes on the import.export bank. Which infuriated GE and Boeing

U.S. Export-Import Bank Heading Toward Closure - US News

Money speaks Boeing General Electric cut off donations to Republicans blocking Export-Import Bank - Strange Bedfellows Politics News


ANOTHER right winger who wants to conflate things like liberal/con and Dem/GOP. Shocking

NOT the GOP blocking it, but FARRRR right wing wack jobs (about a dozen right?) like Cruz. DOESN'T change the perception since the GOP WILL get the bill passed and Export bank will glide along!

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