extreme weather

[Old Rocks]

And we still have two months to go.

Disasters in US: An extreme and exhausting year | New England Post

The insurance company Munich Re calculated that in the first six months of the year there have been 98 natural disasters in the United States, about double the average of the 1990s.

Even before Irene, the Federal Emergency Management Agency was on pace to obliterate the record for declared disasters issued by state, reflecting both the geographic breadth and frequency of America’s problem-plagued year.

“If you weren’t in a drought, you were drowning is what it came down to,” Masters said.

Add to that, oppressive and unrelenting heat. Tens of thousands of daily weather records have been broken or tied and nearly 1,000 all-time records set, with most of them heat or rain related:

The number of natural disasters the federal government declares is purely a political issue. It's not any kind of scientific measurement. The president declares a disaster at the drop of a hate these days. It's a great excuse for spending money and buying votes.

Too funny! So, Texas burning up, the Missouri and Mississippi in flood from March to September, two medium sized cities with F-5 tornadoes going right down the middle are just political excuses to declare an emergency.

Pattycake, you are too stupid for words.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

And we still have two months to go.

Disasters in US: An extreme and exhausting year | New England Post

The insurance company Munich Re calculated that in the first six months of the year there have been 98 natural disasters in the United States, about double the average of the 1990s.

Even before Irene, the Federal Emergency Management Agency was on pace to obliterate the record for declared disasters issued by state, reflecting both the geographic breadth and frequency of America’s problem-plagued year.

“If you weren’t in a drought, you were drowning is what it came down to,” Masters said.

Add to that, oppressive and unrelenting heat. Tens of thousands of daily weather records have been broken or tied and nearly 1,000 all-time records set, with most of them heat or rain related:

The number of natural disasters the federal government declares is purely a political issue. It's not any kind of scientific measurement. The president declares a disaster at the drop of a hate these days. It's a great excuse for spending money and buying votes.

Too funny! So, Texas burning up, the Missouri and Mississippi in flood from March to September, two medium sized cities with F-5 tornadoes going right down the middle are just political excuses to declare an emergency.

Pattycake, you are too stupid for words.

Show us how your "Theory" works in a lab

Was it last years 1PPM increase in CO2 that cause all of the above?

 

[Old Rocks]

You have been shown many times by many posters here exactly how it works. The fact that you are just too stupid and politically bent to acknowledge that.

 

[editec]

extreme weather

Yup.

That's about what I expect to come from this GLOBAL WEIRDING situation we're in.


The more energy a fluxating system has (typically) the more violent the swings in that system.

I expect to see BOTH wilder wetter even sometimes COLDER winters, followed by wilder hotter summers.

I expect to see more severe droughts where droughts are the norm, more rains where rain is normal, too.

And then, if we achieve some tipping point that probably nobody can predict?

Then we might even see dramtic changes in even those patterns...changes that nobody can predict precisely

For example, places which could expect MONSOONS might not get them, and places where rains never fell, might become extrmely wet.

Our climate appears to be like a tire that's freely racing along with an increasing WOBBLE in its trajectory.

NOBODY can honestly predict how changes like these play out, folks.

The CHAOS of highly complex systems (like climate) makes really accurate predictions virtually impossible.

 

[Old Rocks]

either global warming or other factors, i think the most important reason is from humanbeing, we change the globe a lot, and hurt it to much. so the result or the revenge from nature must be there.

Mankind is pretty destructive. No doubt in my mind mankind needs to clean up its act but, until enough people decide earth is worth taking the effort to save its just going to get more polluted. When they decide they can give up the great money grab is when the changes may take place.

Unfortunately this is not going to happen until there are enough catastrophes that the cost begins to impact the 1%. As long as it is only the 99% feeling the impact, and the 1% can shield themselves, the damage will continue. And people like Sis, Walleyes, and the rest will be cheering the damage.

 

[Old Rocks]

extreme weather

Yup.

That's about what I expect to come from this GLOBAL WEIRDING situation we're in.


The more energy a fluxating system has (typically) the more violent the swings in that system.

I expect to see BOTH wilder wetter even sometimes COLDER winters, followed by wilder hotter summers.

I expect to see more severe droughts where droughts are the norm, more rains where rain is normal, too.

And then, if we achieve some tipping point that probably nobody can predict?

Then we might even see dramtic changes in even those patterns...changes that nobody can predict precisely

For example, places which could expect MONSOONS might not get them, and places where rains never fell, might become extrmely wet.

Our climate appears to be like a tire that's freely racing along with an increasing WOBBLE in its trajectory.

NOBODY can honestly predict how changes like these play out, folks.

The CHAOS of highly complex systems (like climate) makes really accurate predictions virtually impossible.

Wonderful summation of the present situation.

 

[paperview]

?... If global warming is now caused by man made inventions how would science describe the cause of the dustbowl?

Not a scientist just curious the scientific theory on why the dust bowl happened.

That actually was both man made and natural. Perfect storm of mistakes made by farmers and a drought.

What did man do to cause that drought I dont know though

Surely mankind did something to attribute to the drought or there is a scientific theory on why an extreme drought took place.

BTW, another one heading this way.

It was fairly simple to understand, and yes, it was caused in great part by man:

"Poor agricultural practices and years of sustained drought caused the Dust Bowl. Plains grasslands had been deeply plowed and planted to wheat. During the years when there was adequate rainfall, the land produced bountiful crops. But as the droughts of the early 1930s deepened, the farmers kept plowing and planting and nothing would grow. The ground cover that held the soil in place was gone."

 

[paperview]

Don't mean to cause a diversion, Old Rocks, but there was an excellent American Experience show about the Dust Bowl a while back.

You can see it all here: Surviving the Dust Bowl | American Experience | PBS Video

You can watch a portion of the beginning now (and there is a tie in to today...):

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WiM2MUnJ0CQ"]Surviving The Dust Bowl {1 of 4} - YouTube[/ame]

 

[gslack]

extreme weather

Yup.

That's about what I expect to come from this GLOBAL WEIRDING situation we're in.


The more energy a fluxating system has (typically) the more violent the swings in that system.

I expect to see BOTH wilder wetter even sometimes COLDER winters, followed by wilder hotter summers.

I expect to see more severe droughts where droughts are the norm, more rains where rain is normal, too.

And then, if we achieve some tipping point that probably nobody can predict?

Then we might even see dramtic changes in even those patterns...changes that nobody can predict precisely

For example, places which could expect MONSOONS might not get them, and places where rains never fell, might become extrmely wet.

Our climate appears to be like a tire that's freely racing along with an increasing WOBBLE in its trajectory.

NOBODY can honestly predict how changes like these play out, folks.

The CHAOS of highly complex systems (like climate) makes really accurate predictions virtually impossible.

I'm sorry but with all the continued changing of names and vernacular, only furthers my belief in this being nonsense.

"global wierding" is a term from Hunter Lovens from the Rocky mountain institute, and its his way of justifying the lack of compliance in predictions and climate model claims, with real world data and occurrences.

If it isn't warming its cooling or staying the same(which it rarely does for long) and using that kind of logic anything is proof of climate change. Its an excuse they think can cover anything.. I call it nonsense and a deliberate attempt to sell this no matter what..

 

[gslack]

That actually was both man made and natural. Perfect storm of mistakes made by farmers and a drought.

What did man do to cause that drought I dont know though

Surely mankind did something to attribute to the drought or there is a scientific theory on why an extreme drought took place.

BTW, another one heading this way.

It was fairly simple to understand, and yes, it was caused in great part by man:

"Poor agricultural practices and years of sustained drought caused the Dust Bowl. Plains grasslands had been deeply plowed and planted to wheat. During the years when there was adequate rainfall, the land produced bountiful crops. But as the droughts of the early 1930s deepened, the farmers kept plowing and planting and nothing would grow. The ground cover that held the soil in place was gone."

How does one go from the drought being the root cause to it being an equal share with man? No matter how you look at it, the root cause was the droughts. Mans farming practices back then were not the best of practices but they fit the standards, conditions and knowledge of the times. Had the droughts not been, and the windstorms so prevalent, than the tilled soil wouldn't have been so dry to allow the fast erosion..

I'm sorry I don't understand the desire to self deprecate.. Man was a factor, but the root cause was drought and wind. I am just not ready to make every unfortunate event mans fault...

 

[paperview]

Surely mankind did something to attribute to the drought or there is a scientific theory on why an extreme drought took place.

BTW, another one heading this way.

It was fairly simple to understand, and yes, it was caused in great part by man:

"Poor agricultural practices and years of sustained drought caused the Dust Bowl. Plains grasslands had been deeply plowed and planted to wheat. During the years when there was adequate rainfall, the land produced bountiful crops. But as the droughts of the early 1930s deepened, the farmers kept plowing and planting and nothing would grow. The ground cover that held the soil in place was gone."

How does one go from the drought being the root cause to it being an equal share with man? No matter how you look at it, the root cause was the droughts. Mans farming practices back then were not the best of practices but they fit the standards, conditions and knowledge of the times. Had the droughts not been, and the windstorms so prevalent, than the tilled soil wouldn't have been so dry to allow the fast erosion..

I'm sorry I don't understand the desire to self deprecate.. Man was a factor, but the root cause was drought and wind. I am just not ready to make every unfortunate event mans fault...

A little more study on the matter for you might be in order.

Removal of the ground cover holding the soil in place for thousands of year was a very good portion of it. It was the glue, so to speak, that held the topsoil down.

As mentioned, that Documentary is an excellent place to start.

 

[gslack]

It was fairly simple to understand, and yes, it was caused in great part by man:

"Poor agricultural practices and years of sustained drought caused the Dust Bowl. Plains grasslands had been deeply plowed and planted to wheat. During the years when there was adequate rainfall, the land produced bountiful crops. But as the droughts of the early 1930s deepened, the farmers kept plowing and planting and nothing would grow. The ground cover that held the soil in place was gone."

How does one go from the drought being the root cause to it being an equal share with man? No matter how you look at it, the root cause was the droughts. Mans farming practices back then were not the best of practices but they fit the standards, conditions and knowledge of the times. Had the droughts not been, and the windstorms so prevalent, than the tilled soil wouldn't have been so dry to allow the fast erosion..

I'm sorry I don't understand the desire to self deprecate.. Man was a factor, but the root cause was drought and wind. I am just not ready to make every unfortunate event mans fault...

A little more study on the matter for you might be in order.

Removal of the ground cover holding the soil in place for thousands of year was a very good portion of it. It was the glue, so to speak, that held the topsoil down.

As mentioned, that Documentary is an excellent place to start.

Pardon me but "A little more study on the matter for you might be in order." ????

You either didn't read what I wrote or misunderstood it... "a very good portion of it..." Is not the root cause of it.. I never said man was not part of it, I said he wasn't the root cause.

Again, many people tend to say man did it and any involvement in it makes it mans fault. Man being a part of it, and man being the cause are not the same thing...

EDIT: We mustn't forget what generally happens to areas with extensive long-term drought. First, the soil dries which of course kills off more and more vegetation. Then as that vegetation dies the roots which forms that "glue" you mentioned die. The soil either becomes hard baked earth or granular particles, depending on its composition and speed of that drying and heat involved. With no "glue" left to hold it down, the soil would still be vulnerable to erosion...

 

[CrusaderFrank]

You have been shown many times by many posters here exactly how it works. The fact that you are just too stupid and politically bent to acknowledge that.

You have never ever not once show a laboratory experiment that shows how your flawed "theory" works!

You linked to a college experiment in Louisiana that put a wisp of CO2 in a control tank but you never posted the results! Why is that? Why didn't you post the results?

I called the professor, Jackass. Did you?

So, Enviromarxists, what did you non-existent experiment show? Is there a tipping point? Is it 20PPM CO2? 2PPM?

Give us the results of your never posted non existent experiments

 

[paperview]

How does one go from the drought being the root cause to it being an equal share with man? No matter how you look at it, the root cause was the droughts. Mans farming practices back then were not the best of practices but they fit the standards, conditions and knowledge of the times. Had the droughts not been, and the windstorms so prevalent, than the tilled soil wouldn't have been so dry to allow the fast erosion..

I'm sorry I don't understand the desire to self deprecate.. Man was a factor, but the root cause was drought and wind. I am just not ready to make every unfortunate event mans fault...

A little more study on the matter for you might be in order.

Removal of the ground cover holding the soil in place for thousands of year was a very good portion of it. It was the glue, so to speak, that held the topsoil down.

As mentioned, that Documentary is an excellent place to start.

Pardon me but "A little more study on the matter for you might be in order." ????

You either didn't read what I wrote or misunderstood it... "a very good portion of it..." Is not the root cause of it.. I never said man was not part of it, I said he wasn't the root cause.

Again, many people tend to say man did it and any involvement in it makes it mans fault. Man being a part of it, and man being the cause are not the same thing...

Actually, it was. The Indians for thousands of years did not have that problem, because they knew that removal of that glue - that soil that sealed the grasses was the key.
The area had gone through plenty of drought before, but nothing like what happened when they removed wholesale what sealed the soil in.

 

[gslack]

A little more study on the matter for you might be in order.

Removal of the ground cover holding the soil in place for thousands of year was a very good portion of it. It was the glue, so to speak, that held the topsoil down.

As mentioned, that Documentary is an excellent place to start.

Pardon me but "A little more study on the matter for you might be in order." ????

You either didn't read what I wrote or misunderstood it... "a very good portion of it..." Is not the root cause of it.. I never said man was not part of it, I said he wasn't the root cause.

Again, many people tend to say man did it and any involvement in it makes it mans fault. Man being a part of it, and man being the cause are not the same thing...

Actually, it was. The Indians for thousands of years did not have that problem, because they knew that removal of that glue - that soil that sealed the grasses was the key.
The area had gone through plenty of drought before, but nothing like what happened when they removed wholesale what sealed the soil in.

Please read my edit above..

Again, a drought kills the plants that make the root systems that form that "glue". Whether it were cleared and tilled, or whether the drought killed the "glue" in those wind storms at the time erosion would have taken place either way. man most certainly helped make it worse, but calling him the cause is a bit unfair..

The Native Americans were a different culture with different needs. They lived mostly nomadic lifestyles. Not the same kind of conditions we live in. If you want to argue the merits of nomadic cultures over our modern ways of life, that is a different discussion. This discussion is on what this modern culture we all live in played in the Dust Bowl. Whether or not the Native Americans would have had a different time were we not around is irrelevant to the point.

The fact is we DID farm it. All of us reaped the benefit of it (including modern native americans), and all of us play some factor in its inherent good and bad. But that does not make it MANS FAULT. it makes man part of the problem just as I said before..