Ex-U.S. Arms Hunter Kay Says No Stockpiles in Iraq

[jimnyc]

Originally posted by spillmind
jim, i'd like to have a conversation with ya here, but if you can't understand:



...then i can't even begin to debate. you'll point out facts of his speech and then avoid any reference of the WMD claims as a choice of statements to defend. WHAT A COINCIDENCE!

give me one good reason that an independant investigation is not a good idea, especially when so many have paid with their lives?

i'm not into conspircacies, i just know human nature, and it doesn't lend me to trust these people like you have.

:sausage::whip3:

Do you even realize what you're saying? "I don't know exactly what he was referring to, but I know it was a lie!"

When Bush received intel and passed it along to congress, as far as he knew he WAS passing along facts. Let me help you with a couple of definitions:

fact
2.a - Something demonstrated to exist or known to have existed
2.c - Something believed to be true or real

Now show me that he didn't believe the intel he received and I'll be the first to admit he lied.

The current administration is completely capable of investigating why the intel they received didn't add up. If it turns out to be an independent investigation, that's fine. If they do it internally, that's fine with me too.

 

[DKSuddeth]

the problem with not having an independent investigation would be somewhat similar to letting andy fastow investigate the enron collapse

 

[jimnyc]

Originally posted by DKSuddeth
the problem with not having an independent investigation would be somewhat similar to letting andy fastow investigate the enron collapse

I don't believe so. In that scenario you are having an individual investigate his own company.

It's not the administration that needs to be investigated here, but rather why they were given what appears to be faulty intel.

 

[Annie]

JimmyC you're correct here. Even John Kerry was heard to say they better be careful pushing for an independent prosector on this. The analysis burned not only GW; but Clinton and the Congress.

Combine that with the fact that all Western intel services and those from the ME that shared, in all likelihood they and Saddam were hoodwinked by Iraqi internal problems. Thus, they CIA has to work at how to prevent that again. My guess would be better humint.

 

[jon_forward]

that seems to be where the fault,if any, lays... have to agree with you...better humint...my bro in the corps feels the same way

 

[spillmind]

jim, you are in FLAT OUT DENIAL.

yes, it's like ahnold investigating his own groping allegations.

if the investigation turns out to conclude that the whole adming knew it was hyped up, but still ran with it like it was reality- knowing full well it wasn't... why in the hell would they go public with that? and dig their own grave in an election year??!!! you're not making any sense at all!

Do you even realize what you're saying?

YES, and stop clinging to your tangents in a futile attempt to EVADE THE ARGUEMENT.

if you can't even manage to go out on a limb, and figure that the 'facts' he was referring to in is speech was the numbers, and claims about those very WMD statements he made moments before that statement, it would appear and does appear you are trying to pull a bush admin on this one as well.

Now show me that he didn't believe the intel he received and I'll be the first to admit he lied.

show me and INDEPENDANT INVESTIGATION, and i'm sure it'll be proven. come on, what's there to be afraid of? there's nothing to hide, right?

why do you keep trying to cover up for this guy that lets our people die every single day for a cause that that is HIGHLY QUESTIONABLE???

 

[jimnyc]

You have nothing, Spillmind, nothing at all. Please do come back again when you have some substance to share with us.

 

[Moi]

Originally posted by spillmind

why do you keep trying to cover up for this guy that lets our people die every single day for a cause that that is HIGHLY QUESTIONABLE???

People die every day for no cause at all. I'd rather they die for this cause than most every other (or none). The fact remains that even if the intelligence used was faulty, you still have to prove that thousands of people knew it was false...not a likely scenario.

Even David Kay admitted that the intelligence showed a danger in clear and convincing terms. How can you use his remarks, taken out of context, to prove Pres. Bush like when even David Kay doesn't believe that.

laughable.

 

[jimnyc]

Bush May Back Iraq Intelligence Panel

WASHINGTON - The White House is considering endorsing the creation of an independent commission that would investigate whether the United States used faulty intelligence information when it decided to go to war in Iraq (news - web sites), government sources said Saturday.

They said a statement of support from the White House could come this week.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm...ap_on_go_pr_wh/bush_intelligence_commission_4

 

[jon_forward]

well I'll be god-damned...WTF is up with this??? an honest administration...and an open one too....who woulda ever thought...

 

[spillmind]

You have nothing, Spillmind, nothing at all.

looks like 'nothing' turned into a ANOTHER 180°!!!!

but i'm *sure* you'll say it was only a 120º or a 90°

bush got a clue. if he has nothing to hide, this should be no big deal! i'll expect you bushies to follow suit, turn around and support his position shift on this one too- like good little drones!

so, to summarize:

it's NOT A LIE when you hard sell a premise for WAR with 'faulty' information passing this info off as 'FACTS', even if it was totally FALSE- as long as it was with the very best of intentions? and it didn't come directly from his mouth?

what a great, honest, honorable man bush is! he can do no wrong!

it's amazing to me how you bushies can't even theorize what it would have been like trying to make a case for war without the WMD claim. you can't because you don't want to face that truth.

 

[jimnyc]

You've returned and offered absolutely nothing yet again. Why do you waste bandwidth? Are you addicted to looking foolish here?

Buy some stock in reynolds wrap, you'll be dealing with Bush for the next 4 1/2 years!

 

[jon_forward]

christallmighty spilly...take a pill , hell take a hand full...whats with the lies BS....OPEN YOUR EYES, TAKE A DEEP BREATH...and get out of the sun for awhile

 

[spillmind]

stop crying guys, it doesn't become you.

getting you cats to admit i was right is like pulling teeth!

i've been wrong before, but here- i am not. in the meantime, just insult me and don't respond to perfectly legitamite hypothesis and speculation, in the name of your own sad GOP bias.

get over it.

 

[jimnyc]

Originally posted by spillmind
stop crying guys, it doesn't become you.

getting you cats to admit i was right is like pulling teeth!

i've been wrong before, but here- i am not. in the meantime, just insult me and don't respond to perfectly legitamite hypothesis and speculation, in the name of your own sad GOP bias.

get over it.

Perfectly legitimate hypothesis and speculation? How about you just deal with the FACTS. You came with nothing, you've posted nothing & you still offer nothing. Bush will be in charge of your country for the next 4 1/2 years, deal with it.

 

[The Worried One]

The Bush Administration went into office knowing they wanted to invade Iraq. This war is nothing but to try and finish what Bush's father started! If this was about weapons of mass destruction...where are they? If this is about liberating the iraqi people from cruel treatment...why not go into Saudi Arabia too? The fact is, the bush administration is not trying to protect us or the people of iraq, but of the interests of the multi-billion dollar corporations (who happen to be funding his re-election campaign) and the oil companies. And we're not invading Saudi Arabia because of the oil we get!

This war is not justified!

Our soldiers are fighting another vietnam...lets just pray for a different result.

 

[insein]

Originally posted by The Worried One
The Bush Administration went into office knowing they wanted to invade Iraq. This war is nothing but to try and finish what Bush's father started! If this was about weapons of mass destruction...where are they? If this is about liberating the iraqi people from cruel treatment...why not go into Saudi Arabia too? The fact is, the bush administration is not trying to protect us or the people of iraq, but of the interests of the multi-billion dollar corporations (who happen to be funding his re-election campaign) and the oil companies. And we're not invading Saudi Arabia because of the oil we get!

This war is not justified!

Our soldiers are fighting another vietnam...lets just pray for a different result.

Your obviously someone udner a new name because you sure dug this thread out of the ash heap. But here ya go.

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2004/4/17/141224.shtml
WMD's in Syria you say? Jordan foiled a plot to kill 80,000? Syria got them from where? Iraq? No they don't have any WMDs.

http://www.debka.com/article.php?aid=482
Whats that? Debka said that awhile ago? Hmmm...

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,109338,00.html
Whats that? Al Queda terror cell in iraq? Hmmm that can't be because Al Queda and Iraq don't like each other and have nothing to do with one another.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,779359,00.html
Whats that terror Camp reported in 2002 byt a Liberal newspaper? Imagine that.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/04/26/jordan.terror/
Hmmm even CNN has shown that these attackers received training in Iraq and weapons from Syria.


My standard response for Idiots who say this was a war for Haliburton or for Daddy Bush and nothing to do with WMd's. Read and it weap. Goodbye.

 

[The Worried One]

If there were really WMD in Iraq, we would have found them. An excuse that they were shipped away before we could find them is rediculous...what do you think satalites are for??? And another thing, if there really were WMD, why did Bush's reason for invading iraq change to freeing the iraqi people??? Think about it, as each reason is discovered to be a lie, they make another one.

 

[jimnyc]

Originally posted by The Worried One
And another thing, if there really were WMD, why did Bush's reason for invading iraq change to freeing the iraqi people???

Change?

Freeing the Iraqi people from oppression was part of the resolutions since 1991. You know, the very resolutions that Saddam and his regime failed to abide by for over 12 years. I suggest you read them.

 

[The Worried One]

Bush himself told the American people the reason to go into Iraq was because they had weapons of mass destruction and had the capabilities to use them in a matter of minutes...not because the people there were being tortured (that sounds familiar with us being there now), and massacred. His story changed. To say we've been trying to free them from opression since the first Gulf war is not true, and we weren't trying to do that in the beginning of this war either. Now all of a sudden, when no weapons are found, we're freeing the iraqi people...how noble of us!!!! Btw, 3 of ur 5 sites were unable to be accessed.