EPA to Crack Down on Farm Dust

[Jeremy]

EPA to Crack Down on Farm Dust - News9.com - Oklahoma City, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports |

Oh ... my .... fucking .... God.

 

[Gunny]

Epa = ss.

 

[Nate]

Now how in the hell does one measure the dust in the air?

 

[Samson]

Now how in the hell does one measure the dust in the air?

I think they need to measure the dust on the ground.

I'm not sure if Homosapiens will survive unless we get rid of all the dirt.

 

[Jeremy]

Logo looks a lot like...

 

[Gremlin]

Actually, the proposed change would probably make the rule less stringent, not more. The current rule of 150 ug/m3 has the requirement that you can't exceed the limit "more than once per yr on average over a 3-yr period". This limit was set for the first time (for PM10 specifically) in 1987. The proposed change would lower the acceptable limit to 85 ug/m3, however it would also change the compliance to a 98th percentile/24hr method (similar to the requirement for small - PM2.5 - particles). This would allow for 21 violations over 3 years before a site was deemed out of compliance.

 

[Nosmo King]

Now how in the hell does one measure the dust in the air?

By volumetric air sampling. Calibrate a low flow air pump to draw say 30 Lpm (liters per minute) and extrapolate that to the equivalent of what a human inhales in a typical eight hour period (approx. 1200 Lpm). Use a filter media that would trap and isolate any particular compound (say nitrogen found in fertilizer or organic compounds) and analyze the results.

The same technique used to measure the amount of asbestos fibers in the air.

 

[Nosmo King]

Logo looks a lot like...

Not too big on a healthy environment eh, Jeremy? I know. Let's burn some more rivers in your part of the country and maybe you'll see the reasons for wanting to preserve air, water and soil for ourselves and our posterity.

 

[Jeremy]

Logo looks a lot like...

Not too big on a healthy environment eh, Jeremy? I know. Let's burn some more rivers in your part of the country and maybe you'll see the reasons for wanting to preserve air, water and soil for ourselves and our posterity.

Oh pa-lease!

 

[Nosmo King]

Logo looks a lot like...

Not too big on a healthy environment eh, Jeremy? I know. Let's burn some more rivers in your part of the country and maybe you'll see the reasons for wanting to preserve air, water and soil for ourselves and our posterity.

Oh pa-lease!

So Americans should be free to pollute however and wherever they see fit? You think the EPA is a communist front? We should have no checks on what type of pollution happens? Can you imagine a steel mill? Think of it. Imagine the pollution a steel mill generates. Can you? Acids, benzene, lead, manganese, electric arc furnace dust. Can you imagine that? What about a power plant? Can you imagine the pollution coming from a power plant? How about a paper mill. Can you imagine the chemicals used to make different grades of paper?

Now, think about the fertilizers, pesticides, herbicides and other agricultural chemicals used on a farm. That's the stuff in the dust some folk find unhealthy for people to be exposed to at certain levels. Maybe, just maybe it would be a good idea to get a firm grasp on: how much of that dust is being thrown into our lungs and onto our skin and; what's in that dust and; how much of that bad stuff can we be exposed to without adverse health affects.

Gee! Sounds like something right out of the Kremlin, right?

Think about it. think real hard.

 

[westwall]

Well let's take a look at one other governmental environmental organization shall we? I refer you to the Californai Air Resources Board which required all gasoline in the State of California to be mixed with MTBE an oxygenate to reduce air pollution from motor vehicles.

Many, many reputable scientists told them repeatedly that MTBE was a bad compound and should not be added to the fuel. there was a database of problems built up over almost 25 years where MTBE was used experimentally but the negs outweighed the positives.

CARB said screw you we want it so it was introduced statewide and was marching across the nation when all of a sudden it was found that water wells throughout California were contaminated by MTBE and it was MUCH MORE DIFFICULT to deal with than the air pollution. Within 5 years MTBE was gone but the effects remain. ALL OF SANTA MONICAS wells are shut down. Most of Lake Tahoe's wells were likewise closed. Thousands of wells statewide have had to be closed for an indefinite period due to MTBE pollution,
MANDATED BY A STATE ENVIRONMENTAL AGENCY!

Now EPA is trying to regulate CO2 which is essential to life, they want to control dust from farms (how about all that other dust from the dirt) how many more environmental and economic disasters are you going to allow before you figure out that they don't know what they're doing?

 

[Gremlin]

they want to control dust from farms (how about all that other dust from the dirt)

No. They have been regulating dust since 1971. They are just thinking about maybe possibly changing how they go about it. (The Draft says that staying with the current limit of 150 ug/m3 for PM10 that has been in place since 1987 is perfectly alright too.)

 

[Nosmo King]

Well let's take a look at one other governmental environmental organization shall we? I refer you to the Californai Air Resources Board which required all gasoline in the State of California to be mixed with MTBE an oxygenate to reduce air pollution from motor vehicles.

Many, many reputable scientists told them repeatedly that MTBE was a bad compound and should not be added to the fuel. there was a database of problems built up over almost 25 years where MTBE was used experimentally but the negs outweighed the positives.

CARB said screw you we want it so it was introduced statewide and was marching across the nation when all of a sudden it was found that water wells throughout California were contaminated by MTBE and it was MUCH MORE DIFFICULT to deal with than the air pollution. Within 5 years MTBE was gone but the effects remain. ALL OF SANTA MONICAS wells are shut down. Most of Lake Tahoe's wells were likewise closed. Thousands of wells statewide have had to be closed for an indefinite period due to MTBE pollution,
MANDATED BY A STATE ENVIRONMENTAL AGENCY!

Now EPA is trying to regulate CO2 which is essential to life, they want to control dust from farms (how about all that other dust from the dirt) how many more environmental and economic disasters are you going to allow before you figure out that they don't know what they're doing?

Wait a minute. Let's examine the 'rationale' you used to indict environmental regulations. The California agency made a mistake regarding MTBE and this equates to incompetence among all environmental regulators and regulations? By that standard, if a state puts a person in prison on trumped up charges, all state and federal prisons should be shut down because one state agency made a mistake.

Care to try again?

 

[Jeremy]

Not too big on a healthy environment eh, Jeremy? I know. Let's burn some more rivers in your part of the country and maybe you'll see the reasons for wanting to preserve air, water and soil for ourselves and our posterity.

Oh pa-lease!

So Americans should be free to pollute however and wherever they see fit? You think the EPA is a communist front? We should have no checks on what type of pollution happens? Can you imagine a steel mill? Think of it. Imagine the pollution a steel mill generates. Can you? Acids, benzene, lead, manganese, electric arc furnace dust. Can you imagine that? What about a power plant? Can you imagine the pollution coming from a power plant? How about a paper mill. Can you imagine the chemicals used to make different grades of paper?

Now, think about the fertilizers, pesticides, herbicides and other agricultural chemicals used on a farm. That's the stuff in the dust some folk find unhealthy for people to be exposed to at certain levels. Maybe, just maybe it would be a good idea to get a firm grasp on: how much of that dust is being thrown into our lungs and onto our skin and; what's in that dust and; how much of that bad stuff can we be exposed to without adverse health affects.

Gee! Sounds like something right out of the Kremlin, right?

Think about it. think real hard.

Your such a fucking simpleton. I'm surprised your brain has enough function to keep your heart beating.
Let's see if I can grasp your logic....
I don't support PETA. So I must be for the killing of puppies and kittens.
I don't support NOW. So I must support beating women and repealing the 19th amendment.
I don't support the UN. So I must support a world of 'every nation for itself'.
I don't waste my money on organic because I think pesticides are YUMMY!!
I don't support Obama. So of course I MUST be a RACIST!!

Get a life.

 

[Nosmo King]

Oh pa-lease!

So Americans should be free to pollute however and wherever they see fit? You think the EPA is a communist front? We should have no checks on what type of pollution happens? Can you imagine a steel mill? Think of it. Imagine the pollution a steel mill generates. Can you? Acids, benzene, lead, manganese, electric arc furnace dust. Can you imagine that? What about a power plant? Can you imagine the pollution coming from a power plant? How about a paper mill. Can you imagine the chemicals used to make different grades of paper?

Now, think about the fertilizers, pesticides, herbicides and other agricultural chemicals used on a farm. That's the stuff in the dust some folk find unhealthy for people to be exposed to at certain levels. Maybe, just maybe it would be a good idea to get a firm grasp on: how much of that dust is being thrown into our lungs and onto our skin and; what's in that dust and; how much of that bad stuff can we be exposed to without adverse health affects.

Gee! Sounds like something right out of the Kremlin, right?

Think about it. think real hard.

Your such a fucking simpleton. I'm surprised your brain has enough function to keep your heart beating.
Let's see if I can grasp your logic....
I don't support PETA. So I must be for the killing of puppies and kittens.
I don't support NOW. So I must support beating women and repealing the 19th amendment.
I don't support the UN. So I must support a world of 'every nation for itself'.
I don't waste my money on organic because I think pesticides are YUMMY!!
I don't support Obama. So of course I MUST be a RACIST!!

Get a life.

Well, you cannot grasp logic if those are the conclusions you drew. You sound rather paranoid and frustrated. Is this due to the lack of insight or are you just naturally goofy?

 

[westwall]

Well let's take a look at one other governmental environmental organization shall we? I refer you to the Californai Air Resources Board which required all gasoline in the State of California to be mixed with MTBE an oxygenate to reduce air pollution from motor vehicles.

Many, many reputable scientists told them repeatedly that MTBE was a bad compound and should not be added to the fuel. there was a database of problems built up over almost 25 years where MTBE was used experimentally but the negs outweighed the positives.

CARB said screw you we want it so it was introduced statewide and was marching across the nation when all of a sudden it was found that water wells throughout California were contaminated by MTBE and it was MUCH MORE DIFFICULT to deal with than the air pollution. Within 5 years MTBE was gone but the effects remain. ALL OF SANTA MONICAS wells are shut down. Most of Lake Tahoe's wells were likewise closed. Thousands of wells statewide have had to be closed for an indefinite period due to MTBE pollution,
MANDATED BY A STATE ENVIRONMENTAL AGENCY!

Now EPA is trying to regulate CO2 which is essential to life, they want to control dust from farms (how about all that other dust from the dirt) how many more environmental and economic disasters are you going to allow before you figure out that they don't know what they're doing?

Wait a minute. Let's examine the 'rationale' you used to indict environmental regulations. The California agency made a mistake regarding MTBE and this equates to incompetence among all environmental regulators and regulations? By that standard, if a state puts a person in prison on trumped up charges, all state and federal prisons should be shut down because one state agency made a mistake.

Care to try again?

Not at all. What it does say is the prosecutors who IGNORED the exculpatory evidence to illegaly convict the innocent person should in their turn be convicted of a crime and sentenced to hard time for violating their code of ethics and for the very real crime of false imprisonment. Care to try again.

 

[westwall]

So Americans should be free to pollute however and wherever they see fit? You think the EPA is a communist front? We should have no checks on what type of pollution happens? Can you imagine a steel mill? Think of it. Imagine the pollution a steel mill generates. Can you? Acids, benzene, lead, manganese, electric arc furnace dust. Can you imagine that? What about a power plant? Can you imagine the pollution coming from a power plant? How about a paper mill. Can you imagine the chemicals used to make different grades of paper?

Now, think about the fertilizers, pesticides, herbicides and other agricultural chemicals used on a farm. That's the stuff in the dust some folk find unhealthy for people to be exposed to at certain levels. Maybe, just maybe it would be a good idea to get a firm grasp on: how much of that dust is being thrown into our lungs and onto our skin and; what's in that dust and; how much of that bad stuff can we be exposed to without adverse health affects.

Gee! Sounds like something right out of the Kremlin, right?

Think about it. think real hard.

Your such a fucking simpleton. I'm surprised your brain has enough function to keep your heart beating.
Let's see if I can grasp your logic....
I don't support PETA. So I must be for the killing of puppies and kittens.
I don't support NOW. So I must support beating women and repealing the 19th amendment.
I don't support the UN. So I must support a world of 'every nation for itself'.
I don't waste my money on organic because I think pesticides are YUMMY!!
I don't support Obama. So of course I MUST be a RACIST!!

Get a life.

Well, you cannot grasp logic if those are the conclusions you drew. You sound rather paranoid and frustrated. Is this due to the lack of insight or are you just naturally goofy?

Actually he describes your style of argumentation quite well.

 

[Chris]

they want to control dust from farms (how about all that other dust from the dirt)

No. They have been regulating dust since 1971. They are just thinking about maybe possibly changing how they go about it. (The Draft says that staying with the current limit of 150 ug/m3 for PM10 that has been in place since 1987 is perfectly alright too.)

Don't bother them with the facts.

Let them enjoy their wing nut fantasy.

 

[Nosmo King]

Well let's take a look at one other governmental environmental organization shall we? I refer you to the Californai Air Resources Board which required all gasoline in the State of California to be mixed with MTBE an oxygenate to reduce air pollution from motor vehicles.

Many, many reputable scientists told them repeatedly that MTBE was a bad compound and should not be added to the fuel. there was a database of problems built up over almost 25 years where MTBE was used experimentally but the negs outweighed the positives.

CARB said screw you we want it so it was introduced statewide and was marching across the nation when all of a sudden it was found that water wells throughout California were contaminated by MTBE and it was MUCH MORE DIFFICULT to deal with than the air pollution. Within 5 years MTBE was gone but the effects remain. ALL OF SANTA MONICAS wells are shut down. Most of Lake Tahoe's wells were likewise closed. Thousands of wells statewide have had to be closed for an indefinite period due to MTBE pollution,
MANDATED BY A STATE ENVIRONMENTAL AGENCY!

Now EPA is trying to regulate CO2 which is essential to life, they want to control dust from farms (how about all that other dust from the dirt) how many more environmental and economic disasters are you going to allow before you figure out that they don't know what they're doing?

Wait a minute. Let's examine the 'rationale' you used to indict environmental regulations. The California agency made a mistake regarding MTBE and this equates to incompetence among all environmental regulators and regulations? By that standard, if a state puts a person in prison on trumped up charges, all state and federal prisons should be shut down because one state agency made a mistake.

Care to try again?

Not at all. What it does say is the prosecutors who IGNORED the exculpatory evidence to illegaly convict the innocent person should in their turn be convicted of a crime and sentenced to hard time for violating their code of ethics and for the very real crime of false imprisonment. Care to try again.

Fine. Environmental regulators should be held to the same standard. Rather than indict all regulators and regulations for the mistakes of one agency, all regulators and regulations should be promulgated through public hearings and scientific input. Not some extreme political agenda that says everything a government does is, by default, an infringement on personal liberties.

 

[westwall]

Wait a minute. Let's examine the 'rationale' you used to indict environmental regulations. The California agency made a mistake regarding MTBE and this equates to incompetence among all environmental regulators and regulations? By that standard, if a state puts a person in prison on trumped up charges, all state and federal prisons should be shut down because one state agency made a mistake.

Care to try again?

Not at all. What it does say is the prosecutors who IGNORED the exculpatory evidence to illegaly convict the innocent person should in their turn be convicted of a crime and sentenced to hard time for violating their code of ethics and for the very real crime of false imprisonment. Care to try again.

Fine. Environmental regulators should be held to the same standard. Rather than indict all regulators and regulations for the mistakes of one agency, all regulators and regulations should be promulgated through public hearings and scientific input. Not some extreme political agenda that says everything a government does is, by default, an infringement on personal liberties.

If it sounds like an infringement it is likely an infringment no? As far as the CARB bureaucrats, yes they should be brought up on criminal charges but that will never happen. Sadly. However your contention that government is only there to protect you is proveably false.
Regulations are not things that should be rushed into. Regulations that will have far reaching consequences (especially those unintended ones) should be very well thought out. Heavilly researched by BOTH SIDES with ALL evidence out in the open for all to see.

Then and only then can you have a regulation that ALL will benefit from. So far the country is only getting one side and that side stands to gain a tremendous amount of control and wealth from the regulations they want to impose.